One of the things that does seem consistent, is their support for Israel. Though these are neocons, not conservatives. Neocons used to be Trotskyites.
Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...
Obviously they conserve the power of big business and capital. Back in the day they conserved the power of the aristocracy. Essentially they work to support whatever system is currently in power.
Drlee wrote:In a general sense true. In a specifically US sense not so much. That is unless you consider the collection of wealthy landowners who constructed our constitutional government with all of its protections for the unwashed the aristocracy. Certainly they were but their enlightened ideas and beliefs, despite the necessary compromises, made white people 100 years ago even more free than today.
Beren wrote:They were Free Mason conservatives.
Potemkin wrote:In other words, revolutionaries.
Beren wrote:And progressives, because that's the real point here. However, it's also enough if we make a distinction between revolutionaries and counter-revolutionaries.
Potemkin wrote:Progressives who pick up guns and wage war against established authority are called 'revolutionaries', Beren.
Beren wrote:That's true, but the point is they were progressives and not conservatives, not that they picked up guns and waged war against established authority.
Potemkin wrote:They weren't just progressives, they were revolutionaries, Beren. Bernie Sanders is a progressive; Jefferson, Washington et al. were revolutionaries.
Beren wrote:They were revolutionaries but reactionaries can also claim they are revolutionaries if they pick up guns and make a counter-revolution. The point is that they were progressives who made a revolution, but even if they hadn't made a revolution, they still would have been progressives, not conservatives.
Potemkin wrote:Hmm... granted. I think we can agree with each other that Drlee is wrong when he characterises the Founding Fathers as conservatives.
Beren wrote:You just never know what conservative/liberal/socialist/etc. means in America.
The Founding Fathers were absolutely not conservatives. They were, in fact, revolutionaries. Jefferson even supported the Jacobin reign of terror, ffs.
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Because “the state” is not a monolithic hive mind.