[Robert Urbanek]

I am guessing Netanyahu’s long-term plan is to push all Palestinians out of the northern half of the Gaza Strip, then keep the IDF there as the occupying force of a wasteland. He won’t invade the southern half. Any rockets still being launched from the southern half will simply be matched by overwhelming and devastating Israeli missile strikes.

[wat0n]

Netanyahu doesn't have any long-term plans for Gaza or anywhere else because he has no future. He's struggling to remain PM for as long as possible, to avoid going to jail for taking bribes.

If he really wants the IDF to stay there indefinitely, he's going to be up for a nasty surprise. I doubt the US will want to undo the Gaza withdrawal of 2005, which was supposed to be permanent, but it doesn't matter - he's fucked either way.

[Beren]

I wouldn't think Netanyahu has a long-term plan, he's only maneuvering to survive politically somehow. His idea to occupy Gaza for an indefinite period of time isn't really a plan, Israel had to leave Gaza once for a reason.

[Rancid]

I guess his plan is to just kill kill kill.

[starman2003]

I wouldn't think Netanyahu has a long-term plan, he's only maneuvering to survive politically somehow. His idea to occupy Gaza for an indefinite period of time isn't really a plan, Israel had to leave Gaza once for a reason.

The difference is now there's a far right regime willing to go to extremes. Especially with elections looming, the US government is too cowardly to take real action to prevent a "final solution" in Gaza or even the West Bank. I think the Israelis want to eradicate Hamas, or a threat from Gaza (and the West Bank too) not only by killing combatants but by driving out the whole arab population. The idea is to drive the population into the southern Gaza Strip, then across the border ( partly by terrorizing them, partly by denying them necessities). Then it'll be the turn of West Bank arabs. Egypt and Jordan staunchly oppose this, but the bottom line is they, like the US government, are too effete to really do anything.

[Skynet]

The difference is now there's a far right regime willing to go to extremes. Especially with elections looming, the US government is too cowardly to take real action to prevent a "final solution" in Gaza or even the West Bank. I think the Israelis want to eradicate Hamas, or a threat from Gaza (and the West Bank too) not only by killing combatants but by driving out the whole arab population. The idea is to drive the population into the southern Gaza Strip, then across the border ( partly by terrorizing them, partly by denying them necessities). Then it'll be the turn of West Bank arabs. Egypt and Jordan staunchly oppose this, but the bottom line is they, like the US government, are too effete to really do anything.

I think also Israel wants to expell all Arabs, which is according Geneva Convention a genocide.

[starman2003]

I think also Israel wants to expell all Arabs, which is according Geneva Convention a genocide.

Sure, it could get rid of Israeli arabs in Israel. If or when the gaza and west bank arabs are evicted the Israeli arabs will feel so unwelcome many may decamp voluntarily...

[Rich]

Netanyahu doesn't have any long-term plans for Gaza or anywhere else because he has no future.

You don't know that. That's just your wishful thinking. The Liberals constantly do this. Putin was supposed to be toast in 6 months, The Taliban were history. Assad was finished. They said it about Boris Johnson. Yes he did go eventually, but it was long after his obituary had been written. Netanyahu might be gone by Christmas, but equally he might still be prime minister in two years time.

He's struggling to remain PM for as long as possible, to avoid going to jail for taking bribes.

If he really wants the IDF to stay there indefinitely, he's going to be up for a nasty surprise. I doubt the US will want to undo the Gaza withdrawal of 2005, which was supposed to be permanent, but it doesn't matter - he's fucked either way.

As I said before Netanyahu sure didn't need this. His coalition is trying to ramp up settlement in East Jerusalem, the West Bank and the Golan. That's quite enough to be going on with. Its Zionist liberals, Zionist moderates, Two-Stateers that want to see Hamas destroyed. It is just not in the Israeli Right's interest to destroy Hamas.

I'm sceptical about the ethnic cleansing of Gaza. I guess we'll have to see if it actually amounts to anything, Netanyahu needs to be seen to be tough, both on Hamas and the people of Gaza. He needs to be seen to have inflicted massive vengeance, massive collective punishment against the Gazan people, while of course allowing Israel's western liberals friends to pretend that its not collective punishment. At the end of the day he must be able to blame the survival of Hamas on Joe Biden and western leaders.

[ingliz]

@Rich

Does it matter?

Israel has been doing the same terrorist shit for 75 years.

The PLA used to be terrorists, Hamas are terrorists, and Hamas 2 (whatever they choose to call themselves) will be terrorists in the future.

Unless America changes its long-standing policy of propping up an ethno-nationalist Jewish state in Palestine and starts putting its money and clout where its mouth is on a two-state solution, there is no incentive for Israel or Hamas to change their ways.

[wat0n]

You don't know that. That's just your wishful thinking. The Liberals constantly do this. Putin was supposed to be toast in 6 months, The Taliban were history. Assad was finished. They said it about Boris Johnson. Yes he did go eventually, but it was long after his obituary had been written. Netanyahu might be gone by Christmas, but equally he might still be prime minister in two years time.

I don't know about that? So what's his long term plan for Gaza? Netanyahu doesn't even have a clear narrative, he's both said he wants to hand Gaza to an international force and that he wants Israel to occupy Gaza permanently. That's exactly how "not having a plan" looks like to me.

As I said before Netanyahu sure didn't need this. His coalition is trying to ramp up settlement in East Jerusalem, the West Bank and the Golan. That's quite enough to be going on with. Its Zionist liberals, Zionist moderates, Two-Stateers that want to see Hamas destroyed. It is just not in the Israeli Right's interest to destroy Hamas.

I'm sceptical about the ethnic cleansing of Gaza. I guess we'll have to see if it actually amounts to anything, Netanyahu needs to be seen to be tough, both on Hamas and the people of Gaza. He needs to be seen to have inflicted massive vengeance, massive collective punishment against the Gazan people, while of course allowing Israel's western liberals friends to pretend that its not collective punishment. At the end of the day he must be able to blame the survival of Hamas on Joe Biden and western leaders.

He needs to remain as PM for as long as possible and find a way to evade Israeli justice for his corruption cases. I don't think he's got a way to do that.

[Rich]

I don't know about that?

That Netanyahu has no future. This seems to be the liberal Zionist message to the Palestinians. Don't worry about Netanyahu. Just meekly accept subjugation. Allow the compassionate armed forces of Israel to reoccupy your territory. Netanyahu will extirpate Hamas and then his time in government will be done. An international force will come into police Gaza, liberal Zionists will retake power in Israel and we will move rapidly to giving the Palestinians a state of their own.

I don't know whether Netanyahu has meaningful long term plans, but I'm pretty sure that he and his coalition have short and medium plans that will be moving further away from a Palestinian state not towards one. I'm pretty sure they have short and medium term plans to create facts on the ground that will be difficult if not impossible for future Israeli governments to undo.

[wat0n]

That Netanyahu has no future. This seems to be the liberal Zionist message to the Palestinians. Don't worry about Netanyahu. Just meekly accept subjugation. Allow the compassionate armed forces of Israel to reoccupy your territory. Netanyahu will extirpate Hamas and then his time in government will be done. An international force will come into police Gaza, liberal Zionists will retake power in Israel and we will move rapidly to giving the Palestinians a state of their own.

I don't know whether Netanyahu has meaningful long term plans, but I'm pretty sure that he and his coalition have short and medium plans that will be moving further away from a Palestinian state not towards one. I'm pretty sure they have short and medium term plans to create facts on the ground that will be difficult if not impossible for future Israeli governments to undo.

Let's wait and see just how fast Netanyahu is kicked out as PM. Most Israelis are blaming him for the security failure of October 7.

[Tailz]

Israel's far-right Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich called for Palestinians to leave Gaza and make way for Israelis who could "make the desert bloom".

Kinda says it all…

[starman2003]

Let's wait and see just how fast Netanyahu is kicked out as PM. Most Israelis are blaming him for the security failure of October 7.

The other day he said he won't resign after the war with Hamas ends. Only 15% of the people want him to continue as PM; not sure if that'll daunt him.

[wat0n]

The other day he said he won't resign after the war with Hamas ends. Only 15% of the people want him to continue as PM; not sure if that'll daunt him.

The moment the war ends, or at least reaches a lower intensity phase, Israelis themselves will demand his ouster. Netanyahu is currently in a national unity government but what will happen when the larger opposition parties quit?

The Israeli Supreme Court already threw his judicial reform away, which I think is suggestive of what's going to start happening to his government.

[starman2003]

The moment the war ends, or at least reaches a lower intensity phase, Israelis themselves will demand his ouster. Netanyahu is currently in a national unity government but what will happen when the larger opposition parties quit?

He could still hold on with his original far-right 64 assuming he can still hold them. To do that he may have to give in to certain proposals from Smotrich et al…Did you hear about the alleged talks aimed at transferring Palestinians from Gaza to the Congo?

The Israeli Supreme Court already threw his judicial reform away, which I think is suggestive of what's going to start happening to his government.

Maybe but there's been talk of Bibi & co fighting back.

[wat0n]

He could still hold on with his original far-right 64 assuming he can still hold them. To do that he may have to give in to certain proposals from Smotrich et al…Did you hear about the alleged talks aimed at transferring Palestinians from Gaza to the Congo?

What makes you think the original coalition will hold? It's unlikely to survive a major protest over the government's incompetence leading to October 7.

Maybe but there's been talk of Bibi & co fighting back.

That ship already sailed. I think the court will now rule if the law aiming to shield Netanyahu from prosecution is constitutional.

[starman2003]

What makes you think the original coalition will hold? It's unlikely to survive a major protest over the government's incompetence leading to October 7.

It survived mass protests for months prior to that. I'm to sure how the war will turn out but if Hamas is eliminated and the palestinians are sent elsewhere, that could mitigate the disgrace of the 7th.

That ship already sailed. I think the court will now rule if the law aiming to shield Netanyahu from prosecution is constitutional.

Suppose they say it isn't. Bibi has been hounded by charges for years. Hasn't stopped him from governing.

[wat0n]

It survived mass protests for months prior to that. I'm to sure how the war will turn out but if Hamas is eliminated and the palestinians are sent elsewhere, that could mitigate the disgrace of the 7th.

It barely survived those protests, though. These ones will be larger, since the topic isn't as divisive as the judicial reform. Most Israelis believe Netanyahu has to go.

Suppose they say it isn't. Bibi has been hounded by charges for years. Hasn't stopped him from governing.

If it isn't constitutional, the corruption trials will resume in full force. A single guilty verdict would have him out as PM.

[Rancid]

I think the slow motion genocide description is very fitting here.