[MacDK]

Reading the article on "Polish Forces in the West" on Wikipedia I stumbled upon some numbers that made me wonder.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Arm ... n_the_West

The article stats, that of the around 249.000 soldiers to fight for the Polish Forces in the West, 89.000 (35,8%) were deserters from the German Wehrmacht.

This made me wonder - how did these soldiers end up in the German Wehrmacht to begin with?

- were they ethnic Germans conscripted to the German Forces, but choosing to desert and fight for Poland?
- were they volunteers to the Waffen-SS units (or similar) who changed their mind and deserted?
- were they ethnic Poles who where conscripted as inhabitants of the territory that Germany annexed to the Reich?

Does anyone have any info on the subject?

[Notorious B.i.G.]

Could be much the same as how Spanish forces ended up fighting for the Germans. Occupied/puppet governments offering up units to show their loyalty to the new masters. Perhaps if these individuals could show traces of German blood in their ancestry they could qualify to join the German army.

[Potemkin]

This made me wonder - how did these soldiers end up in the German Wehrmacht to begin with?

- were they ethnic Germans conscripted to the German Forces, but choosing to desert and fight for Poland?
- were they volunteers to the Waffen-SS units (or similar) who changed their mind and deserted?
- were they ethnic Poles who where conscripted as inhabitants of the territory that Germany annexed to the Reich?

My guess would be that the third option was the most likely. When the Wehrmacht turns up on your doorstep and tells you you've just been conscripted into the glorious German army, you don't say, "Fuck off!" to them. Not if you want to live, you don't. You play along with it, then as soon as their back is turned you desert.

[MacDK]

My guess would be that the third option was the most likely. When the Wehrmacht turns up on your doorstep and tells you you've just been conscripted into the glorious German army, you don't say, "Fuck off!" to them. Not if you want to live, you don't. You play along with it, then as soon as their back is turned you desert.

That would be my guess as well although I have not read up on it.

I know that Germany conscripted ethnic French in Alsace/Lorraine as they considered it national German territory, so I would assume that the same might have happened to ethnic Poles in the former Polish territory annexed by the Germans.

It just seems like a very large number. If 89.000 deserted, then there must have been hundreds of thousands of ethnic Poles in the Wehrmacht (assuming that at least under a third of them actually succeeded in deserting or tried to) - one would think the Germans would have been weary of having such a large group of potential enemies serving in their forces.

[Smilin' Dave]

Were they ethnic Poles, or Poles by nationality? Would allied forces have split hairs over... I dunno, a Ruthenia, who identified themselves as Polish?

[MacDK]

Were they ethnic Poles, or Poles by nationality? Would allied forces have split hairs over... I dunno, a Ruthenia, who identified themselves as Polish?

I have no idea, did Ruthenians join the Wehrmacht in large numbers?

[Thunderhawk]

When Georgia fell to the Soviets a large population of Georgians left and asked to be enlisted in various foriegn military schools. Poland accepted many. During the war many were captured, and some later joined the Nazis as they went to war with the Soviets, believing/hoping they could free their homeland.

I would imagine that had they joined up and been sent to the Western front they would have had little reason to have been loyal to the Germans. Would those Georgians, who would also have spoken Polish, have been considered Polish nationals or Georgians by the West?


When did those Poles in German uniforms, "defect" to the West?

[MacDK]

I would imagine that had they joined up and been sent to the Western front they would have had little reason to have been loyal to the Germans. Would those Georgians, who would also have spoken Polish, have been considered Polish nationals or Georgians by the West?

But if (some of) these Poles were Georgians, who wanted Georgia free from the Soviet Union, then why rejoin the Polish army in the West - this would not in any way contribute to freeing Georgia. Why not just desert and wait out the war in a POW camp? Joining the allies would not help free Georgia from the Soviets.

When did those Poles in German uniforms, "defect" to the West?

Good question, I have no idea, but like you I would assume that it must have been on the Western Front.

[Siberian Fox]

how did these soldiers end up in the German Wehrmacht to begin with?

Quite possibly they were people who had joined The Deutsche Volksliste (a large part of Poland was German territory prior to WWI) and were subsequently conscripted. When their units surrendered, they might have decided that the tide of war had turned and that it was better to fight for the Western allies to liberate Poland by saying they were Polish rather than German - which would mean being a POW.

[MacDK]

Quite possibly they were people who had joined The Deutsche Volksliste (a large part of Poland was German territory prior to WWI) and were subsequently conscripted. When their units surrendered, they might have decided that the tide of war had turned and that it was better to fight for the Western allies to liberate Poland by saying they were Polish rather than German - which would mean being a POW.

Thanks for the link.

That seems like a very plausible explanation, especially :

- Category III: Eingedeutschte—indigenous persons considered by Nazis as partly Polonized (mainly Silesians and Kashubs); refusal to join this list could lead to deportation to a concentration camp
- Category IV: Rückgedeutschte—Persons of Polish nationality considered "racially valuable", supportive of the Reich (e.g., collaborators)

[...]

Persons of categories III and IV were sent to Germany as labourers and subject to conscription into the Wehrmacht.

[Shade2]

Mostly Poles from Silesia were enforced consicription was introduced and most Poles were classified by German administration as Volksdeutsche.
Of course they were ethnic Germans also in pre-war Poland-around 700,000. A gread number of males from that group took part in mass murder of Poles and Jews in Selbstschutz units in 1939.