[ThereBeDragons]

Flat Earthers of the world unite - you have nothing to lose but your credulity. And another comparator for you - if I'd been around when the Emperor wore his new clothes, I'd have been the boy who cried out 'But he's starkers, can't you see that??'

It was physicists who discovered that the world is not flat.

Oh, and a theory of mine - The bigger the lie, the more the believers of it there will be.

I suggest you get a science education before you make yourself look any dumber.

There are a variety of textbooks available. It might take a few years, though.

[OllytheBrit]

When you were being taught math did you contradict everything the professor said? How much physics do you know?

Well I was never any good at math(s), but at least I could follow the logic of it because it was there in black and white. Cosmology (in this context) is pure speculative fantasy, with those possessed of the most outrageous imaginations being asked to promulgate it on media outlets - especially the BBC!!

[Rei Murasame]

Do you believe every word you hear without the need to analyse and challenge it? To believe conjecture and supposition rather than the actuality? Gullibility is a characteristic of children and not very bright adults.

I don't think that these guys are doing conjecture or supposition, they are doing research. They have no motive for lying about something like this. If someone thinks that they've found a signature of the 'big bang', and it emerges that he has indeed found it, then it is what it is.

[ThereBeDragons]

Well I was never any good at math(s), but at least I could follow the logic of it because it was there in black and white. Cosmology (in this context) is pure speculative fantasy, with those possessed of the most outrageous imaginations being asked to promulgate it on media outlets - especially the BBC!!

You only consider it "pure speculative fantasy" because you don't understand it. Just because quantum physics is hard does not mean it is untrue.

[OllytheBrit]

It was physicists who discovered that the world is not flat.]I suggest you get a science education before you make yourself look any dumber.

Correction - scientists of the day. And it was easily provable - there's the difference. And gullibility is a form of 'dumb' isn't it?

There are a variety of textbooks available. It might take a few years, though.

I don't have the faintest idea what that's supposed to mean?

[ThereBeDragons]

Correction - scientists of the day. And it was easily provable - there's the difference. And gullibility is a form of 'dumb' isn't it?

Right now you are the one equating "has received a scientific education" with "gullible." This is completely ass-backwards.

I don't have the faintest idea what that's supposed to mean?

It means you should learn some physics before declaring physical theories worthless because they don't make sense to you. If you don't have time for that - which most people don't - you should find someone you trust who does know physics and ask them about it.

[OllytheBrit]

You only consider it "pure speculative fantasy" because you don't understand it.

No I don't understand it, but I can recognise risible nonsense when I hear it. Their condescending talking-to-children 'explanations' might fool you but they don't fool me.

Just because quantum physics is hard does not mean it is untrue.

It's all guesswork fcs! Bloody hell!! 'We think this . . .' 'It might be that . . .' 'Perhaps it was the other . . .' Give me a break!

[ThereBeDragons]

No I don't understand it, but I can recognise risible nonsense when I hear it. Their condescending talking-to-children 'explanations' might fool you but they don't fool me.

Most physics textbooks were not written for children.

It's all guesswork fcs! Bloody hell!! 'We think this . . .' 'It might be that . . .' 'Perhaps it was the other . . .' Give me a break!

Do you know anything about quantum physics? At all? Or even classical physics?

[OllytheBrit]

Right now you are the one equating "has received a scientific education" with "gullible." This is completely ass-backwards.

. . . you should learn some physics before declaring physical theories worthless because they don't make sense to you. If you don't have time for that - which most people don't - you should find someone you trust who does know physics and ask them about it.

You're not one of 'em are you perchance? Well I mean you're putting up such a spirited defence!

[OllytheBrit]

Do you know anything about quantum physics? At all? Or even classical physics?

Like I said - you don't have to be qualified to recognise BS.

[ThereBeDragons]

You're not one of 'em are you perchance? Well I mean you're putting up such a spirited defence!

I was going to be a physicist but a few years into my degree I realized I hated physics.

Like I said - you don't have to be qualified to recognise BS.

If you don't believe in imaginary numbers that's your prerogative. Every engineer, mathematician and physicist in the world will think you are a retard for it, but you can do what you like.

[OllytheBrit]

I don't think that these guys are doing conjecture or supposition, they are doing research. They have no motive for lying about something like this. If someone thinks that they've found a signature of the 'big bang', and it emerges that he has indeed found it, then it is what it is.

'they're doing research' Like 'If only we had more research funding we could find out all the answers to life, the universe and everything. It might take a while though.' (which is what I meant by 'jobs for life' - that's their motive.) Tell me this: Why Mars, which is at the far end of the universe? Why not one step at a time, and begin with closer planets? I'll tell you why - it's because Mars is the one with mystique, and bound to promote more public interest. You might have another theory though??? 'signature of the "big bang' - looks like they've got you already - you're starting to space-babble.

[OllytheBrit]

I was going to be a physicist but a few years into my degree I realized I hated physics.

That could have been a handicap!

If you don't believe in imaginary numbers that's your prerogative. Every engineer, mathematician and physicist in the world will think you are a retard for it, but you can do what you like.

But we're talking here of 'cosmologists'. I know one thing - if the cat ever does get out of the bag, there aren't half gonna be some red faces on this board. Mine won't be one of them though.

[mikema63]

That is a load of tripe, do you know how bad job security is for scientists!

There is barely any money trickling into research, 95% of submitted grants don't get funding, scientists get paid poorly and you never know when a lab is going to close.

Scientists don't go into it for pay or job security, we go into it for the love of science. 99% of the money goes to the freaking equipment anyway.

I've never before encountered such a level of ignorance, you seem to know literally nothing about scientists or the scientific process.

The big bang/expansionist theory of the universe has thousands of observations behind it, each tool and technique used to procure those observations has thousands more. Yet you think you have a better idea and discount scientific theories because they sound funny?

Well lets hear it then, what evidence do you have to disprove the big bang theory? What's your well founded body of evidence to support whatever nonsense it is you believe?

[OllytheBrit]

That is a load of tripe, do you know how bad job security is for scientists!

There is barely any money trickling into research, 95% of submitted grants don't get funding, scientists get paid poorly and you never know when a lab is going to close.

Scientists don't go into it for pay or job security, we go into it for the love of science. 99% of the money goes to the freaking equipment anyway.

I've never before encountered such a level of ignorance, you seem to know literally nothing about scientists or the scientific process.

The big bang/expansionist theory of the universe has thousands of observations behind it, each tool and technique used to procure those observations has thousands more. Yet you think you have a better idea and discount scientific theories because they sound funny?

Well lets hear it then, what evidence do you have to disprove the big bang theory? What's your well founded body of evidence to support whatever nonsense it is you believe?

How many more times - I'm not talking about scientists (for whom I have the greatest respect by the way), I'm talking about those who've recently discovered that they can make an extremely lucrative living merely by speculation, and hypeing up outlandish (I repeat the salient word) non-provable theorising. My conclusions aren't 'ignorant', they're realistic in the extreme.

[ThereBeDragons]

I'm not talking about scientists (for whom I have the greatest respect by the way), I'm talking about those who've recently discovered that they can make an extremely lucrative living merely by speculation, and hypeing up outlandish (I repeat the salient word) non-provable theorising.

Cosmologists are physicists, and physicists are scientists. You are literally talking about scientists.

Theories are not provable. They are simply tested.

[mikema63]

non-provable theorising.

This thread is about them finding evidence for the theory.

[OllytheBrit]

Cosmologists are physicists, and physicists are scientists. You are literally talking about scientists.

Theories are not provable. They are simply tested.[/quote]

Well let them get on with their 'testing' then, and tell us when they've found the answer. We don't need a blow-by-blow account of it,m because as well as being insufferably condescending it's totally meaningless in practical terms too. But in a nutshell my philosophy is this: there are three things to which mankind is destined never to discover the definitive answers - the universe (its extent and what's at its extremity), the cerebral functioning of the human brain, and what there is after our demise.

[ThereBeDragons]

Well let them get on with their 'testing' then, and tell us when they've found the answer. We don't need a blow-by-blow account of it,m because as well as being insufferably condescending it's totally meaningless in practical terms too.

Astronomy is a science where there are no experiments, only observations. Observational science is still science. Theories are created based on observations, and these theories make predictions which are later investigated. Whether they turned out to be accurate or not helps validate or invalidate the theory.

[Decky]

I am a big fan of HS2, it will benefit Birmingham (the greatest city on the face of the earth) and will only fuck over posh people living in the countryside (many of whom will be southern). What is not to like?