[BurrsWogdon]

Do PoFo conservatives find inspiration in Burke (particularly American conservatives). Do you subscribe to the concept of rights being a form of patrimony and liberty being an inheritence. Or do you generally conceive of rights as natural or God given?

[Rilzik]

'rights' are only a vehicle through which power moves. 'Rights' that more closely resemble various human instincts are more powerful.

I don't see how anyone can believe in inherent rights unless you believe in god, who can grant you rights. 'rights' are nothing more then culture norms reinforced by law or a way to increase power of a individual or group.

[BurrsWogdon]

And this is the conservative position?

[mikema63]

This is a passerby positions.

[Drlee]

The American conservative position on rights is pretty clear. It is contained in our first real statement of of our beliefs on the subject:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,

We stuck to it:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

"

Can the liberties of a nation be sure when we remove their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people, that these liberties are a gift from God? Thomas Jefferson

"(T)he foundation of our national policy will be laid in the pure and immutable principles of private morality; ...the propitious smiles of Heaven can never be expected on a nation that disregards the eternal rules of order and right which Heaven itself has ordained..." George Washington, First Inaugural, April 30 1789

"Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." John Adams

It is possibe (though more difficult) for a conservative to be atheist. It is not possible for an American conservative to conclude that the founders and basis for our government relied on a respect for the rights given the individual as 'one of God's children'.

[BurrsWogdon]

Thanks Drlee.

Can that be interpreted, in light of "self-evident", as a sort of "from the earlier" concept of rights without necessarily involving God as popularly conceived? A pantheistic interpretation?

Also, since we "stuck to it" as it is our "founding" but was gathered to a considerable degree (I think) from British tradition couldn't it fit the "Burkean" scheme.

By the way, having gone back and read that sticky thread, I found the Richard Weaver link pretty interesting. I haven't finished it though.