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#1256734
Much sympathy goes to German fellows.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,490795,00.html
It's not the first time the Polish weekly Wprost has gotten in trouble in Germany. This week, the cover depicts Chancellor Angela Merkel breast-feeding the Kaczynski twins. But it could have been worse, the editor-in-chief points out. At least they used a 21-year-old model.

"Europe's Step-Mother:" Polish magazine Wprostdoes it again.
It's not exactly how one expects to see German Chancellor Angela Merkel: The broad, friendly smile seems completely at odds with her open blouse, two bare breasts spilling out. On each breast, one of Poland's governing Kaczynski twins is affixed -- Prime Minister Jaroslaw is suckling on the left, President Lech has attached himself to the right. One of them is holding up the "victory" sign right in Merkel's cleavage.

The image is on the cover of this week's Wprost, a conservative Polish newsmagazine that has not shied away from firing barbs at Germany in the past. The headline reads: "Europe's Step-Mother." As current holder of the EU's rotating presidency, Merkel, the magazine seems to be saying, is treating the rest of Europe like her step-children. And during last week's EU summit in Brussels, the article inside makes clear, she has been particularly condescending to the Poles. The magazine writes of Germany's "post-colonial reflexes" and says that six decades after the end of World War II, "the Germans still aren't able to treat Poles like partners."

"The cover's message," Stanislaw Janecki, editor-in-chief of Wprost, told SPIEGEL ONLINE, "is that Germany, especially Ms. Merkel, was trying to treat Poles and the Polish leaders as small children completely unable to act on their own and somehow dependent on Germany.... There is the impression that Germany, being more powerful, wants to dominate Poland and that the Kaczynski brothers want to stand up to this domination."


I thought I had not to add any comment.
By Torwan
#1256793
Where is Shade2 to use his Hitler-and-Masterrace-club on this?

@Smith:
Thanks for the sympathy.

But what can you expect? Finally, a EU President is trying to get something done instead of pushing it to the next EU President, forces the issue a little - and the Poles use the Hitler-and-Masterrace-club instead of using real arguments to support their position. Really poor.
By Shade2
#1256912

I thought I had not to add any comment.

Funny, when German press using the worst stereotypes of Nazi propaganda presented Poland as "creation of Pilsudski" and our leaders as being unhuman, then Germans were first to claim "Freedom of Press" "Right of political satire". When Poles critise German attempts to bully Europe then its all outrage.

Finally, a EU President is trying to get something done instead of pushing it to the next EU President

Nice cloak and dagger attempt-fact when German leader tries to force EU into being German playground.

and the Poles use the Hitler-and-Masterrace-club instead of using real arguments to support their position.

Yeah, because nothing would suit Germans more then Poles forgetting what German did and praising Germany for being superior "Europeans" that are gooddy-gooddy(and not funding organisations created by Nazis that allow sale of Waffen SS marches, not refusing to pay war reperations etc). And of course Germany never exterminated Polish population so that now we are at disadvantage.

Really poor.

Yeah, so poor, evil Kaczynskis spoil German goodfeeling about themselfs. I am almost crying.
By Smith
#1257093
somehow dependent on Germany

Nobody in Europe depends on Germany's economy. Everyone knows it. Actually nobody depends on nobody. Besides Germany's economy is so negligeable. Germany contributes to the Union's budget so poorly.

There is the impression that Germany, being more powerful, wants to dominate Poland and that the Kaczynski brothers want to stand up to this domination.

This is called susceptibility. The problem is when susceptibility is a habit that much noise escorts, rather than anything commanding respect. Let's called this vain loudmouth. The Poles are World champions.

The French follow.

The Germans make no noise, and manufacture Mercedes-Benzes. They silently watch U.S.-made bashing movies all the time as well.

Shade2, do me a favor, go see a shrink, or find yourself someone who'd help you manifest some affect, rather (note that I don't refer to either Torwan or myself) than irrational aggressiveness-based rhetoric.
Last edited by Smith on 03 Jul 2007 21:04, edited 1 time in total.
By Shade2
#1257145
Nobody in Europe depends on Germany's economy.

Yes nobody. All countries in Europe can easly survive without Germany.

Besides Germany's economy is so negligeable.

Indeed-the world and Europe can live without German economy.

Germany contributes to the Union's budget so poorly.

True-considering the amount of devestation Germany did due to its agression and attempts to exterminate whole nations it contributes quite poorly-especially as it trie to use it to push its own interests.

Let's called it vain loudmouth. The Poles are World champions.

Oh goody, an attack against Poles by German defender ? Do you miss Hitler ? After he tried to "silence" Poles didn't he ?

Shade2, do me a favor, go see a shrink

Why ? You believe as a Pole I am sick ?
The Germans make no noise

You got to be joking. I watch German media. They whine all the time. Whine, whine whine.How poor, mistreated Germany is so enlightened, has dealt so wonderfull with its past(somehow the issue of election of criminals that murdered Poles for posts by society never comes up, or the war reperations), how the glorious Germans are so much better then Americans, how evil Poles are so ungratefull that Germany will accept Poland becoming a German vassal, how Not-One-German supported Hitler, how Poor-Germans were harmed due WW2, and how well the Exceptional-Germans have dealt with everything in Europe, so much better then all the other Europeans.
Its really a big joke, they are so full of nationalism.
By Smith
#1257178
Why ? You believe as a Pole I am sick ?

Oh no. It's something different. But you don't want to know.
By Shade2
#1257182
It's something different. But you don't want to know.

I am an untermensch ? My sickness can only be purged by gas chamber ?
Last edited by Shade2 on 03 Jul 2007 21:22, edited 1 time in total.
By Smith
#1257185
'Forgot to add: you don't really add much subtlety nor any sophistication to the exchanges of this forum; sadly.

I'm referring to my first § dated July 3, 7:59 pm.

You're a rough horse on top of that!

Go hide somewhere.
By Shade2
#1257189
You're a rough horse on top of that!

Oh how "cute", you always have the need to portay Poles you speak to as animals ? Where from does this need come I wonder ?


Go hide somewhere.

I'm afraid the times when Poles had to hide from people comparing them to animals ended in 1945 ?
By Cyricus
#1257193
Shade2 wrote:... bla bla bla ... Germans are evil ... bla bla ... *and praising Germany for being superior "Europeans" that are gooddy-gooddy(and not funding organisations created by Nazis that allow sale of Waffen SS marches, not refusing to pay war reperations etc)* ... bla bla

Shade2, you probably don't realize it, but it was Germany along with France, Italy, Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg who are responsible for creating the EU in the first place (ECSC in 1951, EEC in 1957) . You guys wanted to join, not the other way 'round. ^^

Besides, you seem pretty eager to ignore the fact that Germany paid around $20 billion to the victors after WW2, not even counting lost patents (intellectual power). The Soviet Union was supposed to allocate 15% of the war reparations to Poland, something which never happened. Now however you blame Germany for something the SU didn't do? Amusing ;)


Anway ... and this makes me laugh indeed:

Shade2 wrote:Yes nobody. All countries in Europe can easly survive without Germany.

Polish Export Partners:

Germany 28.2%, France 6.2%, Italy 6.1%, UK 5.6%, Czech Republic 4.6%, Russia 4.4%, Netherlands 4.2% (2005)

Polish Imports Partners:
Germany 29.6%, Russia 8.7%, Italy 6.6%, Netherlands 5.9%, France 5.7% (2005)

Source: https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... os/pl.html



Guess what, this isn't much different for the rest of Europe. Germany is the leading export country on this planet and almost all Europe is relying on its goods, especially its border countries (including, but not limitied to, Poland).


Shade2 wrote:Indeed-the world and Europe can live without German economy.

*chuckle*

Germany is the World Export Champion

1 World $ 12,440,000,000,000 2004 est.
2 European Union $ 1,330,000,000,000 2005
3 Germany $ 1,133,000,000,000 2006 est.
4 United States $ 1,024,000,000,000 2006 est.
5 China $ 974,000,000,000 2006 est.

Source: https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... 8rank.html


Shade wrote:True-considering the amount of devestation Germany did due to its agression and attempts to exterminate whole nations it contributes quite poorly-especially as it trie to use it to push its own interests.

European Commission estimates for net budget balances
as % of GNI (average 2008-2013)

Net beneficiaries

Luxembourg 5.83
Latvia 4.44
Lithuania 4.43
Poland 3.79
Estonia 3.78
Slovakia 3.30
Czech Republic 3.20
Hungary 3.09
Greece 2.19
Portugal 1.53
Slovenia 1.33
Belgium 1.26
Malta 1.09
Ireland 0.50
Spain 0.25



Net payers

Netherlands -0.50
Germany -0.49
Sweden -0.46
United Kingdom -0.46
Austria -0.41
Italy -0.36
France -0.34
Cyprus -0.34
Denmark -0.26
Finland -0.20


GNI = Gross National Income


Or if you want some actual numbers: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4079316.stm

We did pay more than 8 billion US dollar in 2003 ... one could argue Germany is still paying war reparation by financing the new Eastern EU member states which are benefitting from a million different forms of EU subsidies.


Shade2 wrote:Why ? You believe as a Pole I am sick ?

My name isn't Smith but i daresay you *are* sick, suffering from extreme Germanophobia. Instead of concentrating on internal problems (Poland) and discussing them here, almost every post you make is based and centered on anti-German rhetorics. Thankfully not every Pole shares your attitude, in fact most Poles i know are bright fellows and coworkers on the global market.
User avatar
By Theodore
#1257194
The article wrote:It's not exactly how one expects to see German Chancellor Angela Merkel: The broad, friendly smile seems completely at odds with her open blouse, two bare breasts spilling out. On each breast, one of Poland's governing Kaczynski twins is affixed -- Prime Minister Jaroslaw is suckling on the left, President Lech has attached himself to the right. One of them is holding up the "victory" sign right in Merkel's cleavage.

[...]

"The cover's message," Stanislaw Janecki, editor-in-chief of Wprost, told SPIEGEL ONLINE, "is that Germany, especially Ms. Merkel, was trying to treat Poles and the Polish leaders as small children completely unable to act on their own and somehow dependent on Germany.... There is the impression that Germany, being more powerful, wants to dominate Poland and that the Kaczynski brothers want to stand up to this domination."


Is it just me or has the cover, its crudeness aside, completely failed at conveying its point?

Shade2 wrote:And of course Germany never exterminated Polish population so that now we are at disadvantage.


First of all, the FRG is hardly the Third Reich. Second, if you're so set on correcting past wrongs, how many seats do you think Lithuania should have? I mean, if a large portion of their population hadn't become Polonised we can only guess how many votes they'd have today.

Shade2 wrote:how evil Poles are so ungratefull that Germany will accept Poland becoming a German vassal


Not having a ridiculous advantage in the vote procedure unwarranted by the statistics is being a vassal? I guess Germany has a lot of vassals.

Shade2 wrote:Oh how "cute", you always have the need to portay Poles you speak to as animals ?


Do you always have a need to portray those who disagree with you as racists?
By Shade2
#1257203
Second, if you're so set on correcting past wrongs, how many seats do you think Lithuania should have? I mean, if a large portion of their population hadn't become Polonised we can only guess how many votes they'd have today.

Your attempt to compare cultural assimiliation to genocide made by German state is disgusting. Poland never engaged in an attempt to exterminate Lithuanians like Germany engaged towards Poles. Also Poland didn't mention votes lost of Poles assimiliated in previous centuries by Germany.
Poland also didn't demand votes based on population losses-only noticed that such decisions favours Germany which mass murdered Poles and harms Poland which was mass murdered by Germans.

Not having a ridiculous advantage in the vote procedure unwarranted by the statistics is being a vassal?

Are you always that ignorant ? Poland never demanded votes based on population losses by German mass murder. It demanded more proporationate voting system.
Do you always have a need to portray those who disagree with you as racists?

I don't need to. By comparing me to an animal they show their views, even if they exist on subconscious level.


Shade2, you probably don't realize it, but it was Germany along with France, Italy, Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg who are responsible for creating the EU in the first plac

So failed imperialist powers Italy, France and Germany created EU ?


Cyricus

Shade2 wrote:
... bla bla bla ... Germans are evil

Your attempt to show the trutfull statements about how Germany mass murdered Poles and how it ruined my country as irrelevent shows perfectly the nationalistic arrogance and unwillingess to deal with the past that exists within German society.


You guys wanted to join, not the other way 'round. ^^

If it wasn't for German attempt to erase Polish state from the map and Soviet occupation due to German war and Germany never paying its reperations towards what it destroyed we wouldn't need EU to rebuilt our economy.

Besides, you seem pretty eager to ignore the fact that Germany paid around $20 billion to the victors after WW2

I am not interested in other countries-Poland was country most devestated by the war and Germany never paid anything to us.
the Soviet Union was supposed to allocate 15% of the war reparations to Poland

German nationalism shows its arrogance. Why should Poland care for treaties signed with Soviet Union by Germany ? Poland is a seperate state-something Germans have trouble understanding.

How however you blame Germany for something the SU didn't do? Amusing Wink
The only thing that is amusing is your ignorance to the fact that Poland wasn't part of Soviet Union but seperate state. Treaties between Germany and Soviet Union are of no relevence to Polish demands since it is a completely different state. Blame yourself if you aren't able to take Poland as a state.


Anway ... and this makes me laugh indeed:

Why ? You are that ignorant to believe without Germany world will fall ? New markets would be found, new trade routes established. Germany is not the center of the world, despite what Hitler might believe. Or other Germans.

Germany is the leading export country on this planet and almost all Europe is relying on its goods, especially its border countries (including, but not limitied to, Poland)
.
Logical error-Germany might be the leading export country on the planet, but it is only a small part of global economy. The World can easly survive without German porn, vomit tasting food or polluting cars.
Germany is the World Export Champion

In Genocide it sure is.
Not to mention that both communism and nazism were created in Germany-meaning that the world owes the most terrible atrocities to German state...
Indeed-the world and Europe can live without German economy.

*chuckle*


You think that without German porn, vomit tasting food and polluting cars the Sun will turn off ? Charming little German nationalism.



We did pay more than 8 billion US dollar in 2003 ... one could argue Germany is still paying war reparation by financing the new Eastern EU member states which are benefitting from a million different forms of EU subsidies.


What a lot of horse crap. How much worth of bilion of dollars are children that your German soldiers burned alive German ?
As to EU subisidies-that is laughable-Germany pays its own firms by them that operate in Poland. And you forgot to mention they are credits not free money-credits given only to people who meet certain rules-one of them their own funds-often taken as loan from German banks.
If Hypocracy would be God it would find a throne in Germany.

My name isn't Smith but i daresay you *are* sick, suffering from extreme Germanophobia.

Oh dear-I am such a Germanophob-not seeing the glory of Germany burning Poles alive to make room for Deutsche Ubermenschen in WW2. My my, perhaps you should ask EU to make a degree forcing such people as me for re-education camps untill they see how Superior and Enlightened your Genocide-exporting country is by continuing to fund Nazi founded organisations, never paying reperations to countries it devestated and refusing to grant Poles status of the same nature Germans receive in Poland ? Your state has traditions in that, doesn't it ?
Last edited by Shade2 on 03 Jul 2007 22:03, edited 2 times in total.
By Cyricus
#1257214
Shade2 wrote:Are you always that ignorant ? Poland never demanded votes based on population losses by German mass murder. It demanded more proporationate voting system.


Poland cites war dead in EU row

Poland has vowed to seek restitution for its wartime dead at a European Union summit starting on Thursday raising the stakes in a battle with Germany over voting power which looms over talks on a revamped EU constitution.

.
.
.

Jaroslaw Kaczynski, Poland's prime minister, said a proposed new EU voting formula based on population size hurt his country because it had not recovered from its losses following the German invasion of September 1939.

"We are only demanding one thing, that we get back what was taken from us," Mr Kaczynski said in an interview with Polish national radio. "If Poland had not had to live through the years of 1939-45, Poland would be today looking at the demographics of a country of 66m."

http://www.polandbusinessnetwork.pl/new ... tid=143081

Or do a quick Google search for more results: Google

Now please spare us more anti-german rhetorics ...
User avatar
By Theodore
#1257221
Shade2 wrote:Your attempt to compare cultural assimiliation to genocide made by German state is disgusting. Poland never engaged in an attempt to exterminate Lithuanians like Germany engaged towards Poles. Also Poland didn't mention votes lost of Poles assimiliated in previous centuries by Germany.


Polonisation wasn't always peaceful, especially in the Endecja years. Not to mention Khmelnytinsky's pogroms. But that's besides the point in any case, the point being that only present populations should matter.

Shade2 wrote:Poland also didn't demand votes based on population losses-only noticed that such decisions favours Germany which mass murdered Poles and harms Poland which was mass murdered by Germans.


Look, I understand that the Kaczynskis would like more influence in the EU. I disagree with maybe 99% of what they do, but this is only natural. They even scored a cheap shot against Germany by mentioning the Third Reich. But then they couldn't stop and completely overplayed it, which hurt their argument more than it had initially helped it.

Shade2 wrote:Poland never demanded votes based on population losses by German mass murder. It demanded more proporationate voting system.


Actually Poland demands a less proportional system (the square root system, which would favour smaller countries).

Shade2 wrote:I don't need to. By comparing me to an animal they show their views, even if they exist on subconscious level.


Animal comparisons are hardly something extraordinary, at least in the English language. You're seeing racism where by all available evidence there isn't any.
By Shade2
#1257236
Or do a quick Google search for more results: Google

Now please spare us more anti-german rhetorics ...

Spare me your delusions German nationalist. Point to any sentence of Kaczynski in which he demands votes to be counted upon people you Germans butchered in WW2. You won't find one.He never made such proposal-he simply pointed out that basing voting on number of population is simply unfair.
Polonisation wasn't always peaceful, especially in the Endecja years.

I would prefer anyday to be Lithuanian forced to speak Polish in school then a girl raped by German Selbstschutz member before being beaten with a rifle to death and thrown into a pit.

But then they couldn't stop and completely overplayed it, which hurt their argument more than it had initially helped it.

It was just a minor remark actually. Only media hyped it afterwards. To me that is strange-everybody knows Germans butchered Europe several times, so their victims have less population. That's why voting system based on population alone is unfair.


Actually Poland demands a less proportional system (the square root system, which would favour smaller countries).

Since they are more smaller countries then larger it only makes the system more democratic and fair.
You're seeing racism where by all available evidence there isn't any.

Too bad I remain unconviced. Germans should know better then to use the same argument they have been using for centuries to justify discrimination and mass murder of Polish people.
User avatar
By Far-Right Sage
#1257512
and not funding organisations created by Nazis that allow sale of Waffen SS marches


What are you talking about?

I am an untermensch ? My sickness can only be purged by gas chamber ?


Have you ever heard of a victim complex? ;)
User avatar
By Andres
#1257586
Theodore wrote:Is it just me or has the cover, its crudeness aside, completely failed at conveying its point?
I also failed to understand the meaning the authors intended. I thought it was supposed to portray subsidies or something similar, flowing from Germany to Poland. It's not a very good satire.
User avatar
By soron
#1259491
I wonder if Shade2 will detect any racism when I mention that Germany's America Cup yacht will sail next year with a Polish helmsman, an old hardened salt-dog :D
By Torwan
#1262054
Forget it.

It's easier to argue with a stone than with Shade2.

Next thing he'll do is comment every single sentence of my post (maybe except for this one to prove that I'm a "lying German bastard").

The current polish government is a stereotype for a nationalistic government. They use hatred and frustration to create an outside enemy that doesn't exist and by that divert the attention of the people on real enemies and real problems. A strategy every nationalistic government has used.

Shade2 isn't open to arguments concerning this. His next topic will include, as usual, his Hitler-and-Masterrace-club.
By Shade2
#1265759
. They use hatred and frustration to create an outside enemy that doesn't exist and by that divert the attention of the people on real enemies and real problems. A strategy every nationalistic government has used.

Typical baseless attacks not rooted in anything real to portay Polish government as insane and to deny it chance to discuss real problems.

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