climate change - Page 9 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Pollution, global warming, urbanisation etc.
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By Sivad
#15000243


By Pants-of-dog
#15000251
People can read the whole article for themselves and judge what he is trying to say for themselves.
By Sivad
#15000255
Professor Myles Allen wrote:please stop
By Hindsite
#15000256
Pants-of-dog wrote:People can read the whole article for themselves and judge what he is trying to say for themselves.

All they need to know is that Al Gore lied about global warming to line his pockets with benjamins to get rich.
By Sivad
#15000809
Uncertainty in climate projections

Uncertainty is an inherent part of science and is fundamental to scientific progress. In this video, scientists shed light on some ways in which uncertainties in climate projections can be assessed, managed, and communicated.

Featuring:
Judith Curry, Climate Forecast Applications Network (2:35)
Adrienne Wootten, U. Oklahoma (21:30)
Chengcheng Fei, Texas A&M U. (39:50)
William Cheung, U. British Columbia (52:56)
James Done, NCAR (1:10:34)
By Sivad
#15000812
CLIMATE HYSTERIA - Judith Curry on Climategate, Concensus and Bullying

Regarding the role that human greenhouse gas emissions play in driving the earth’s climate Dr. Curry concludes that: “On balance, I don’t see any particular dangers from greenhouse warming. {Humans do} influence climate to some extent, what we do with land-use changes and what we put into the atmosphere. But I don’t think it’s a large enough impact to dominate over natural climate variability.”

Regarding the politically contrived climate “consensus” arguments put forth by climate alarmists she concludes: “The collapse of the consensus on cholesterol and heart disease – that one collapsed overnight. I can only hope that sanity will eventually prevail with the climate problem as well.”

Dr. Curry a world renowned and academically honored climatologist and former chair of the Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at the Georgia Institute of Technology discussed political attacks she has been subjected to that started when she began to question the tactics of climate alarmist “consensus” following the revelations brought into the light by Climategate which clearly displayed the lack of transparency and openness present in mainstream climate science.
By Sivad
#15000828
Can you imagine the staggering idiocy of holding a strong opinion on CAGW and not knowing the basic criticisms of one of the top climatologists in the world? That kind of idiocy defies imagination, it's jaw-droppingly idiotic.
By Sivad
#15000829
But then to the amazement of all this weapons grade idiocy manages to top itself by refusing to even listen to the criticisms when they're made conveniently available. It's cartoonish idiocy, you can't believe a real person could actually be this idiotic. The level of idiocy on display is just surreal.
By Pants-of-dog
#15000892
Sivad wrote:Can you imagine the staggering idiocy of holding a strong opinion on CAGW and not knowing the basic criticisms of one of the top climatologists in the world? That kind of idiocy defies imagination, it's jaw-droppingly idiotic.


I am not calling you an idiot, or even thinking you are one.

I am certain that you could easily find out what her argument is and what her evidence is with just a little Googling.

Do not be so hard on yourself. After all, Ms. Curry has made many arguments over the years, and so it may be difficult for you to tell which one she is making now.
By Hindsite
#15000972
Pants-of-dog wrote:Does she have an argument, and if so, what is it?

More importantly, what evidence does she have?

She argues that there is no particular danger because of greenhouse warming caused by man. Her evidence seems to be the fact that in all of her years of studying it as a climatologist and former chair of the Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at the Georgia Institute of Technology that the evidence does not support a particular danger from man-made greenhouse gas. The invention of the carbon tax during the time Al Gore was hyping global warming seems to have been one of the driving forces behind it. What progressive doesn't love a new tax to gain more revenue for new socialist programs.
User avatar
By MrWonderful
#15005692
anasawad wrote:
So there is (sic) still people debating how climate change is a hoax ?


Millions of them, thousands of whom are climate scientists. But from NASA employees, this letter:

Joint letter to NASA Administrator blasts agency’s policy of ignoring empirical evidence

HOUSTON, TX – April 10, 2012.

49 former NASA scientists and astronauts sent a letter to NASA Administrator Charles Bolden last week admonishing the agency for it’s role in advocating a high degree of certainty that man-made CO2 is a major cause of climate change while neglecting empirical evidence that calls the theory into question.

The group, which includes seven Apollo astronauts and two former directors of NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston, are dismayed over the failure of NASA, and specifically the Goddard Institute For Space Studies (GISS), to make an objective assessment of all available scientific data on climate change. They charge that NASA is relying too heavily on complex climate models that have proven scientifically inadequate in predicting climate only one or two decades in advance.

H. Leighton Steward, chairman of the non-profit Plants Need CO2, noted that many of the former NASA scientists harbored doubts about the significance of the C02-climate change theory and have concerns over NASA’s advocacy on the issue. While making presentations in late 2011 to many of the signatories of the letter, Steward realized that the NASA scientists should make their concerns known to NASA and the GISS.

“These American heroes – the astronauts that took to space and the scientists and engineers that put them there – are simply stating their concern over NASA’s extreme advocacy for an unproven theory,” said Leighton Steward. “There’s a concern that if it turns out that CO2 is not a major cause of climate change, NASA will have put the reputation of NASA, NASA’s current and former employees, and even the very reputation of science itself at risk of public ridicule and distrust.”

Select excerpts from the letter:

“The unbridled advocacy of CO2 being the major cause of climate change is unbecoming of NASA’s history of making an objective assessment of all available scientific data prior to making decisions or public statements.”
“We believe the claims by NASA and GISS, that man-made carbon dioxide is having a catastrophic impact on global climate change are not substantiated.”
“We request that NASA refrain from including unproven and unsupported remarks in its future releases and websites on this subject.”
The full text of the letter:

March 28, 2012

The Honorable Charles Bolden, Jr.
NASA Administrator
NASA Headquarters
Washington, D.C. 20546-0001

Dear Charlie,

We, the undersigned, respectfully request that NASA and the Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS) refrain from including unproven remarks in public releases and websites. We believe the claims by NASA and GISS, that man-made carbon dioxide is having a catastrophic impact on global climate change are not substantiated, especially when considering thousands of years of empirical data. With hundreds of well-known climate scientists and tens of thousands of other scientists publicly declaring their disbelief in the catastrophic forecasts, coming particularly from the GISS leadership, it is clear that the science is NOT settled.

The unbridled advocacy of CO2 being the major cause of climate change is unbecoming of NASA’s history of making an objective assessment of all available scientific data prior to making decisions or public statements.

As former NASA employees, we feel that NASA’s advocacy of an extreme position, prior to a thorough study of the possible overwhelming impact of natural climate drivers is inappropriate. We request that NASA refrain from including unproven and unsupported remarks in its future releases and websites on this subject. At risk is damage to the exemplary reputation of NASA, NASA’s current or former scientists and employees, and even the reputation of science itself.

For additional information regarding the science behind our concern, we recommend that you contact Harrison Schmitt or Walter Cunningham, or others they can recommend to you.

Thank you for considering this request.

Sincerely,

(Attached signatures)

CC: Mr. John Grunsfeld, Associate Administrator for Science

CC: Ass Mr. Chris Scolese, Director, Goddard Space Flight Center

Ref: Letter to NASA Administrator Charles Bolden, dated 3-26-12, regarding a request for NASA to refrain from making unsubstantiated claims that human produced CO2 is having a catastrophic impact on climate change.

/s/ Jack Barneburg, Jack – JSC, Space Shuttle Structures, Engineering Directorate, 34 years

/s/ Larry Bell – JSC, Mgr. Crew Systems Div., Engineering Directorate, 32 years

/s/ Dr. Donald Bogard – JSC, Principal Investigator, Science Directorate, 41 years

/s/ Jerry C. Bostick – JSC, Principal Investigator, Science Directorate, 23 years

/s/ Dr. Phillip K. Chapman – JSC, Scientist – astronaut, 5 years

/s/ Michael F. Collins, JSC, Chief, Flight Design and Dynamics Division, MOD, 41 years

/s/ Dr. Kenneth Cox – JSC, Chief Flight Dynamics Div., Engr. Directorate, 40 years

/////////////////other signatures truncated////////////////////
User avatar
By MrWonderful
#15005696
Sivad wrote:
but who cares what I think, the only thing that matters is what the experts agree on and how much confidence we can rationally have in the experts after a critical institutional analysis of the field of climate science.


"What the experts agree on" is irrelevant. "The experts" agreed:

1. That the sun revolved around the earth
2. That the universe was eternal and unchanging
3. That ether conducted light
4. That stomach acidity, not bacteria, caused ulcers
5. And on and on.

"Human powered heavier than air flight is impossible." - Lord Kelvin, scientific expert, 1895, President of the Royal Society

"If we all went under the assumption that what is thought to be true was really true, there would be little hope of advance." - Orville Wright, a bicycle mechanic

“The sun appears to be nothing else than a very eminent, large, and lucid planet…. Its similarity to the other globes of the solar system, with regard to its solidity, its atmosphere, and its diversified surface; the rotation upon its axis,and the fall of heavy bodies leads us on to suppose that it is most probably inhabited, like the rest of the planets, by beings whose organs are adapted to the peculiar circumstances of that vast globe.” – William Herschel (1738-1822) , discoverer of the planet Uranus, eminent observer and builder of telescopes

"We have been cocksure of many things that were not so." - Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.

"This isn't right, this isn't even wrong." - Wolfgang Pauli

"Rail travel at high speed is not possible, because passengers, unable to breathe, would die of asphyxia."- Dr Dionysys Larder (1793-1859), professor of Natural Philosophy and Astronomy, University College London.

Drill for oil? You mean drill into the ground to try and find oil? You're crazy," -- Drillers who Edwin L. Drake tried to enlist to his project to drill for oil in 1859.

"Louis Pasteur's theory of germs is ridiculous fiction." -- Pierre Pachet, Professor of Physiology at Toulouse, 1872

"The abdomen, the chest, and the brain will forever be shut from the intrusion of the wise and humane surgeon," -- Sir John Eric Ericksen, British surgeon, appointed Surgeon-Extraordinary to Queen Victoria 1873

"This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings to be seriously considered as a means of communication. The device is inherently of no value to us," -- Western Union internal memo, 1876

"The Americans have need of the telephone, but we do not. We have plenty of messenger boys." - Sir William Preece, Chief Engineer, British Post Office, 1878.
... good enough for our transatlantic friends ... but unworthy of the attention of practical or scientific men. - British Parliamentary Committee, referring to Edison's light bulb, 1878.


“The evidence for the existence of the luminiferous ether has accumulated as additional phenomena of light and other radiations have been discovered; and the properties of this medium, as deduced from the phenomena of light, have been found to be precisely those required to explain electromagnetic phenomena.” - James Clerk Maxwell (1831-1879)

"X-rays will prove to be a hoax." - Lord Kelvin, President of the Royal Society, 1883

"It is apparent to me that the possibilities of the aeroplane, which two or three years ago were thought to hold the solution to the [flying machine] problem, have been exhausted, and that we must turn elsewhere."- Thomas Edison, American inventor, 1895.

"Fooling around with alternating current is just a waste of time. Nobody will use it, ever." - Thomas Edison, American inventor, 1889 (Edison often ridiculed the arguments of competitor George Westinghouse for AC power).

"Radio has no future." - Lord Kelvin, Scottish mathematician and physicist, former president of the Royal Society, 1897

"Everything that can be invented has been invented."
- Charles H. Duell, Commissioner, U.S. Office of Patents, 1899

"Airplanes are interesting toys but of no military value," -- Marechal Ferdinand Foch, Professor of Strategy, Ecole Superieure de Guerre, 1904

"That the automobile has practically reached the limit of its development is suggested by the fact that during the past year no improvements of a radical nature have been introduced."- Scientific American, Jan. 2 edition, 1909

"The wireless music box has no imaginable commercial value. Who would pay for a message sent to nobody in particular?" -- David Sarnoff's associates in response to his urgings for investment in the radio in the 1920s.

"Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"
- H. M. Warner (1881-1958), founder of Warner Brothers, in 1927

"There is no likelihood man can ever tap the power of the atom." -- Robert Millikan, Nobel Prize in Physics, 1923

"Stocks have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau." -- Irving Fisher, Professor of Economics, Yale University, 1929.

"There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will ever be obtainable. It would mean that the atom would have to be shattered at will."- Albert Einstein, 1932.

"I'm just glad it'll be Clark Gable who's falling on his face and not Gary Cooper," - Gary Cooper on his decision not to take the leading role in "Gone With The Wind."

"The energy produced by the breaking down of the atom is a very poor kind of thing. Anyone who expects a source of power from the transformation of these atoms is talking moonshine." - Ernest Rutherford, shortly after splitting the atom for the first time.

"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
- Thomas Watson (1874-1956), Chairman of IBM, 1943


"Man will never reach the moon regardless of all future scientific advances." -- Dr. Lee DeForest, Inventor of TV

"The bomb will never go off. I speak as an expert in explosives." -- Admiral William Leahy, US Atomic Bomb Project, advising President Truman on atomic weaponry, 1944.

"Very interesting Whittle, my boy, but it will never work."- Cambridge Aeronautics Professor, when shown Frank Whittle's plan for the jet engine.
By Pants-of-dog
#15005699
Response from NASA Chief Scientist Waleed Abdalati to Letter on NASA Climate Studies

http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewpr.html?pid=36679

    "NASA sponsors research into many areas of cutting-edge scientific inquiry, including the relationship between carbon dioxide and climate. As an agency, NASA does not draw conclusions and issue 'claims' about research findings. We support open scientific inquiry and discussion.

    "Our Earth science programs provide many unique space-based observations and research capabilities to the scientific community to inform investigations into climate change, and many NASA scientists are actively involved in these investigations, bringing their expertise to bear on the interpretation of this information. We encourage our scientists to subject these results and interpretations to scrutiny by the scientific community through the peer-review process. After these studies have met the appropriate standards of scientific peer-review, we strongly encourage scientists to communicate these results to the public.

    "If the authors of this letter disagree with specific scientific conclusions made public by NASA scientists, we encourage them to join the debate in the scientific literature or public forums rather than restrict any discourse."
By Hindsite
#15005716
Pants-of-dog wrote:Response from NASA Chief Scientist Waleed Abdalati to Letter on NASA Climate Studies

http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewpr.html?pid=36679

    "NASA sponsors research into many areas of cutting-edge scientific inquiry, including the relationship between carbon dioxide and climate. As an agency, NASA does not draw conclusions and issue 'claims' about research findings. We support open scientific inquiry and discussion.

    "Our Earth science programs provide many unique space-based observations and research capabilities to the scientific community to inform investigations into climate change, and many NASA scientists are actively involved in these investigations, bringing their expertise to bear on the interpretation of this information. We encourage our scientists to subject these results and interpretations to scrutiny by the scientific community through the peer-review process. After these studies have met the appropriate standards of scientific peer-review, we strongly encourage scientists to communicate these results to the public.

    "If the authors of this letter disagree with specific scientific conclusions made public by NASA scientists, we encourage them to join the debate in the scientific literature or public forums rather than restrict any discourse."

If NASA does not draw conclusions about climate change, then it would appear that these claims by the politicians (Democrats) that we only have 12 years to save our earth is false.
User avatar
By MrWonderful
#15005935
Hindsite wrote:If NASA does not draw conclusions about climate change, then it would appear that these claims by the politicians (Democrats) that we only have 12 years to save our earth is false.


Hindsite, your single avatar beneath your name reads when clicked "Posts equal or more then (sic) 4000). Other avatars have this same ignorant grammar. The website is controlled by people who do not speak English, evidently. Can't you help them? You have pull, and an avatar! I got nothin'.
User avatar
By MrWonderful
#15005936
Pants-of-dog wrote:"Membership days equal more then (sic) 2555"



Your first avatar, Pants. Others following it are equally duh-mb. Straighten those website owners out, wouldja?
By Pants-of-dog
#15005945
MrWonderful wrote:Your first avatar, Pants. Others following it are equally duh-mb. Straighten those website owners out, wouldja?


As ling as we agree that the former NASA staff in your argument from authority did not address the actual science.
User avatar
By MrWonderful
#15005958
Pants-of-dog wrote:As ling as we agree that the former NASA staff in your argument from authority did not address the actual science.


Do you think these many insiders made it all up? What did they state that was anti-science, in your considered opinion? NASA cheats and fudges the data and that's all right with you? In what world is that science?
By Pants-of-dog
#15005969
MrWonderful wrote:Do you think these many insiders made it all up?


No, I think they simply were duped by the people who did make it up.

What did they state that was anti-science, in your considered opinion?


I said that they failed to address the science, and they did,

Can you show a scientific error that these former NASA employees pointed out?

NASA cheats and fudges the data and that's all right with you? In what world is that science?


Did NASA cheat and fudge the data? When?
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