[Pants-of-dog]

@late

Was your original claim about Vietnam about the rate of gun deaths or is that something that is being assumed by people other than you?

[wat0n]

If so, the original claim would be even sillier if anything because of the population size difference

[late]

[usermention=41202]

@late[/usermention]

Was your original claim about Vietnam about the rate of gun deaths or is that something that is being assumed by people other than you?

The point is that gun deaths happen at a rate that's equivalent to a medium sized war. Saying we are at war with ourselves may be rhetorical, but the body count is up there.

It's utter insanity.

[Pants-of-dog]

gun deaths happen at a rate over twice all cause mortality at the peak of Vietnam..

Can you clarify this as to when and where?

[wat0n]

The point is that gun deaths happen at a rate that's equivalent to a medium sized war. Saying we are at war with ourselves may be rhetorical, but the body count is up there.

It's utter insanity.

You are taking raw figures, which is incorrect as larger populations can expect to see more people killed by guns every year. Even your own chart in your original post took rates per 100,000.

If it's about raw figures, annual gun deaths including suicides are comparable to those by car accidents (which presumably consist mainly of people who didn't intend to kill themselves or others). Am I supposed to believe Americans drive so badly as to kill themselves as if they were soldiers fighting in Vietnam or it's just an issue of population sizes?

https://www.nhtsa.gov/press-releases/tr ... mates-2022

(On a side note, the US is also an outlier among developed countries when it comes to the traffic death rate per 100,000 inhabitants)

[late]

Can you clarify this as to when and where?

I edited it, please refer to the new version.

[late]

You are taking raw figures, which is incorrect

Hardly, like everything it's relevance is limited. The fact is we have a gun mortality rate equivalent to a war.

That's a horror show.

I've lived in civilisation, where gun deaths are a teeny tiny fraction of what we have here. Hell. when I was living in Vienna, most cops didn't carry guns. Maybe you have to experience it to appreciate it.

[wat0n]

Hardly, like everything it's relevance is limited. The fact is we have a gun mortality rate equivalent to a war.

That's a horror show.

I've lived in civilisation, where gun deaths are a teeny tiny fraction of what we have here. Hell. when I was living in Vienna, most cops didn't carry guns. Maybe you have to experience it to appreciate it.

This post sounds kinda racist tbh

[late]

This post sounds kinda racist tbh

You project a lot...

Fear of Blacks has played an outsized role in American culture, from the beginning.

"Gun politics in the U.S. are inextricably linked to race.

Two recent studies have found more evidence that for many white Americans who advocate for gun rights, it isn’t simply about owning and using a tool, but even more about identity and power.

One of the research papers found that the larger the percentage of enslaved people a U.S. county had in 1860, the higher the rate of gun ownership its residents have today.

“Understanding how race and racism have long played a role and continue to play a role in politics in this particular policy arena is vital to ensure the policies that are made are equitable, and protecting everyone’s rights,” he said."

https://publicintegrity.org/inside-publici/newsletters/watchdog-newsletter/slavery-racism-have-to-do-with-american-gun-ownership/

[wat0n]

You project a lot...

Fear of Blacks has played an outsized role in American culture, from the beginning.

"Gun politics in the U.S. are inextricably linked to race.

Two recent studies have found more evidence that for many white Americans who advocate for gun rights, it isn’t simply about owning and using a tool, but even more about identity and power.

One of the research papers found that the larger the percentage of enslaved people a U.S. county had in 1860, the higher the rate of gun ownership its residents have today.

“Understanding how race and racism have long played a role and continue to play a role in politics in this particular policy arena is vital to ensure the policies that are made are equitable, and protecting everyone’s rights,” he said."

https://publicintegrity.org/inside-publici/newsletters/watchdog-newsletter/slavery-racism-have-to-do-with-american-gun-ownership/

I was referring to the implication that most of Latin America is uncivilized.

Have you checked your white privilege lately? Or this only counts for those of us who aren't self righteous idiots?

[late]

I was referring to the implication that most of Latin America is uncivilized.

We've wandered off topic.

Is this the part where you try to kill me with boredom?

[wat0n]

I would say it's very much related, sounds like a claim conservatives make.

But why isn't it racist when you do? That is the real question.

[Pants-of-dog]

@late

When you implied that a place was uncivilized compared to Vienna, what place were you implying? I read it as the USA, but clarification would be useful.

[late]

@late

When you implied that a place was uncivilized compared to Vienna, what place were you implying? I read it as the USA, but clarification would be useful.

You got it.

Maine is one of the safest places in the country, and it's not just crime. So when I talk about this sort of thing, where I live is a lot more civilised than a place like Texas. But when I wound up in Vienna, that awareness of the potential for violence, just about disappeared. You can feel something inside you relax.

As long as the subject of Latins came up, you really can't generalise. Costa Rica is very safe, some other places are not. The places that aren't safe, are that way because we have repeatedly screwed them over. The Drug War has been fantastically destructive, for example. But before that, we often treated them like crap. We have messed with Nicaragua 17 or 18 times, for example.

[wat0n]

@late

When you implied that a place was uncivilized compared to Vienna, what place were you implying? I read it as the USA, but clarification would be useful.

Most of Latin America has gun homicide rates higher than the US

So, is Latin America uncivilized?

[Pants-of-dog]

That was amusing.

[wat0n]

As long as the subject of Latins came up, you really can't generalise. Costa Rica is very safe, some other places are not. The places that aren't safe, are that way because we have repeatedly screwed them over. The Drug War has been fantastically destructive, for example. But before that, we often treated them like crap. We have messed with Nicaragua 17 or 18 times, for example.

Costa Rica has a gun homicide rate of 10 per 100,000 inhabitants, over twice the US' rate. This is despite the fact that gun availability is a lot lower than in the US.

Is Costa Rica uncivilized?

[ingliz]

@wat0n

All firearm deaths ...

US:

On a per capita basis, there were 14.6 gun deaths per 100,000 people in 2021 – the highest rate since the early 1990s but still well below the peak of 16.3 gun deaths per 100,000 people in 1974.

Costa Rica:

The figure you gave is a fairly recent development and drug-related.

In 2014, it was 7.59 gun deaths per 100k.

[wat0n]

@wat0n

All firearm deaths ...

US:

On a per capita basis, there were 14.6 gun deaths per 100,000 people in 2021 – the highest rate since the early 1990s but still well below the peak of 16.3 gun deaths per 100,000 people in 1974.

Costa Rica:

The figure you gave is a fairly recent development and drug-related.

In 2014, it was 7.59 gun deaths per 100k.

We're not counting suicides here.

Why would we?

[late]

@wat0n

All firearm deaths ...

US:

On a per capita basis, there were 14.6 gun deaths per 100,000 people in 2021 – the highest rate since the early 1990s but still well below the peak of 16.3 gun deaths per 100,000 people in 1974.

Costa Rica:

The figure you gave is a fairly recent development and drug-related.

In 2014, it was 7.59 gun deaths per 100k.

I didn't know cartels had set up business in Costa Rica, that sucks.

We badly need to end the Drug War.