[blackjack21]

People are coming to the realization that the lockdown was not about flattening the curve. Something else is going on. I think it's basically a dry run for the Green New Deal, where people don't get to drive cars, fly in planes, etc. As I've said to many of you before, I'm probably the greenest person here. So the lockdown has had a minimal impact on my life. Others, not so much.

This article notes that the lockdowns are clearly not about flattening the curve, as that is already accomplished.

They Told Us Lockdowns Were About Flattening the Curve. They Lied.

We do not have a vaccine or a cure, and won't for some time. Maintaining social distancing and wearing masks in public spaces is the only viable option.

Even Buffet has sold his airline stocks, since it is not possible to socially distance on commercial airliners with a flight at capacity, and it is not possible to make money on airlines if they are less than 75% of capacity.

My North Carolina county is completely out of the woods…

We had nine cases here and no deaths.

Nine cases.

Zero deaths.

We’re still locked down, even though there’s a full-blown medical center in my county.

Frankly, it doesn't make much sense outside of metropolitan areas to lock down. Wearing masks and social distancing suffices.

Frankly, I'm not sure lockdown in metropolitan areas make sense because ventilation in high rise buildings connects all units, especially the exhaust ports for bathrooms, gas dryers, and kitchen vents. If you can smell the neighbor smoking a cigarette a few floors down, you can get coronavirus from them too.

However, for most non-urban areas, this lockdown makes little economic sense. If you want to save every life, it's time to ban cigarettes, automobiles, alcohol, motocycles, skateboards, and plan on locking everyone down every flu season from here to kingdom come.

[late]

Love the stupid!

New Zealand beat it.

We didn't because Trump never actually did a proper lockdown, and has screwed this up many times.

You bought it, now own it..

[blackjack21]

New Zealand beat it.

New Zealand has low population density and it's super easy to cut it off from the rest of the world. Those policies might even work in Auckland and Wellington. Try those policies in New York City and see where that gets you.

You will keep trying to blame others for your blatant failure.

Oh? Coronavirus is my fault now? Exactly how am I supposed to be responsible for Coronavirus and have somehow failed? I work at home. I have since 2012, and on and off since 2003 or so. Other than not going out to a restaurant for lunch, little has changed for me.

Dude. You're seriously losing it.

[Godstud]

Your fantasy is flawed, @blackjack21. The facts show otherwise.

Thailand has a far higher population density than USA. 68 million people in a country smaller than Texas. Explain why lockdowns have worked here, so effectively(maybe because they actually started them quickly). I'll bet you can't.

[late]

New Zealand has low population density and it's super easy to cut it off from the rest of the world. Those policies might even work in Auckland and Wellington. Try those policies in New York City and see where that gets you.


Oh? Coronavirus is my fault now? Exactly how am I supposed to be responsible for Coronavirus and have somehow failed? I work at home. I have since 2012, and on and off since 2003 or so. Other than not going out to a restaurant for lunch, little has changed for me.

Point is, that medical science knows that it's doing, and you do not.

Point is, most of the people that died didn't have to. Because of Trumps many failures. In addition to the incompetence and the crazy, Trump doesn't want to piss off his Cult.

That would be you.

[blackjack21]

Point is, that medical science knows that it's doing, and you do not.

Uh, no they don't. They couldn't prevent coronavirus, can't cure it, and don't have a vaccine for it. Experts said there was little risk of it coming to the US. Then they went full tilt the other way. Their death projections were off by orders of magnitude even factoring in a lockdown. If you want credibility, you should be within the margin of error. If you want forgiveness, you should be just outside the margin of error. When you are off by more than two standard deviations, you frankly don't know what the fuck you're talking about. They don't know what they're talking about. They outsourced their supply chains to China, and when they didn't have enough masks, they told the public to stop wearing masks and that doing so could actually harm them and cited weak studies that wearing masks might actually make them sick. When they finally had enough masks, the government put in force orders to wear masks when in grocery stores. Trump is just a figurehead on top of these so-called experts and he parrots their nonsense.

Cuomo's "experts" told them he needed 30k ventilators. He didn't, but he squealed and howled about Trump not helping him--even though he is in his third term and didn't follow recommendations to have an emergency supply of ventilators for the state and the NYMA. Did he need 30k ventilators. No. He thought he did. Why? Because his "experts" got it wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. So Cuomo was ready to hoard ventilators for New York like all the knuckleheads out their hoarding toilet paper as though coronavirus somehow made you have to take 8 months of shits in two weeks.

So no. They don't know what they're talking about.

Point is, most of the people that died didn't have to. Because of Trumps many failures. In addition to the incompetence and the crazy, Trump doesn't want to piss off his Cult.

How does Trump stop deaths in China, Italy, UK, France, Spain, etc.? This didn't start in the US nor is it primarily within the US--unless you're the last person on Earth that believes reports from China. The only medical system Trump is even marginally responsible for is the VA.

That would be you.

Trump is a means to an end for me. He's a placeholder. As long as he's President, the establishment candidates are not President. Biden is an establishment guy. I don't want Biden being president.

[Rich]

New York, full of super smart educated Liberals and blessed with great diversity and a sanctuary city: 1256 deaths per million

West Virginia, full of stupid, ignorant, poorly educated Trump supporters: 27 deaths per million

[Godstud]

@Rich

Thailand(smaller than Texas) and not full of Americans: 0.8 deaths per million.


Edit: miscalculation correction.

[Beren]

I think it's basically a dry run for the Green New Deal, where people don't get to drive cars, fly in planes, etc.

This whole thing appears to be a germ game/simulation rather than a real pandemic and we seem to do nature rather than ourselves a favour with shutting down indeed.

'We need to listen to the experts': Climate activist Greta Thunberg says coronavirus has proven the dependence society has on scientific data

Lauren Frias Apr 23, 2020, 7:31 AM

Greta Thunberg speaks on stage during NYC Climate Strike rally and demonstration at Battery Park, New
York on September 20, 2019. Ron Adar/SOPA Images/LightRocket via Getty

Swedish climate activist Greta Thunberg said the coronavirus emphasized the importance of expert guidance, and the same approach should be taken to solve the climate crisis.

Thunberg spoke with earth systems scientist Johan Rockström in a digital conversation hosted by the Nobel Prize Museum on Wednesday to mark the 50th anniversary of Earth Day.

The coronavirus lockdowns have led to reduced emissions levels as people are recommended to stay home to contain the spread of the virus.

However, the pandemic has upended the predicted trajectory of the climate crisis, as research efforts are being shifted to deal with the immediate problem at hand.

I wonder if the whole thing was Bill Gates's idea, he must have a fixation with viruses.

[Pants-of-dog]

This thread should be moved to Conspiracy Theories.

[Beren]

Sure, it's time for people to make their own conspiracy theories for themselves and discuss them.

[late]

Uh, no they don't.

They couldn't prevent coronavirus, can't cure it

and don't have a vaccine for it.

We knew before you were born.

Virus happens. There are things that need doing to reduce the likelihood of another pandemic emerging. But that requires a lot of international cooperation. Trump doesn't do that. It would also require ending industrial animal farms. But you're not interested in reform.

A vaccine is coming.

[Tainari88]

@blackjack21 doesn't care. He is very focused on getting rid of the neoliberals. But without kicking capitalism in the ass and international cooperation BJ....it won't be defeated.

@late I have been on lockdown since March 14. It is May 4. Almost two months. This lockdown is going to keep going til the end of the month.

And this is Mexico where no one has any money to keep being without being able to work for two months straight. But the government is doing a lot to ameliorate that. I am not paying utility bills. The state canceled it. Hmm. My kids' school is delaying payments til families can afford to pay again. Everyone is cooperating pretty well.

They are getting a lot of fight from Mexican families who have dead relatives in the pandemic trapped in hospitals and without letting the families in. They are upset. Mexicans with funeral and being able to be with their loved dead ones is hard.

People want to mourn their dead and be with their loved ones. And many families all over the world are burying their dead without seeing them, touching them or having normal funerals for them. It is tough as hell.

All that sacrifice to be able to contain the virus. And some people think it is not so important? Don't be foolish.

[Sivad]

Dude. You're seriously losing it.

He never had it to lose.

[Beren]

I have been on lockdown since March 14. It is May 4. Almost two months. This lockdown is going to keep going til the end of the month.

How long would you stay on lockdown to save the planet? Would you ever dare say no?

[Tainari88]

How long would you stay on lockdown to save the planet? Would you ever dare say no?

It is not about saving the planet Beren. My livelihood is tied to tourism. Everyone is vulnerable. I am older with a little boy. If I catch that virus I probably will die. because I have caught respiratory infections before in the past and did extremely badly health-wise with it.

I live in Mexico and in a working class neighborhood. I chose a nice house in a working class neighborhood. My neighbors are not rich Mexicans. They don't have savings and they are on the second month of total lockdown.

My neighbor is a car mechanic. He had to close his shop. He only has two weeks in savings. My other neighbor also only had two weeks savings. She is a baker. She and her partner sell bread on the streets for a small profit and they support themselves her mother and father and brother and child on that small profit. They are all not selling their bread. No one has money to buy it. May is the hottest month of the damn year here Beren. It is 105 degrees Farenheit and almost one hundred percent or more humidity with a house that has ovens on to make the bread. Her fan broke and she came to my house to be able to breathe. She could not breathe. Social distancing calls for saying no. I can't say no to that woman with an emergency!

People are sacrificing a lot these two and a half months in order to save people like her elderly parents. Mexico and all of Latin America is sacrificing enormous things to keep people safe. For what? For the USA to piddle it all away with Right wing assholes who can't have enough patience living in a nation where you can drink the tap water? They can't take it but the Mexicans can with SHIT NOTHING to help like no money from the federal government. AMLO is trying hard to cover the costs by zeroing out water and electricity bills. Rents are still accumulating. Food? Mexicans are in line there at the local food banks and many grocery stores here are collecting food donations for the poorest ones.

They are trying their best to flatten the curve.

It is not about saving the planet. It is about saving people's lives here Beren.

Though it is interesting. Deer are running through the streets of Mexico City for the first time in generations. And bioluminescence has returned to Mazatlan's beaches in Sinaloa state. Smog has cleared in many cities.

You got to try to give people a fighting chance in a pandemic. what is more important? Your life or being able to shop and your employers to make a profit and keep the economy going? Human life is the economy.

You better direct your anger at someone else. I want to live for my son and for him to make it to adulthood. I am not such a selfish asshole as to think my life is the only one that matters.

[Beren]

Well, I wonder if my post deserved such a long response. My point is, however, that I'm not against saving the planet or conditioning people to take infections and diseases more seriously and handle them more appropriately like staying at home, wearing masks, washing hands more often, etc., while developing their healthcare systems and infrastructure, but I really refuse being scared, fooled, manipulated or even terrorised by sock puppets such as Greta Thunberg and scams like coronavirus. This whole bullshit stinks to high heaven so much that one really needs to have some serious nasal congestion to not sense it.

[blackjack21]

There are things that need doing to reduce the likelihood of another pandemic emerging. But that requires a lot of international cooperation.

Actually, it just requires enforcing borders and testing prior to being given a visa to enter the country or to re-enter the country without quarantine.

How long would you stay on lockdown to save the planet?

What does "save the planet" mean to you? Can you define it?

Well, I wonder if my post deserved such a long response. My point is, however, that I'm not against saving the planet or conditioning people to take infections and diseases more seriously and handle them more appropriately like staying at home, wearing masks, washing hands more often, etc., while developing their healthcare systems and infrastructure, but I really refuse being scared, fooled, manipulated or even terrorised by sock puppets such as Greta Thunberg and scams like coronavirus. This whole bullshit stinks to high heaven so much that one really needs to have some serious nasal congestion to not sense it.

Modoc county's health supervisor just declared an emergency, and there isn't even a single confirmed case in the county, let alone a death. It's pretty much the remotest part of California. For a lot of places, this just doesn't make much sense.

[ness31]

I can't believe this was moved to conspiracy theories. disappointing pofo.

[Godstud]

It is a conspiracy theory, @ness31. Don't be disappointed with reality.