Sephardi wrote:Art everybody here is probably spitting out their drinks laughing at you.
I am glad that so much attention is paid to my contribution.
Sephardi wrote:Every post you say that there is no Jewish race or ethnic group in the beginning of the post...
Well, do you believe in the existence of the Jewish race? Yes or no?
Sephardi wrote:...yet you but then you call Atheist, non religious, and internationalist Communists like Marx, Trotsky, and others as "Jews"...
Well, these people called themselves Jews, they believed in the existence of a common Jewish race.
How shall I call these people?
Shall I call them atheists or fake Christians, who believed in the existence of the Jewish race, and whose Khazar, Berber or Slavic ancestors converted to Judaism and were religious Jews?
It would be too long, would it?
The correct definition would be "Zionists" or "proto-Zionists", or "pseudo-Jews".
Sephardi wrote:...or you quote people like Churchill saying that. If you truly believe that being Jewish is just religious, then you can't blame Jews for the actions of Trotsky, Marx, or even Atheist Socialists like the administration of Israel from its first 30 years of existence.
Well, I do not believe in the existence of the Jewish race.
Jews are a religion, like Muslims or Christians.
Churchill quoted Disraeli, and Disraeli believed that Jews are "Mosaic Arabs", speak that they belong to the same Semitic race, like Arabs do.
I quoted Churchill, where is the problem?
Now I will quote Disraeli:
Benjamin Disraeli, the first and only British prime minister of Jewish extraction, described Jews as "Mosaic Arabs".
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... osaicarabs
Disraeli converted to Christianity, but he still represented the interests of Jews. Some authors tell that he re-converted to Judaism before his death. Disraeli believed that Jews are a race (Mosaic Arabs). And Churchill just repeated what Disraeli told about Jews.
How can you prevent crazy people from believing in crazy things, like the existence of the "Jewish race"?
Einstein, Disraeli, Hess, Marx or Trotsky believed that they belonged to the Jewish race, and they acted in the interest of people that they defined as "in-group", as their own people. And they acted against the interests of people they lived among.
How can you blame the National-Socialists who believed that Jews were a race, if so many prominent Jews talked about the "Jewish race" and the struggle between the "Jewish race" and the "Germanic race".
There was no National-Socialism and no Hitler in Germany when Moses Hess wrote his books about the race struggle:
Hess originally advocated Jewish integration into the universalist socialist movement, and was a friend and collaborator of Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels. Hess converted Engels to Communism, and introduced Marx to social and economic problems. He played an important role in transforming Hegelian dialectical idealism theory of history to the dialectical materialism of Marxism, by conceiving of man as the initiator of history through his active consciousness.
Hess was probably responsible for several "Marxian" slogans and ideas, including religion as the "opiate of the people."
Hess became reluctant to base all history on economic causes and class struggle, and he came to see the struggle of races, or nationalities, as the prime factor of past history.
"Even an act of conversion cannot relieve the Jew of the enormous pressure of German anti-Semitism. The Germans hate the religion of the Jews less than they hate their race - they hate the peculiar faith of the Jews, less than their peculiar noses."
"The race struggle is the primal one, and the class struggle secondary. The last dominating race is the German."
"Yet it seems that a final race struggle is unavoidable"
...
When Theodor Herzl first read Rome and Jerusalem he wrote about Hess that "since Spinoza jewry had no bigger thinker than this forgotten Moses Hess" and that he would not have written Der Judenstaat (The Jewish State) if he had known Rome and Jerusalem beforehand. Vladimir Ze'ev Jabotinsky honored Hess in The Jewish Legion in World War as one of those people that made the Balfour declaration possible, together with Herzl, Rothschild and Pinsker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moses_Hess
As we see, prominent Jews, like Moses Hess talked about race struggle, he believed that German Christians and German Jews are in war against each other. It is possible that Hess had a big Khazar nose, but there were other Jews in Germany who were blond and had blue eyes.
The German Jewish journalist Kurt Caro (1905–1979) who emigrated to Paris in 1933 and served in the British army from 1943,[11] published a book under the pseudonym Manuel Humbert unmasking Hitler's "Mein Kampf" in which he stated the following racial composition of the Jewish population of Central Europe: 23.8% Lapponid race, 21.5% Nordic race, 20.3% Armenoid race, 18.4% Mediterranean race, 16.0% Oriental race.[12]
By 1939 Hitler had abandoned Nordicist rhetoric in favour of the idea that the German people as a whole were united by distinct "spiritual" qualities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism_and_race
As we see, more than 50% of European Jews looked like normal Europeans who could easily assimilate with Gemans.
Moses Hess probably talked about his own experiences, and so did his followers, who called themselves Zionists and believed in the existence of a Jewish race and in the race struggle.
And the leading American Zionist Samuel Untermyer even declared a war on the German race:
As quoted in the New York Times on Aug. 07, 1933, Untermyer exclaimed:
"The Jews of the world now declare a Holy War against Germany. We are now engaged in a sacred conflict against the Germans. And we are going to starve them into surrender. We are going to use a world-wide boycott against them, that will destroy them because they are dependent upon their export business."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Untermyer
Is it surprising that National-Socialists repeated the rhetoric of Proto-Zionists and Zionist?
So the word "Jews" is as confusing as the word "Germans".
If you say "Germans", that can mean German citizens or ethnic Germans.
Ethnic Germans is the original meaning of the word Germans, but today it is transforming to definition of the citizenship.
The same with the word "Jews". The original meaning of this word is adherents of Judaism.
But Zionists perverted the meaning of the word "Jews", they believed that they are a race, and they made National Socialists believe that Jews are a race. Moses Hess slogans about the struggle between the Jewish and German races and and the war rhetoric of Untermyer had dire consequences for many innocent people, who call themselves "Deutsche mosaischen Glaubens" (Mosaic Germans).
Israel Shahak explains the difference between the original word "Jews" and the modern perverted meaning of this word.
In the last 150 years, the term 'Jew' has therefore acquired a dual meaning, to
the great confusion of some well-meaning people, particularly in the English-speaking
countries, who imagine that the Jews they meet socially are 'representative'
of Jews 'in general'.
In the countries of east Europe as well as in the Arab world, the
Jews were liberated from the tyranny of their own religion and of their own
communities by outside forces, too late and in circumstances too unfavorable for
genuine internalized social change. In most cases, and particularly in Israel, the old
concept of society, the same ideology - especially as directed towards non-Jews - and
the same utterly false conception of history have been preserved.
This applies even to some of those Jews who joined 'progressive' or leftist movements.
An examination of radical, socialist and communist parties can provide many examples of disguised
Jewish chauvinists and racists, who joined these parties merely for reasons of 'Jewish
interest' and are, in Israel, in favor of 'anti-Gentile' discrimination.
One need only check how many Jewish 'socialists' have managed to write about the kibbutz without
taking the trouble to mention that it is a racist institution from which non-Jewish
citizens of Israel are rigorously excluded, to see that [18] the phenomenon we are alluding
to is by no means uncommon. (7)
Avoiding labels based on ignorance or hypocrisy, we thus see that the word
'Jewry' and its cognates describe two different and even contrasting social
groups, and because of current Israeli politics the continuum between the two is
disappearing fast.
On the one hand there is the traditional totalitarian meaning
discussed above; on the other hand there are Jews by descent who have internalized
the complex of ideas which Karl Popper has called 'the open society'. (There are also
some, particularly in the USA, who have not internalized these ideas, but try to make
a show of acceptance.)
It is important to note that all the supposedly 'Jewish characteristics' - by which
I mean the traits which vulgar so-called intellectuals in the West attribute to 'the
Jews' - are modern characteristics, quite unknown during most of Jewish history, and
appeared only when the totalitarian Jewish community began to lose its power.
Take, for example, the famous Jewish sense of humor. Not only is humor very rare in
Hebrew literature before the 19th century (and is only found during few periods, in
countries where the Jewish upper class was relatively free from the rabbinical yoke,
such as Italy between the 14th and 17th centuries or Muslim Spain) but humor and
jokes are strictly forbidden by the Jewish religion - except, significantly, jokes against
other religions. Satire against rabbis and leaders of the community was never
internalized by Judaism, not even to a small extent, as it was in Latin Christianity.
There were no Jewish comedies, just as there were no comedies in Sparta, and for a
similar reason. (8) Or take the love of learning. Except for a purely religious learning,
which was itself in a debased and degenerate state, the Jews of Europe (and to a
somewhat lesser extent also of the Arab countries) were dominated, before about
1780, by a supreme contempt and hate for all learning (excluding the Talmud and
Jewish mysticism).
Large parts of the Old Testament, all nonliturgical Hebrew
poetry, most books on Jewish philosophy were not read and their very names were
often anathematized. Study of all languages was strictly forbidden, as was the study of
mathematics and science. Geography, (9) history - even Jewish history - were
completely unknown.
The critical sense, which is supposedly so characteristic of
Jews, was totally absent, and nothing was so forbidden, feared and therefore
persecuted as the most modest innovation or the most innocent criticism.
It was a world sunk in the most abject superstition, fanaticism and ignorance, a
world in which the preface to the first [19] work on geography in Hebrew
(published in 1803 in Russia) could complain that
very many great rabbis were denying the existence of the American continent and
saying that it is 'impossible'.
Between that world and what is often taken in the West
to 'characterize' Jews there is nothing in common except the mistaken name.
Jewish History, Jewish Religion
The Weight of Three Thousand Years
By Israel Shahak
http://www.amazon.com/Jewish-History-Re ... 0745308198
I hope that this explanation will help you to understand the difference between the real religious Jews and the "pseudo-Jews", speak Zionists who invented the "Jewish people" or "Jewish race".
Sephardi wrote:Also, your typing won't do anything, so either raise arms against Israel or shut up.
If your mental capacity is not sufficient to understand what I am talking about, just go into another thread and talk about "them Muslims" who are a threat to the "Judeo-Christian" civilization (speak Zionism), and you will probably find a lot of atention.
Sephardi wrote:The cowardice of the anti-Semites continue.
The stupidity of "wanna-be-Semites" (who hate real Palestinian Semites, and label people that they hate as Anti-Semites) continues.
But less and less people are impress by this name calling, because the term "Anti-Semite" became meaningless after Zionists labeled Arabs (speak real Semites) as Anti-Semites.
Zionists are the biggest Semite-Haters (speak Anti-Semites).
.
_________________________________________________________________________________
"I don't care if Americans think we're running the news media, Hollywood, Wall Street or the government. I just care that we get to keep running them".
J. Stein
- By JohnRawls
- By Saeko
- By Rancid
- By Doug64