[noemon]

Ofc. A tribe with a king.

Are we speaking English here?

Any social group related by kinship with a defined hierarchy, but without written, formalized legal structure is a tribe.

That's the definition.

[Zyx]

Very few people in the world had a formalized written structure.

I doubt that, that is the definition of tribe.

From where did you get it?

[noemon]

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/tribe

A unit of sociopolitical organization consisting of a number of families, clans, or other groups who share a common ancestry and culture and among whom leadership is typically neither formalized nor permanent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tribe

When viewed historically or developmentally, a tribe is a mutual care system which, unlike a kingdom or state or other schema, is oriented around kinship and shared beliefs. Tribes can well exist simultaneously with other schema (see Schema (psychology)) such as states or other systems. They might consist of a social group existing before the development of, or outside of, states

A cohesive(with a defined hierarchy) group of people that is not a state. And what is a state?

A group of people with formalized governing institutions.

[Zyx]

Is Evilive instructing noemon to kill himself or kill me?

noemon,

From your free dictionary, the key word is 'typically.'

From your wiki, the key word is 'unlike.'

There were African states and Kingdoms considered tribes. That's what I am communicating to you.

--

To wit, there is not a single mention of 'written' in either of your definitions.

--

Also, what time is it where you are at?

[noemon]

Is Evilive instructing noemon to kill himself or kill me?

noemon,

From your free dictionary, the key word is 'typically.'

From your wiki, the key word is 'unlike.'

"Unlike" means "not like" states, it is quite explicit that tribes are not states, the dictionary also is explicit that tribes lack formalized governing system, "typically" does not refute that. It asserts that. Do you dispute that tribes are not states?

What do you call a functioning community with no written formalized body of laws? To distinguish it from a state?

There were African states and Kingdoms considered tribes. That's what I am communicating to you.

Why are you communicating this to me?

Did I call an African state, that was a state, a tribe?

You 've said it a gazillion times that westerners have applied the term tribe wrongly to African states without even saying, who to whom did such a thing; and I haven't disputed what you are saying. I merely told you what tribe means, and that I use it for my tribe as well.

To wit, there is not a single mention of 'written' in either of your definitions.

"Written" is implicit to "formalized". How do you formalize gubernatorial statist institutions, without written terms and conditions Zyx?

And the time is 25 to 8 am.

[Zyx]

You 've said it a gazillion times that westerners have applied the term tribe wrongly to African states without even saying, who to whom did such a thing; and I haven't disputed what you are saying. I merely told you what tribe means, and that I use it for my tribe as well.

Alright. The Dahomey or Ashante Kingdoms would be considered "tribes" by the British.

How do you formalize gubernatorial statist institutions, without written terms and conditions Zyx?

It would be oral and responsible to those assigned responsibility. For instance, a storyteller, poet or sage. I'll use a Greek example because it came up in a Physics class, but supposedly the "Homer" story originally was an epic told orally long before it was ever written. Come to think of it, "Romeo and Juliet" may have been oral stories before Shakespeare wrote them down [I don't know, I just know that Shakespeare already had known the stories before writing them.] What I'm saying is that it's possible to store information accurately enough for governmental processes. In feudal societies, not everyone was literate but there were still formalized law systems.

I asked you the time, because I thought you were up very late or something.

[noemon]

It would be oral and responsible to those assigned responsibility.

That is not formal, or a state.

What I'm saying is that it's possible to store information accurately enough for governmental processes.

Did I say "non-functioning" communities? No I said "functioning", ofc communities can function informally, their functioning does not make their system formal.

What you dont(want to) get is that in the case of absence of gubernatorial institutions and formal system, that is called a tribe, in the presence of it "a state".

I dont see any relevance with Homer, or Shakespeare, ofc information can pass down orally, and literate people who posses writing can still be tribes if they lack a state but are a functioning community through informal oral order.

[Zyx]

I can't tell your definition of formal.

If a King makes an oral decree, it's informal to you?

[noemon]

If it has no signature and governing institution to carry out the decree formally...

Ofc its a tribe.

Can you understand, the phrase, "no state structure?"

If a king decrees orally but there is a state structure, its a state.

[Zyx]

That's what I am telling you.

Though without written law, there are state structures within the communities reduced to tribes.

There are Kings, armies, merchants and laws.

[noemon]

Are you disagreeing with the term "tribe" as provided?

Or are you arguing that it has been wrongly applied?

If the second, which is what I make out, I wouldnt be surprised, but dont care either.

[Zyx]

Honestly, I'd disagree with the 'written' requirement.

As for the second part. I was simply saying that it would not be right to call the African tribespeople. Mostly because there were kingdoms and what not with regards it.