[One Degree]

For what % of the USA's history have blacks been enslaved, segregated or subject to mass incarceration?

Yes, we know now it was terrible. We can not change it.

Name the other groups who were treated in a similar manner to American blacks.

It serves no purpose to compare the degree of mistreatment, but others suffered very harshly. Native American, Japanese, Chinese, etc. None of these groups suffering is diminished by the greater suffering of another group.

Most people could tell you the names of their great grandparents after one phone call. "Hi Grandpa, what was your dad's name?"

We have a difference in perspective since my grand parents have been dead for decades. Great, great grandparents apparently would be more appropriate for you.

I guess I'm just not as optimistic as you are and think it will take more than 10 minutes for blacks to overcome their legacy of being 3/5 of a human.

I'm not black so I don't know how they feel, but I find it highly doubtful they all feel the same. We also know no one gives a damn about our feelings no matter who we are. Why should anyone be concerned about overcoming a legacy. The truth is each of us does the best we can with what we have. We do not have to be part of a group. We are individuals born into a world with some assets and detriments and we just need to do the best we can. Several hundred blacks protesting will not accomplish as much as one good neighbor who happens to be black and I believe one good white neighbor can go a long way in helping blacks see racism may not be the problem they think it is today. It all looks different depending on whether you are discussing groups or individuals and I don't think groups should matter to anyone.

[AFAIK]

We have a difference in perspective since my grand parents have been dead for decades. Great, great grandparents apparently would be more appropriate for you.

My point is we enjoy familial continuity going back multiple generations. I know who my parents and grandparents are, they knew who their parents and grandparents are and so on. We weren't separated from one another when our owner decided to sell us to different plantations and we weren't deliberately mixed up with thousands of other slaves to make it impossible for us to identify our national or tribal heritage. Spending WWII in an internment camp doesn't compare to being completely atomised and stripped of your identity.

Having black skin means millions of people will perceive you as belonging to a particular group, regardless of your own feelings on the matter. How many Americans identify Obama as white? How many view him as a Hawaiian or a Chicagoan?

[One Degree]

"AFAIK"]My point is we enjoy familial continuity going back multiple generations. I know who my parents and grandparents are, they knew who their parents and grandparents are and so on.

Sure, if you want to believe none of them fooled around with a neighbor or more likely they were adopted when their own family died of disease. DNA testing brings up some interesting questions in most of our lineage.

We weren't separated from one another when our owner decided to sell us to different plantations and we weren't deliberately mixed up with thousands of other slaves to make it impossible for us to identify our national or tribal heritage. Spending WWII in an internment camp doesn't compare to being completely atomised and stripped of your identity.

Why should what happened to our ancestors by the ancestors of others have any effect on how we feel about people living today. No one alive today had anything to do with this.

Having black skin means millions of people will perceive you as belonging to a particular group, regardless of your own feelings on the matter. How many Americans identify Obama as white? How many view him as a Hawaiian or a Chicagoan?

And if I go into a black neighborhood, all anyone is going to see is my whiteness. This is unavoidable for all of us. If you have a problem that does not have a solution, then maybe the best thing you can do is ignore the problem rather than constantly calling attention to it. If a black person sees their skin as a sign of inferiority, then they have a problem. I am not trying to be dismissive of what many consider a serious problem, but just trying to be rational about the solutions. I will continue to see your skin color. I will probably unconsciously make some judgements based upon that. Okay, that is reality. What is the best solution. Dwelling on it, or accepting it and moving on. I grew up where making fun of one another's skin color was a sign we had accepted one another as friends. We accepted our differences and did not pretend they did not exist, but did not allow those differences to prevent us from being friends. This seems to be rambling, but I can't think of a better approach to getting at what I believe is best.

[AFAIK]

Sure, if you want to believe none of them fooled around with a neighbor or more likely they were adopted when their own family died of disease. DNA testing brings up some interesting questions in most of our lineage.

Mother and father are social roles, if all your father contributed to the family was some ejaculate before wandering off and your mother died during childbirth then you'd be an orphan. Orphans have just as much DNA as anyone else.

Why should what happened to our ancestors by the ancestors of others have any effect on how we feel about people living today. No one alive today had anything to do with this.

Because of the direct link between the past and the present.

And if I go into a black neighborhood, all anyone is going to see is my whiteness. This is unavoidable for all of us. If you have a problem that does not have a solution, then maybe the best thing you can do is ignore the problem rather than constantly calling attention to it. If a black person sees their skin as a sign of inferiority, then they have a problem. I am not trying to be dismissive of what many consider a serious problem, but just trying to be rational about the solutions. I will continue to see your skin color. I will probably unconsciously make some judgements based upon that. Okay, that is reality. What is the best solution. Dwelling on it, or accepting it and moving on. I grew up where making fun of one another's skin color was a sign we had accepted one another as friends. We accepted our differences and did not pretend they did not exist, but did not allow those differences to prevent us from being friends. This seems to be rambling, but I can't think of a better approach to getting at what I believe is best.

I get that being self critical and acknowledging your prejudices and privileges is hard. That doesn't mean we shouldn't collectively work to better society and ameliorate injustices.

[LV-GUCCI-PRADA-FLEX]

There is no such thing as racial hierarchy. There is a hierarchy of technological development and concentration of capital, and its upper echelons have your attention suitably diverted to the puppet theater of identity politics. You have become the racist you are proud to abhor.

says the person who hates transgendered people and Muslims. Like the accusations of identity politics are really rich coming from you. Especially since this thread is what? Not white identity politics? Isn't this a prime racist meme?

Also, you're just not getting it. Your white ego is so fragile that even the mention of the crimes of white people gets you all hot and bothered. Maybe it's that it's a hop, skip, and a jump away from remembering the crimes of the Nazis?

[Dagoth Ur]

Guys racism isn't real. One Degree's white ass says so.

[One Degree]

Guys racism isn't real. One Degree's white ass says so.

If I had said it then it would be true. I did not say it and your dishonest post fooled no one.

[Frollein]

:lol: says the person who hates transgendered people and Muslims. Like the accusations of identity politics are really rich coming from you. Especially since this thread is what? Not white identity politics? Isn't this a prime racist meme?

I already refuted your claim that I'm hating Muslims and mentally ill people; repeating that claim doesn't make it more true, it only makes you more foolish. But if you want to look dumb, be my guest.

Also, you're just not getting it. Your white ego is so fragile that even the mention of the crimes of white people gets you all hot and bothered.

There's sure a lot of projection going on here. I've been here long enough to not get hot or bothered about anything.

Maybe it's that it's a hop, skip, and a jump away from remembering the crimes of the Nazis?

Oh noes, he said the N-word. Hate to break it to you, but the Nazi-button has never worked on me and that's not gonna change. Try something else.

[Suntzu]

Let's see, slavery has only been over in the U.S. for 150 years or so. Schools and such have been desegregated for more than 50 years. The Chinese, Koreans, Japanese, even recent immigrants from Africa don't seem to have a problem. Mexicans in the country illegal don't seem to have a problem. Only Blacks seem to be struggling.

[mikema63]

Let's see, slavery has only been over in the U.S. for 150 years or so. Schools and such have been desegregated for more than 50 years. The Chinese, Koreans, Japanese, even recent immigrants from Africa don't seem to have a problem. Mexicans in the country illegal don't seem to have a problem. Only Blacks seem to be struggling.

Huh weird, It's almost like something that happened to African Americans effected their lot in society in a way that recent immigrants haven't experienced. I wonder what historical events might have caused such a systemic problem that eve you admit doesn't affect recent immigrants.

Some sort of systematic disruption of their families and communities maybe?

[One Degree]

There is another factor that I never see mentioned. There were 4.4 million African Americans in the US at the end of the civil war. Almost 4 million were slaves. This was 14% of the entire US population. I am not sure any countries have attempted to integrate such a vast number of people all at once. It totally throws off the percentages that would encourage cultural adaptation and would actually encourage not integrating IMO.

This is equivalent to 4 million people stepping off boats from the same country on the same day.
Today, this would be the equivalent of 40 million stepping off the boats in the same day.

[LV-GUCCI-PRADA-FLEX]

I already refuted your claim that I'm hating Muslims and mentally ill people; repeating that claim doesn't make it more true, it only makes you more foolish. But if you want to look dumb, be my guest.

I don't think you really refuted it, you just said "nuh-uh". Your posting history speaks for itself. You hate muslims and you hate transgender people. When people see your name, they think "hates muslims, transgenders". It's a good 90% of your on-topic posts are somehow about those two things.

Oh noes, he said the N-word. Hate to break it to you, but the Nazi-button has never worked on me and that's not gonna change. Try something else.

I'm just saying, whites have done some scummy things, we can agree on that right?

[Hong Wu]

Are you talking about Mossad?

Nobody cares about racism against whites, they deserve it for all they have done.

Isn't LV white? I think I made a post on this awhile back about how whites are basically allowed to abandon their race, while other races get "drafted" and aren't allowed to have different opinions... without delving into how totalitarian it all is, this effectively makes whites a minority if you consider that people like LV are basically not white according to their own standards.

[Frollein]

If LV is really white, he should put his money where his mouth is and run his face full force into a mirror everyday. According to his own logic, he'd deserve it, the evil white devil.

[LV-GUCCI-PRADA-FLEX]

Isn't LV white? I think I made a post on this awhile back about how whites are basically allowed to abandon their race, while other races get "drafted" and aren't allowed to have different opinions... without delving into how totalitarian it all is, this effectively makes whites a minority if you consider that people like LV are basically not white according to their own standards.

The funny thing to me is that I never claimed not to be white. I have just been accused of being a sore loser for saying that my arguments are sometimes satire (even though to me it's obvious). Maybe you just want to believe that people actually hate whites as much as you think I do?