[Scamp]

The Catholic Church is very old and has been very powerful. It's not particularly surprising that it's organized in a way that supports a powerful organization.

This is hardly Catholic only behavior, look at any Protestant mega church.

Agreed. I was flipping thru the channels one day and saw a Protestant minister saying that basically anyone could buy a ticket to heaven, if they sent him a check for $899.95.

Preying on the gullible and senile elderly is pitiful in my opinion.

[Bulaba Khan Jones]

There are some really awful preachers out there. This one just about takes the cake:

[youtube]AdH2DGSXjss[/youtube]

They're so unapologetic and brazen about it.

[Hindsite]

Should A Man Of God Own A Private Jet?
Nigerians speak.

[youtube]eXEkKmlzDpk[/youtube]

Televangelist Creflo Dollar asking for $65 million dollars in donations to buy a new private Jet

[youtube]LHbWjTsv8zY[/youtube]

Creflo Dollar responds to the media and internet critics. Creflo says people that have called him out are the devil. He claims a man from the middile east paid for the $65M jet. During the clip Crelfo stated to his congregation" I never asked any of you to pay for anything".

[youtube]puOsH_5Ep_w[/youtube]

Conclusion: Creflo Dollar is not a true man of God.

[Besoeker]

Should A Man Of God Own A Private Jet?


Creflo Dollar responds to the media and internet critics. Creflo says people that have called him out are the devil. He claims a man from the middile east paid for the $65M jet. During the clip Crelfo stated to his congregation" I never asked any of you to pay for anything".

[youtube]puOsH_5Ep_w[/youtube]

Conclusion: Creflo Dollar is not a true man of God.

Thank god I'm an atheist........

[Hindsite]

Thank god I'm an atheist........

Actually, it would be better if you thank God that you are not a false preacher, prophet, or teacher. It would be best if you could thank God you were a born again Christian.

[mikema63]

If I ever see him I'll thank him for being born in a relatively decent situation. That's about it.

[Besoeker]

Thank god I'm an atheist........

Actually, it would be better if you thank God that you are not a false preacher, prophet, or teacher. It would be best if you could thank God you were a born again Christian.

My wit was wasted. No surprise there............

[layman]

Agreed. I was flipping thru the channels one day and saw a Protestant minister saying that basically anyone could buy a ticket to heaven, if they sent him a check for $899.95.

Didnt the whole protestant thing start in the first place to put an end to that

The one time I visited america I decided to put on some american TV in the morning. It was a preacher explaining how beleiving in god had made him rich. God had gifted him with dollars for his faith.

Americas wedding of god and money is one of the most incredible slight of hands in history. I mean there have always been rich and corrupt christians and clergy. They at least made some effort to hide it from the plebs though. Actually making it godly to be rich is frankly incredible.

Impressive!

[Nets]

Americas wedding of god and money is one of the most incredible slight of hands in history. I mean there have always been rich and corrupt christians and clergy. They at least made some effort to hide it from the plebs though. Actually making it godly to be rich is frankly incredible.

America didn't invent Calvinism. The "prosperity gospel" does make some biblical sense, at least in the context of the OT where rewards and punishments were in this world, not the next. I think it just exposes some cognitive dissonance in Christianity. If inequality is unjust, why would God preside over such a world? Since God is good, inequality is just.

[Besoeker]

And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Mat 19:24

[Nets]

But his master answered him, ‘You wicked and slothful servant! You knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I scattered no seed? Then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers, and at my coming I should have received what was my own with interest.

Mat 25:26-27

[Paradigm]

See, this is why cherry-picking Bible verses does a real disservice to the overall message. That the Parable of the Talents, quoted above, is not meant to be taken at face value as an endorsement of capitalism and greed is made pretty clear by the fact that it is immediately followed by the Parable of the Sheep and the Goats, with its rather brutal description of what would to those who fail to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, and visit the sick and incarcerated.

[Deutschmania]

But his master answered him, ‘You wicked and slothful servant! You knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I scattered no seed? Then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers, and at my coming I should have received what was my own with interest.

Mat 25:26-27[/quote] In reply https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+6%3A24&version=NIV. The Bible seems to largely counterbalance itself out. And in order to best get a good quality exegesis , one should follow the principle of "tota scriptura" .

[Rich]

the Bible has a little bit of everything from genocide to pacifism form Samsonite suicide demolition to non violent direct action. Its unlikely Jesus existed but even if he did scholars agree most things attributed to him were put not his mouth by later authors and story tellers. Even if words did go back to him we see how writers have deliberately or carelessly changed their meanings. The Bible is an illusion because no one can point to any time when the documents were agreed upon and their wording defined. It has to be said the Bible is a very odd way for a creator of a universe to communicate his message. Why not use Twitter or Facebook? Why doesn't God create his own web site?

[Besoeker]

See, this is why cherry-picking Bible verses does a real disservice to the overall message.

So you get to pick which bits to accept as the literal truth?

[Pants-of-dog]

Not really, no.

The parts that are accepted as literal truth must, for example, clearly not parables. There are many parables in the Bible which are considered to impart moral truths rather than factual truth. They must also be consistent with scientific evidence, so a literal reading of Genesis is not accpeted as the literal truth. However, some things that contradict science are accepted as literal truth, such as Jesus walking on the water. They are referred to as miracles.

[Besoeker]

Not really, no.

The parts that are accepted as literal truth must, for example, clearly not parables.

So who decides what is literal truth and what isn't?

[Paradigm]

So who decides what is literal truth and what isn't?

A familiarity with different exegetical methods would be a good start. In traditional Judaism, there are four types of exegesis for a text: Peshat (plain meaning), Remez (allegorical or "hints"), Derash (comparative), and Sod (mystical). Even the most hardened literalist would have a tough time arguing that Jesus' parables are meant to be taken as conveying historical information. Nor have I seen anyone argue that the Beast in Revelations refers to a literal seven-headed monster. It's generally accepted that that book is heavily symbolic. Now, as Nets pointed out in another, there are books in the Bible that are clearly meant to be historical in nature, such as Kings or Judges. He describes them as "bad" history because a good deal of the information is unreliable. But I think this also misses the point that historiography has changed, and that history as understood by ancients wasn't necessarily the same kind of pursuit that modern historians engage in. In the case of the Hebrew Bible, it would be more akin to what in the comic book world is known as an "origin story."

[Nets]

He describes them as "bad" history because a good deal of the information is unreliable. But I think this also misses the point that historiography has changed, and that history as understood by ancients wasn't necessarily the same kind of pursuit that modern historians engage in.

It is hard to keep track of where I said what, as this forum has basically become a scattered multi-threaded debate with Hindsite versus the world. I think you are misrepresenting my view though. I definitely said (somewhere) that the way these books are constructed are pretty par for the course with ancient world histories. Greek, Latin, Persian, Hebrew, etc histories all freely mix mythology, legend and historical fact in varying degrees. When I said these were "bad" histories just because today's historians would not find these books reliable and it is very difficult to extract historically reliable information from them (even when it is in fact present). I don't think they were particularly bad for their time. As (I think?) I mentioned in another thread, even the great Herodotus was not immune to relaying the occasional myth here and there. This does not mean he was a bad historian, but it does make the reliability of parts of his works suspect.

[Drlee]

God these atheist, religion bashing hate fests are getting tedious. One thing is certain. The religious naysayers can bring themselves to admit to the enormous good done by religions every day.

But if any of you become homeless, addicted or suffer a mental disability you will rely on churches for just about your entire existence. There is not a soul else that will give a royal fuck about you.

Bash away children. You are oh so wise and oh so bullet proof. Nothing bad could ever happen to you.

By the way:

I

have a friend who is Catholic. He and his wife wanted a divorce. So he went to his Church and told them. They said we do not believe in divorce. My friend said well, I have $10,000. The Church said we do believe in getting an annulment, and your price will be $10,000.

This story is untrue. A pure fabrication. Just thought I would mention that.