[Deutschmania]

Buying dolls for kids to torture and decapitate is also not hurting anyone, but for kids that'd be a bad idea since it normalizes criminal behaviour (torture/killing, despite it not being actual).

I do have sympathy for the paedos who don't act and are aware their feelings are criminalized, but I think therapy and treatment is a better option rather than say 'oh just fuck this doll here, this'll help', when I doubt it would, at least for long.

Strangely enough that sort of thing actually already exists , . And seemingly by your standard , the Addams family might be deemed criminal as well https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NYZ6pPd5kjU . Seriously though , how come violent video games , such as Grand Theft Auto , aren't deemed to be obscene , if a life sized doll is ? Some might even argue that such outlets rather than facilitating such illicit activity instead serves as a catharsis . I suppose that this matter will have to be settled by courts of law , based upon the expert testimony of psychologists .

[mikema63]

Some can argue whatever they like. However evidence from actual psychology research which uses actual evidence instead of supposition shows that pedophilia is a compulsive disorder. Perhaps if generalized aggression was a compulsive dissorder you might have a point that violent games were at all comparable.

However playing a violent video game is not a signifier that you have a deeper dangerous psychological issue. Buying a child sized sex doll ISa signifier of a dangerous mental disorder. You continue to act as if this is the sort of thing that you can just sort of deal with and ought to be accepted. Well, it turns out many of us are against accepting a disorder that leads directly to raping children.

[One Degree]

Some can argue whatever they like. However evidence from actual psychology research which uses actual evidence instead of supposition shows that pedophilia is a compulsive disorder. Perhaps if generalized aggression was a compulsive dissorder you might have a point that violent games were at all comparable.

However playing a violent video game is not a signifier that you have a deeper dangerous psychological issue. Buying a child sized sex doll ISa signifier of a dangerous mental disorder. You continue to act as if this is the sort of thing that you can just sort of deal with and ought to be accepted. Well, it turns out many of us are against accepting a disorder that leads directly to raping children.

But we have no way of knowing if he purchased the doll to relieve his urges or was going to use it as a gag gift.
We don't know, but we are assuming he is practicing for the real thing? That seems illogical for even a crazy person. What the hell does he need to practice? Thought crime.

[mikema63]

1.) If someone buying a child sized sex doll is the best excuse you can come up with then your doing poorly.

2.) Buying a child sex doll for sex marks him as having pedophilia, a dangerous mental disorder which is the leading cause of fucking child rape.

3.) Oh boo hoo we are so mean to the guy who just wants to be left alone to post an ongoing threat of raping children to his entire community. I must be the crazy person for thinking the guy who desires to fuck children should maybe not be allowed near children.

[colliric]

While I do not believe people who argue for the lowering of legal age from maybe 18 to 16 should be punished for that opinion, I do not agree with them.

It most definitely should be illegal to possess a child sex doll, as that doll was created for the purposes of simulated sexual intercourse with an object that looks like a minor. It was created to simulate what is currently a criminal act and in some cases will also be used to create pornography with a tool designed to look like a minor. As this is the simulation of a currently criminal act, and possibly will be recorded, it is illegal and rightfully so. Horror dolls and other pop culture dolls are not used to specifically simulate the criminal act, they are usually used for harmless humourous, collecting or decorative purposes.

I agree with Mike here 100%. Though I still think he was extremely rude to me in the other thread.

[SolarCross]

kudos to @One Degree for taking the principled stand against thought crime.

I have to say that while pedophilia is an outlier pathology it is in some respects comparable to other more common pathologies like murder psychopathy and drug addiction. To purchase a child sex doll, as repugnant as that is to any normal person, is somewhat similar to a heroin addict buying or otherwise taking a heroine substitute like methodone or a psychopath playing violent video games to relieve the psychological pressures they experience in a way that actually does no actual harm or is at least legal. Is it not?

Ask why would a pedophile purchase a doll when they could just abduct or groom / seduce a real child? Surely the answer is that they trying to manage their sickness in a way that conforms to the legal requirements placed on them.

I suppose pure abstinence might be the higher path though.

I've must of killed thousands of virtual people virtually in my recreational activities as a video game warmonger, yet in real life I am remarkably easy going and placid?

Would that really be such a different thing for the virtual pedophile getting nasty with a jumped up barbie? It isn't a real child anymore than the victims of the video gamer.

[Ter]

It most definitely should be illegal to possess a child sex doll, as that doll was created for the purposes of simulated sexual intercourse with an object that looks like a minor.

OK, fine.
What about a story, with words, without drawings or pictures, where minors are depicted in an erotic context?
Canada outlaws those stories but the rest of the world (as far as I know) does not.

We didn't even mention Japan till now, with their manga hentai.
Thoughts?

[mikema63]

Any time and any place we can identify someone with the mental disorder that leads to raping children they should be removed from the general population.

[colliric]

Video games are usually created for artistic, entertainment and humourous purposes.

This thing is created solely for the physical sexual simulation of a criminal act.

Manga hentai should also probably be legally blocked but is allowed because it is not the simulation of the act and is also not usually realistic. It is after all animated.

[anasawad]

@mikema63
Actually the data in hand shows that the mental disorder alone does not lead to child rape or molestation. In matter of fact, if it did as you're constantly saying, the number of child rapes and sex crimes against children in general would be sky high. As i already mentioned, the number of people with this disorder is growing in many countries. Yet crime rates are going down which means that its not only not the sole factor but also not the leading factor in sex crimes against children.

Child rape or molestation is done by mainly 2 groups. 1- People who not only have pedophilia but also were themselves abused or exposed to traumatizing violence as children. 2- And people who generally would rape anyone but chose to rape children due to their weakness. Those tend to rape children, teenagers and even adults alike.

So the argument that the mental disorder is the cause of the rape is proven false by the data in hand.
Rather the data suggest that the disorder only direct the action (rape or sexual harassment) towards children not cause it. As the cause is other mental conditions the criminal has as well.


Now, why should we allow such things and instead of proposing castration or mental institutions, looking for actual treatment for pedophilia ?
Because of sexual frustration. Which in itself as shown again and again in countless cases all over leads to depression, isolation and loneliness, anger, hatred towards society and in some cases end up in the person turning slowly towards violence.
Which means your solution doesn't stop child rape or molestation, but rather inevitably increase its occurrence.

The solution for this problem is to start addressing the problem by doing more research on actual treatments that gets those who have pedophilia to seek help with it instead of scaring them off with proposing castration.
Reducing sexual frustration for those who have it by offering other methods of satisfying their urges without harming or affecting anyone, which such dolls offer.
And finally, offer publicly funded (so being able to afford it or not isn't an issue) psychiatric care not only to those with pedophilia but also specially to those who have it and have been victims of abuse or violence or exposure to violence them selves during their upbringing.

Another relevant but probably not as important recommendation would be to stop sexualizing children all across advertisement and movies, mainly in hollywood.

[SolarCross]

Video games are usually created for artistic, entertainment and humourous purposes.

This thing is created solely for the physical sexual simulation of a criminal act.

Manga hentai should also probably be legally blocked but is allowed because it is not the simulation of the act and is also not usually realistic. It is after all animated.

Video games are created for simulated experience, which requires artistry to make happen, is entertainment for the user and may or may not include humour. The freaky doll is the same in that respect.

Personally I think acts that cause actual harm should be punished with physical severity even lethaly so but virtual acts in which no actual harm is done tto actual people however bizarre and repugnant the subject matter should be allowed.

Punishing the doll users is like punishing drinkers of alcohol-free beer in a country where alcohol consumption is illegal..

[B0ycey]

@B0ycey

I would appreciate if you could at least reference them somewhat. My point was that these dolls allow people to release their own sexual energy in a safe manner.

Fine. I will answer this. Sexual frustration can be relieved with masturbation. You don't need a sex doll to relieve it. If someone is worried they have pedophilia symptoms they can go to the doctors and seek advice. No one should buy a foreign made minor looking doll from the internet (that they must know is illegal and hope not to get caught) because how can they get any help for their problem if they never address it? There is also medical castration - that in my opinion should be mandatory to convicted paedophiles if they want to be released from prison. So there is options for people. This sex doll glorifies pedophilia and somewhat makes it acceptable. That is why they should be illegal.

Furthermore there would be institutions that can help pedophiles control their own urges that would be full of psychologists, psychiatrists, and scientists willing to help them.

If someone openly admits to pedophilia tendencies without enacting on these tendencies and seeks help, they will have all the help they need. They would indeed have access to psychologists and psychiatrists etc. The doll is a gateway to more dangerous offences. By not addressing it and even allowing it, you are not addressing the issue but just brushing it under the carpet and somewhat making it acceptable.

[Oxymandias]

@B0ycey

Sex dolls are essentially masturbation tools. They're comparable to dildos. Would you ban all sex dolls simply because to you, they're not necessary? Currently, as of right now, you cannot do this. Pedophiles will be taken to jail immediately. If you want to stop pedophilia, you need to allow pedophiles to be open to others about their illness. Medical castration should be necessary for all pedophiles when they leave prison. This, I absolutely agree with.

I think you mean child molestation, not pedophilia. Pedophilia is a horrid mental illness that causes people to be harmful to everyone around them and require constant psychological treatment. It's like saying depression shouldn't be acceptable.

I already disproved the statement that "the doll is a gateway to more dangerous offenses" through basic chemistry. So I did address it.

[Political Interest]

The point is, a normal society does not tolerate or give any room to such inclinations in a person. If someone has this problem, it is their responsibility to control it. It cannot be accomodated or mitigated by legalising these sorts of items. The onus is on paedos to control themselves or face the consequences. I do not even have children but I know what must be done to deal with such types of people. The problem is that some people view this as a mental or physiological condition when it is not. It is only as much a condition as a serial killer has a condition. They cannot be tolerated and they cannot be reasoned with. The best way we can help paedos is state sanctioned euthanasia after proper examination by psychiatrists and approval from the judicial system. Of course, I do not advocate this for those who have not offended. If someone has this problem they should volunteer themselves to a psychiatrist. However offenders or anyone found in possession of dolls should be euthanised. The paedos who have not offended should be closely monitored and not allowed anywhere near minors. But I am dead serious, anyone who buys these sorts of dolls should be removed from this world with medical injections.

[Decky]

The point is, a normal society does not tolerate or give any room to such inclinations in a person.

Sadly we live in a capitalist society PI not a normal society. While capitalism exists businessmen will fill any demand, as we speak there are brothels all over the UK filled with women and girls trafficked from abroad by businessmen wanting to make a profit from sexual slavery and this shocks you?

Capitalism is purest evil while it exists this sort of thing will exist legal or illegal, only socialism can bring about decent, moral productive behaviour. Under Corbyn the manufactures and users of these dolls will toil in the Gulags in Stornoway for the rest of their mercifully short lives.

[Igor Antunov]

You guys without avatars, it's really hard to follow who is saying what. An avatar is just a few clicks away.

I've been around full blown criminal pedophiles in the justice system. Sexual compulsion toward children is no more a mental disorder than sexual compulsion toward members of the same or opposite sex. It's just a really lopsided stunted sexuality and it puts vulnerable members of society at risk. You can cure it no more than you can cure any other sexual compulsion. It is hardwired into the brain, and you can't rewire the brain, not yet.

There is a solution, but it involves doing away with the sex drive altogether (chemical castration). Since that is only temporary, (no permanent alteration necessary) I don't see why it should not be applied in almost all cases.

There is also a fantasy solution; where you 'treat' them via psychiatry until they learn to pretend to not want to fiddle kids. That's dangerous because it solves nothing. The urges are still there. The possibility for spontaneous acts on compulsion and subsequent abuse is still there.

As for dolls, dolls are just dolls. Whatever they may represent, and whatever use they may find; they are plastic forged in a steel mould. I'd be much more worried about a non-castrated pedophile without a demented sex doll than with one.

The discussion should really be about what is being done to make these people (catholic church, British government, Hollywood) less of a threat to children. I am of the opinion that a doll serves as an outlet, and while completely inadequate (keyword: castration) it is still far better (on a completely different level of better) than them seeking out child exploitation content online or worse, engaging in child slave-based prostitution (it's bigger than you know-~80 million children are enslaved globally, most in sex/labour rings) and worse than that, raping a child in their neighborhood or family.

[Decky]

[anarchist23]