[B0ycey]

What the fuck has that to do with it?

Everything actually. Although it would only matter and make sense to you if you knew what the fuck you were talking about. As I said stick to the trans threads and leave this one for the adults. That is where you are relevant on here because what this forum really needs is someone explaining why men can have penis's too don't you think?

[ingliz]

leave this one for the adults ...

... that espouse pseudoscientific bollocks? No, thank you.

[late]

I emphatically disagree with the OP.

There is a simple, probable, solution to Fermi's Paradox. Space is just too damn big.

Astronomers have wanted to send an instrument suite to Alpha Centauri, but that's a 100 year project, and most people can't think that far ahead. That's just an example, we will need to have a permanent station at L5 to handle the mining of the Belt. Again, that's planning for future generations, and while that's something we used to do, we do less now. Instead we have childish fights over government debt.

Btw, I found the fossil fuel argument annoying. It can, and will, be replaced. A species smarter than us would have already done it.

[Robert Urbanek]

If we are living in a simulation, as suggested by philosopher Nick Bostrom, then we may be unlikely to discover an alien civilization as the simulation may not have enough memory for the additional data that would be required.

[Steve_American]

I emphatically disagree with the OP.

There is a simple, probable, solution to Fermi's Paradox. Space is just too damn big.

Astronomers have wanted to send an instrument suite to Alpha Centauri, but that's a 100 year project, and most people can't think that far ahead. That's just an example, we will need to have a permanent station at L5 to handle the mining of the Belt. Again, that's planning for future generations, and while that's something we used to do, we do less now. Instead we have childish fights over government debt.

Btw, I found the fossil fuel argument annoying. It can, and will, be replaced. A species smarter than us would have already done it.

Thank you for your reply, even if you disagree.

You know that IMHO, we must act now to have any chance of avoiding tripping a tapping point. Contrary to deniers, if we tip one it will heat the air to tip another, and then they together will heat the air more, to yip a 3rd, etc., etc.
. . This will likely create dead zones in the oceans which will hydrogen sulfide gas into the air which will make it poisonous. I have no way to know if the air will get poisonous enough to kill us all. It is possible though.
. . Guy McPherson says that if 3 nuclear reactors melt down this will sweep all the ozone out of the ozone layer and this means the UV light of the sun will fatally burn your skin in several to many minutes of direct sunlight. This will kill all land plants and he says ocean ones also.

I see no hope that we will act soon enough, so the worst case is then almost certain.
.

At least you read it.

[B0ycey]

If we are living in a simulation, as suggested by philosopher Nick Bostrom, then we may be unlikely to discover an alien civilization as the simulation may not have enough memory for the additional data that would be required.

If we live in a simulation, is lack of data seriously the doubt you have in regards to alien civilization?

[Robert Urbanek]

If we live in a simulation, is lack of data seriously the doubt you have in regards to alien civilization?

Yes. Admittedly, "Sorry, you have reached your data limit" may seem a mundane explanation by people who want to "reach for the stars."

[B0ycey]

Yes. Admittedly, "Sorry, you have reached your data limit" may seem a mundane explanation by people who want to "reach for the stars."

It is mundane because you are suggesting there is a limit to space actually. Don't get me wrong, the double slit experiment pushes me more towards the theory, but even if we are in a simulation, lack of data is the least of my concern in regards to alien civilization because it is like having an extra bit to a terabyte of data.

[Robert Urbanek]

It is mundane because you are suggesting there is a limit to space actually. Don't get me wrong, the double slit experiment pushes me more towards the theory, but even if we are in a simulation, lack of data is the least of my concern in regards to alien civilization because it is like having an extra bit to a terabyte of data.

But there is also a difference between what you can do and what you want to do. If I were a billionaire, I could build a 30-room mansion, but I wouldn’t want or need it. Maybe the advanced beings who created a simulation don’t want or need more than one planet of sentient beings to toy with.

[B0ycey]

But there is also a difference between what you can do and what you want to do. If I were a billionaire, I could build a 30-room mansion, but I wouldn’t want or need it. Maybe the advanced beings who created a simulation don’t want or need more than one planet of sentient beings to toy with.

Before I go further on this, what is your opinion of the recent UFO revelations? I only ask because the phenomenon is real. The only question is 'what is it?' When you answer the question, have in mind your response of one sentient beings in a vast universe please.

[Robert Urbanek]

Before I go further on this, what is your opinion of the recent UFO revelations? I only ask because the phenomenon is real. The only question is 'what is it?' When you answer the question, have in mind your response of one sentient beings in a vast universe please.

Here is my essay on the subject, which, admittedly, counters my simulation argument.

​UFOs: Deception and Doom
​
The presence of UFOs may be evidence that we have been invaded by time travelers from a parallel universe.

We do not track UFOs arriving and leaving from outer space; they usually appear suddenly in the sky and then zoom out of sight or simply disappear, evidence that they are intrusions from a parallel universe.

Their speed and maneuverability suggest the UFOs are controlled by beings with a technology far superior to ours. They could destroy or conquer us but haven’t. They could intervene to instruct us on how to treat each other and the planet but they haven’t. If they were merely detached, objective observers, they wouldn’t draw so much attention to themselves. So, what is going on?

The most benign explanation is that pranksters are beaming objects or images into our universe for their amusement. We chase UFOs like kittens in YouTube videos who pounce on bright spots created by laser pointers.

However, a unified theory encompassing UFOs, parallel universes and time travel provides a more sinister motive.

Consider this scenario:

Humans on our Earth and a parallel Earth (Let’s call it Earth 2) face extinction from a predictable but unpreventable natural disaster, such as a radical change in solar activity that will turn our planet into a boiling inferno or the eruption of super volcanoes that will create a perpetual winter: hot or cold levels of Hell.

Earth 2 achieved greater scientific advances than us, perfecting both time travel and access to parallel universes. Flash forward to 2036, when Earth 2 scientists discover disturbing trends in either solar or volcanic activity that dooms most life on their planet and ours.

But the scientists can offer a lifeboat for a select but still large group. Through time travel, they can take refuge in the past but not their own past as inadvertent actions by the time travelers may change history and prevent the development of time travel.

This classic time travel paradox can be avoided by travelling to the past in a parallel universe, a possibility suggested in the article “The Quantum Physics of Time Travel” by David Deutsch and Michael Lockwood in the March 1994 edition of Scientific American.

In the parallel universe, the time travelling invaders can meddle with our Earth history as much as they want without affecting the timeline on Earth 2.

The time travelers from Earth 2 still faced one problem. If scientists on our planet perfected time travel and access to parallel universes, we could invade Earth 2, cripple their scientific advancement. and populate their world with our refugees. They had to strike first.

World War II and the development of the atomic bomb put science on steroids. But what direction would it take? We could explore space. or we could explore the possibilities of time travel or accessing parallel universes. Earth 2 made the decision for us. After the war, they filled our skies with UFOs, luring humans into thinking there were extraterrestrial beings out there ready to meet us. We would focus on space exploration and nothing so fanciful as time travel or alternative Earths. The diversion worked.

But why does this explanation require an apocalypse? Couldn’t there be another motive for the invaders? I assume the intruders from Earth 2 want to live comfortably on an inhabitable planet. While they may have intervened in the 20th century to prevent a nuclear war, they seem to have done nothing in this century to prevent climate change and the resurgence of war mongering authoritarian regimes. The most likely explanation: It’s too late to bother, the end is coming soon. Indeed, I believe few if any refugees from Earth 2 decided to settle in this decade. The invaders aren’t interested in our future. They only want our past.

[B0ycey]

@Robert Urbanek I specifically asked this question in regards your simulation argument. Kudos for basically debunking it and making my point for me.

But in any case, sure UFOs could be time travellers or dimensional or whatever. But they could also be extraterrestrial. In terms of data though, I know what scenario would use the least bytes... just saying.

The rest, it is a good opinion piece. I have nothing really to say on it but to say they do seem to come to our aid when we need them the most according to testimony. Not on all evils I should add so don't expect wars to end soon 'unfortunately'. But when it comes to nuclear disasters such as Fukushima and Chernobyl, they have reduced radiation levels to point that radiation sickness for both cases were below 50 total (and Fukushima was 0)

[late]

I only ask because the phenomenon is real.

It's apparently real.

For it to be real, you need real, see how that works? Show me something, anything, that is clearly and indisputably of alien origin.

I am 71, which means I have had to listen to UFO stories for over half a freaking century. In all that time, nothing, not a freaking thing has turned up that definitively proves there are aliens.

[B0ycey]

It's apparently real.

For it to be real, you need real, see how that works? Show me something, anything, that is clearly and indisputably of alien origin.

I said the phenomenon is real, not that it is of alien origin.

[Robert Urbanek]

@Robert Urbanek I specifically asked this question in regards your simulation argument. Kudos for basically debunking it and making my point for me.

But in any case, sure UFOs could be time travellers or dimensional or whatever. But they could also be extraterrestrial. In terms of data though, I know what scenario would use the least bytes... just saying.

The rest, it is a good opinion piece. I have nothing really to say on it but to say they do seem to come to our aid when we need them the most according to testimony. Not on all evils I should add so don't expect wars to end soon 'unfortunately'. But when it comes to nuclear disasters such as Fukushima and Chernobyl, they have reduced radiation levels to point that radiation sickness for both cases were below 50 total (and Fukushima was 0)

UFOs showing up “when we need them the most,” as you say, is consistent in tone with Carl Jung’s interpretation of the phenomenon, who believed the roundness of flying saucers were an expression of wholeness that the unconscious collective yearned for in times of crisis: the symbol of the circle representing an attempt to heal our spirit in our apocalyptic age. (Man and His Symbols, Carl Jung, et.al., 1964)

[B0ycey]

UFOs showing up “when we need them the most,” as you say, is consistent in tone with Carl Jung’s interpretation of the phenomenon, who believed the roundness of flying saucers were an expression of wholeness that the unconscious collective yearned for in times of crisis: the symbol of the circle representing an attempt to heal our spirit in our apocalyptic age. (Man and His Symbols, Carl Jung, et.al., 1964)

Then we are on the same wavelength right? There is so much more I could say on the subject, but given as nothing can be verified on a forum full of skeptics I keep most of it to myself. But there does seem a nuclear connection with the phenomenon and they have intervened before and will likely do so again. I don't know if it is to heal our spirit or to protect the planet. There is a date that something will happen in 2027 - good or bad I don't know. That is what the lore is. Of course its hearsay and not from reputable sources. But keep that in mind given we seem to be on a path of disclosure.

[Robert Urbanek]

Then we are on the same wavelength right? There is so much more I could say on the subject, but given as nothing can be verified on a forum full of skeptics I keep most of it to myself. But there does seem a nuclear connection with the phenomenon and they have intervened before and will likely do so again. I don't know if it is to heal our spirit or to protect the planet. There is a date that something will happen in 2027 - good or bad I don't know. That is what the lore is. Of course its hearsay and not from reputable sources. But keep that in mind given we seem to be on a path of disclosure.

I am still weighing different theories. Linking UFOs with time travel would explain the Mandela Effect, in which people share the “wrong memories” of people, places, and things. The wrong memories may be correct memories of how things used to be before time travelers changed the timeline.

Jung tends to blur the “collective unconscious” with the spiritual but if UFOs are “spiritual” in origin, then they may be entirely supernatural. But the supernatural may be some permutation of quantum physics that we haven’t figured out yet.

Then again, both the natural world and all paranormal phenomena could just be part of the coding in a simulation.

[B0ycey]

I am still weighing different theories. Linking UFOs with time travel would explain the Mandela Effect, in which people share the “wrong memories” of people, places, and things. The wrong memories may be correct memories of how things used to be before time travelers changed the timeline.

Jung tends to blur the “collective unconscious” with the spiritual but if UFOs are “spiritual” in origin, then they may be entirely supernatural. But the supernatural may be some permutation of quantum physics that we haven’t figured out yet.

Then again, both the natural world and all paranormal phenomena could just be part of the coding in a simulation.

The only thing we know for sure is the phenomenon is real but what it is can be up for debate.

So yeah, today any opinion on UFOs is as valid as the next. My opinion is the answer to all of it is in ancient text. Specifically Sumerian. Perhaps the Dead Sea scrolls, Bible, Quran, Torah, etc. It wasn't that long ago I would disregard Sitchins work as bogus. Today I am less skeptical. And if the existence of Planet 9 is confirmed, a lot more focus should be on his work because the orbit and its existence was predicted by Sitchin before any of this was taken seriously by anyone.

https://www.space.com/earth-like-planet ... lar-system

As for simulation theory, my opinion is that as time isn't linear that can only mean what we understand it to be has happened, is happening and will happen all at once. Also when we get to the quantum level, everything we understand of physics seems to go out the window. I don't really believe we are in a digital universe of one's and zeros but a simulation of learning. I believe we are part of something much greater. That consciousness is a force and we are meant to shape the universe to reach a higher understanding and if we don't reach that level we repeat life again until we do. And once we reach that level we then progress to divine status and move on to the next life - whatever that is. As I said, whatever this phenomenon is, it has came to our aid before now and I believe it will again. Not so much because humans are so special but because sentients is a force that must be protected.

[Robert Urbanek]

Instead of speculating on the source of UFOs, should we pay more attention to the motion of UFOs? Perhaps the UFOs are really the “nibs” of virtual writing instruments and their paths, if traced in two or three dimensions, convey some kind of information.

For example, if a UFO moved one length in one direction, then moved four times that length in another direction, then nine times the first length in another direction, that would describe the ratio of 1:4:9 (1²:2²:3²), the universal mathematical concept that formed the proportions of the monolith in 2001: A Space Odyssey.

Or perhaps the UFO flight patterns describe something more complex, like the structures of molecules.

[B0ycey]

Instead of speculating on the source of UFOs, should we pay more attention to the motion of UFOs? Perhaps the UFOs are really the “nibs” of virtual writing instruments and their paths, if traced in two or three dimensions, convey some kind of information.

For example, if a UFO moved one length in one direction, then moved four times that length in another direction, then nine times the first length in another direction, that would describe the ratio of 1:4:9 (1²:2²:3²), the universal mathematical concept that formed the proportions of the monolith in 2001: A Space Odyssey.

Or perhaps the UFO flight patterns describe something more complex, like the structures of molecules.

Are you aware of UFO flight patterns? I have an interest in this subject, but this has never been brought up. Besides, we have crop circles. You want to decipher messages, that is the best place to look.