[Rugoz]

Why do you think no one else is interested in this topic?

Because of stupid statements such as this one:

So since money became fully fake around 1971 with the end of bretton woods the ordinary working men and women are getting cumulatively robbed by the money counterfeiters in government. This is the chiefest reason why gen x and millennials are so relatively crushed financially compared with preceding generations such as the boomers. What counter-measures and defenses can people do to protect themselves from this robbery?

And because it's a total non-issue. If inflation is 1% higher then nominal interest rates will be 1% higher (ceteris paribus)*. Something you can easily verify by looking at assets in currencies with different inflation rates, e.g. government bond yields of Japan and the US. Inflation becomes a problem if it is unpredictable.

* in the case of a non-liquid assets. The more liquid assets you hold, the more you'll be affected by the inflation tax.

[SolarCross]

^ this is not a non-issue, it is the greatest robbery in human history.

[Steve_American]

@SolarCross, in reply to the OP.
There is no inflation [let along hyperinflation] now. There is no sign of any in the near future.
The Fed. Res. is probably going to raise interest rates to fight the non-existent inflation; so inflation is unlikely to start.

The following video is one guy's take on the causes of the inflation of the 60s and early 70s. And he predicts no inflation in the future for decades to come. His thinking is based on demographics.
. . The inflation of the 60s [he says] was caused by the Baby Boomers starting their working life and starting families. When they moved away from home they needed to buy 1 or more of everything [house, car, couch, bed, refrig, washing machine, set of dishes, etc.]. This created a lot of effective demand that the corps. had not anticipated. The combination of this demand [which created shortages] and the strong unions giving the workers the cash to buy the stuff is what caused the inflation. He says.
. . He says that the Baby Boomers are retiring now and retired people [and older people in general] spend less. The younger generations have low wages and are deeply in debt so they can't spend more.
. . Therefore, he says there will be no inflation for a few decades.

The clip's Intro text.
"In this hard-hitting Real Vision special, Raoul Pal presents the single most important financial topic of a generation — the Baby Boomer retirement crisis. He asks the hard questions: Can you afford to retire? How will the coming crisis impact your life? What risks are you unknowingly taking with your retirement? Moreover, will the insufficient retirement savings of the largest generation in history cripple the economy? Raoul also explores how savvy retirees might avoid — and even profit from — the threatening crisis. In addition, Raoul also offers a glimpse of a brighter future, in which smart millennials take control of their own financial destiny and side-step the crisis."

Be warned, he talks about a lot of other stuff. Some of it might interest you more than it did me because I'm already retired and have moved to SE Asia to make our SS checks go 3 times further.

.

[Steve_American]

Because of stupid statements such as this one:

[The quote was snipped.]

And because it's a total non-issue. If inflation is 1% higher then nominal interest rates will be 1% higher (ceteris paribus)*. Something you can easily verify by looking at assets in currencies with different inflation rates, e.g. government bond yields of Japan and the US. Inflation becomes a problem if it is unpredictable.

* in the case of a non-liquid assets. The more liquid assets you hold, the more you'll be affected by the inflation tax.

Rugoz, I do not think that the reason workers have been doing poorly for the last 40 years is not because of inflation caused by the fiat dollar.
Rather, the problem is mostly free trade agreements and the lack of enforcement of the old labor laws that were not repealed, just ignored. Also, by the lack of anti-trust law enforcement, they also have been ignored. This let many monopolies be created that can over charge for their products.
All this led to massive inequality.

[Rugoz]

^ this is not a non-issue, it is the greatest robbery in human history.

This has nothing to do with inflation. You're looking at the median income, meaning 50% of American families have less than that and 50% have more. It lags productivity growth because income inequality has increased substantially. The average income will grow with productivity.

[SolarCross]

This has nothing to do with inflation. You're looking at the median income, meaning 50% of American families have less than that and 50% have more. It lags productivity growth because income inequality has increased substantially. The average income will grow with productivity.

Yes it does because the helicopter money doesn't get distributed equally.

[Rugoz]

Yes it does because the helicopter money doesn't get distributed equally.

Helicopter money doesn't even exist in the US.

You could argue an inflation tax is potentially regressive, since poorer households hold a larger share of their wealth in liquid assets (such as cash), but I'm not sure that is actually the case. Besides, poorer households are less wealthy, obviously, hence are less affected. Either way, it is absolutely negligible compared to other forms of taxation, which are largely progressive.

You graph shows income by the way, labor income making up most of it. It's labor income that has become more unequal in particular.

[SolarCross]

Helicopter money doesn't even exist in the US.

You could argue an inflation tax is potentially regressive, since poorer households hold a larger share of their wealth in liquid assets (such as cash), but I'm not sure that is actually the case. Besides, poorer households are less wealthy, obviously, hence are less affected. Either way, it is absolutely negligible compared to other forms of taxation, which are largely progressive.

You graph shows income by the way, labor income making up most of it. It's labor income that has become more unequal in particular.

The fake money doesn't get distributed equally ergo it is a theft of value from those who don't get it to those that do (bankers in the first instance). Those million dollar bonuses they pay themselves for doing nothing is all fake money.

[Steve_American]

@Rugoz,
What am I, chopped liver?
I explained that for most of the last 40 years inflation has been under control.
The problem that led to Solar Cross's graph is the flat real wages of most workers. And you have not replied to me yet.
Only the top 10% of incomes (salaries) have seen real income growth, and of course the top 1% and even more the top 0.1% have seen the most growth.
Averages are pretty much meaningless here. The huge growth of the incomes of the top 10% pull the average way up. And those people don't spend their income and add to the GDP growth. They invest it, often overseas.
It is like dividing the nation's GDP by its population to get the average income per capita. And saying the average family of 4 has an income of $50,000 x 4 = $200,000, so therefore, the average American family is doing very well. When the median family income is more like $50,000 or less. It is an example of using numbers to lie.

[SolarCross]

@Steve_American
Inflation is not under control, the tidal wave that is building up in the fake assets & debts of the central banking system and its commercial dependents is mindbogglingly vast but most of it is not circulating in "main st" so main streets prices are only experiencing a trickle of inflation but when the two collide main st will be flooded.

http://demonocracy.info/infographics/wo ... ramid.html



---------------

Federal Reserve's Money Printing Failure

Welcome to Wall Street, the capital of the free market. It is full of semi trucks today.
$160 Billion of bankers' 2012 bonus (QE3) has arrived from the Federal Reserve by 80 semi trucks, and hoards of fork-lifts are working hard to unload the
2012's $40 Billion / month bank stimulus package (QE3) into headquarters of the biggest banks in America-
JP Morgan Chase, CitiBank, Bank of America, Goldman Sachs, HSBC, Wells Fargo, Morgan Stanley, State Street Financial and Bank of New York Mellon.

The 2013's stimulus package (QE3) of $1020 Billion Dollars has been nicely stacked on the far right side, awaiting 2013.

Each economic boost through money printing (QE1, QE2, QE3) has diminishing effects, that appear to follow the Fibonacci equation. This implies that the Federal Reserve is now caught in a perpetual cycle where it has to print near exponentially more money just to maintain same stock market performance level, not mentioning inflation. .

Verdict: Truck drivers and fork-lift operators on Wall Street have good job security as QE4 is now a certainty.

The money printed by the Federal Reserve does not end up the hands of the people, but goes directly to the banks, though whom it ends up in the stock market in order to inflate asset values. This pushes the Dow Jones Industrial Average and S&P higher, but does NOT increase hiring and above all consumer spending, which is one of the main drivers of the US economy.

Money print QE3 is equivalent to 20.4 million jobs paying $50,000 / year. Instead the money goes to Wall Street and the stock market.

[Steve_American]

@Steve_American
Inflation is not under control, the tidal wave that is building up in the fake assets & debts of the central banking system and its commercial dependents is mindbogglingly vast but most of it is not circulating in "main st" so main streets prices are only experiencing a trickle of inflation but when the two collide main st will be flooded.

http://demonocracy.info/infographics/wo ... ramid.html

[img[http://demonocracy.info/infographics/world/lqp/images/demonocracy-liquidity_pyramid-derivatives-03-giant-2.jpg[/img]

---------------

Federal Reserve's Money Printing Failure

So, let me get this straight.
Yes, there is a huge amount of dollars around that have been invested in the stock market and real estate market. Because they are invested in those 2 markets there is a bubble in both.
Yes, there will pretty soon be a huge market correction and recession.

Now, your claim is that the investors are not going to find a different place to invest the dollars that they get when they cash out of the stock or real estate markets. Instead of that they are going to buy a whole lot of stuff that they don't need and this will drive up the prices for the rest of us.

I really, really doubt that that will happen. The middle of a recession is a strange time to see hyperinflation. Generally, all that new spending would end the recession in the blink of an eye.
Investors don't cash out and go on a consumer goods buying spree.

Do you have any evidence of or even coherent argument for why investors will do that soon?

Did you look at the other thread where I posted a guy arguing that there will be a "retirement crisis" soon? He talks about inflation and says it will not happen for decades.

[SueDeNîmes]

@Steve_American
Inflation is not under control, the tidal wave that is building up in the fake assets & debts of the central banking system and its commercial dependents is mindbogglingly vast but most of it is not circulating in "main st" so main streets prices are only experiencing a trickle of inflation but when the two collide main st will be flooded.

http://demonocracy.info/infographics/wo ... ramid.html



---------------

Federal Reserve's Money Printing Failure

The article says precisely the opposite. QE is central banks buying (actually swapping for reserves) existing treasury bonds from the private sector. Insofar as it's money creation, it's money creation that will have very little impact on main street :

"The money printed by the Federal Reserve does not end up the hands of the people, but goes directly to the banks, though whom it ends up in the stock market in order to inflate asset values. This pushes the Dow Jones Industrial Average and S&P higher, but does NOT increase hiring and above all consumer spending, which is one of the main drivers of the US economy."

[SolarCross]

The bankers are not hermetically sealed from the rest of the economy, when they print up their fake money they take a cut and then buy a fancy house, fancy cars, stocks and eat in fancy restaurants. All that stuff is produced by main street.

The hyperinflation has already happened it just hasn't reached main street yet, and don't forget more than half of that hyperinflation has been exported to other countries.

The recession will be temporary it will happen because of the inflation and it will cause deflation because the rising prices from the leaking fake money will cause main st to become fearful of spending and frugal. The money velocity in the hands of the people who actually produce goods and services will go down. The central bank will try to fix this the only way they know how by more money printing, the velocity will pick up and then all that fake money will destroy its value in a hyperinflation.

At this point the US dollar could take the rest of the world down with it too.

[Rancid]

The hyperinflation has already happened it just hasn't reached main street yet, and don't forget more than half of that hyperinflation has been exported to other countries.

I'd like to see more elaboration on this statement.

[SolarCross]

I'd like to see more elaboration on this statement.

Back during bretton woods the US dollar was backed by gold. People had, saved and spent paper dollars which could be redeemed for a given amount of gold kept by the feds. But of course the feds being crooks they counterfieted those paper dollars so that there were far more paper dollars in existence than there was gold kept in trust.

When people started realising the paper dollars were debased they started redeeming them for gold en masse and the fed's gold reserve started being diminished to the point where they would have no gold left to cover all the rubber cheques they are written.

So then the feds pushed Nixon to tear up bretton woods, (effectively stealing all the remaining gold held in trust). Paper dollars should have disappeared in value entirely at that point but the feds doubled down on the scam and somehow persuaded the whole world to peg their also fake money to the dollar and to get the oil producing countries to only accept dollars for oil. Thus an artificial demand was created which saved the dollar from complete collapse. But that didn't stop the printing of fake money, that only escalated but now sizable chunks of it were spent abroad. So the impact of US dollar debasement is spread out all over the world.

------

Also for various reasons the world holding US dollars are increasingly trying to avoid using the USD and to offload the vast stacks of it they have accumulated. Once again people are waking up to the scam. Those dollars abroad will not be destroyed though, but likely they will return to the US as people try to spend them away. That in itself will result in a hyperinflation in the US domestically.

[Rancid]

You said there is hyper inflation. WHere is it?

[SolarCross]

You said there is hyper inflation. WHere is it?

The money supply is exponentially bigger than it was pre-1971 but now it is spread all over the world. Expanded money supply causes hyperinflation as soon as that expanded money gets into circulation and picks up velocity. That is what I mean the cause of the hyperinflation has already happened it is just that the full extent has not fully materialised yet but it will. Precursors to the near future blow out of the US dollar can be seen in the real estate and stock market bubbles. House did not become more valuable over time, houses are naturally deprecating assets, there was just increasingly large amounts of fake money chasing the prices up. Same with stock market but all that is just the beginning.

[Rancid]

The money supply is exponentially bigger than it was pre-1971 but now it is spread all over the world. Expanded money supply causes hyperinflation as soon as that expanded money gets into circulation and picks up velocity. That is what I mean the cause of the hyperinflation has already happened it is just that the full extent has not fully materialised yet but it will. Precursors to the near future blow out of the US dollar can be seen in the real estate and stock market bubbles. House did not become more valuable over time, houses are naturally deprecating assets, there was just increasingly large amounts of fake money chasing the prices up. Same with stock market but all that is just the beginning.

Why hasn't it meterialized?

[SueDeNîmes]

n/m

[quetzalcoatl]

I agree with #1 and #2.

I am hesitant about #3, probably because of my accelerationist tendencies.

#4.....Have the means to protect those assets and have other resources available that are of value. Like Liquor, Canned Goods, Ammo, AntiBiotics, Recreational Drugs, Porno (just kidding, sorta), etc..

#5. Take an Agorist approach, bypass the major fiat economy by involving yourself in micro-economies, the dark web (using block-chain, and crypto), black markets, local trade involving bartering goods and services.

If you're a true accelerationist, you'll want to go with a deflationary holocaust. Forget hyperinflation or even slow inflation.

Deflation is the real thing. The psychological effects last a generation or more. Cash becomes rare like gold. It encourages communal cooperation and a localized barter economy.