There is no West Anymore; They're Importing Laborers Because You Will be China's Factory Some Day - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14800096
I mean come, isn't it obvious? If China's currency was accurately valued, the abrupt shock to the world economic system would be too great. So they are biding their time. But why do all of these Eurocrats keep importing foreign workers and saying it's important for the economy if they don't want their economies to be based upon industry and production? There are only two viable answers; either 1) they are completely insane, or 2) they expect Europe to have a more industrial economy some time in the near future. That will only work if someone is buying their products. It boggles my mind to try and grasp the amount of cognitive dissonance it must take to not see this despite how often it is made into an issue while the future workers are killing the natives in the streets.

If this surrender seems controversial to you, maybe it shouldn't. The truth is that the west died quite awhile ago and only economic zones based upon the previous civilizations remain in its place. There are no traditions, no religion, no philosophy, few families, no shared genetics, no unified and agreeable perception of history, no consensus on anything (literally), no optimism for the future, little happiness without drugs (either psychiatric drugs or marijuana, certainly not without alcohol), no uniquely western art forms or styles, this is just off the top of my head.

If you think this is irrelevant, consider that other major regions actually have all of those things. They still have traditions, religions, strong families, shared genetics, a shared perception of history that they largely mutually appreciate, consensus on many things, optimism, low rates of substance abuse and real happiness, culturally unique and popular art forms. The trend is obvious and in my opinion, you need to have your head in the sand to not appreciate where all of this is going.
#14800141
It's a lot more complicated than that.

Today, liberalism is looked upon as the wise guy ideology that pursues multiculturalist free labor for the sake of chaos...

...but before, conservatism was the ideology of spoiled brats who made appeals to particular tastes to get ahead in life rather than appreciating universal values.

The problem is those conservatives subverted liberalism from the inside out. You see this especially when multiculturalist liberals engage in "blame the victim" antics which is comparable to conservatism while talking about free labor competition.

The issue isn't about tradition existing or not. It's about how traditionalists have subverted their opposition from the inside out.
#14800152
Dubayoo wrote:It's a lot more complicated than that.

Today, liberalism is looked upon as the wise guy ideology that pursues multiculturalist free labor for the sake of chaos...

...but before, conservatism was the ideology of spoiled brats who made appeals to particular tastes to get ahead in life rather than appreciating universal values.

The problem is those conservatives subverted liberalism from the inside out. You see this especially when multiculturalist liberals engage in "blame the victim" antics which is comparable to conservatism while talking about free labor competition.

The issue isn't about tradition existing or not. It's about how traditionalists have subverted their opposition from the inside out.

No, it really isn't any more complicated than this. Imagine that you're a European liberal arts major managing a factory full of Arab workers. Your degree is basically in trying to convince them not to kill you, even though you aren't a Muslim/their type of Muslim and are actually a giant faggot IRL. Then if you fail and they murder you, canary in the coal mine, the EU army comes in and takes out the terrorist cell. This is the plan the globalists have for Europe and the end goal of "multiculturalism".
#14800174
Hong Wu wrote:No, it really isn't any more complicated than this. Imagine that you're a European liberal arts major managing a factory full of Arab workers. Your degree is basically in trying to convince them not to kill you, even though you aren't a Muslim/their type of Muslim and are actually a giant faggot IRL. Then if you fail and they murder you, canary in the coal mine, the EU army comes in and takes out the terrorist cell. This is the plan the globalists have for Europe and the end goal of "multiculturalism".


Eh...?

It's way more complicated than that.

Liberals tolerate Muslims despite how they're reactionary compared to conservatives because they view the greater of evils as a counterbalance to the lesser of evils. It's like how Protestants allied with Muslims during the 17th century against Catholics.

Obviously, Islamists hate many liberals more because they look upon liberalism as the core of decadent hedonism in Western Civilization, but all liberals aren't the same. Many liberals view decadence as an insensitive conservative attribute. Heck, that's why the whole safe space/microaggression debate is taking place now.

Don't get me wrong. I see what you're saying, but you're only looking at part of the picture.
#14800194
The capitalist market might be exploiting workers abroad and at home? What a revolutionary conclusion to come to!

Marx and Engels wrote:Modern industry has established the world market, for which the discovery of America paved the way. This market has given an immense development to commerce, to navigation, to communication by land. This development has, in its turn, reacted on the extension of industry; and in proportion as industry, commerce, navigation, railways extended, in the same proportion the bourgeoisie developed, increased its capital, and pushed into the background every class handed down from the Middle Ages.

...The bourgeoisie, historically, has played a most revolutionary part.
The bourgeoisie, wherever it has got the upper hand, has put an end to all feudal, patriarchal, idyllic relations. It has pitilessly torn asunder the motley feudal ties that bound man to his “natural superiors”, and has left remaining no other nexus between man and man than naked self-interest, than callous “cash payment”. It has drowned the most heavenly ecstasies of religious fervour, of chivalrous enthusiasm, of philistine sentimentalism, in the icy water of egotistical calculation. It has resolved personal worth into exchange value, and in place of the numberless indefeasible chartered freedoms, has set up that single, unconscionable freedom — Free Trade. In one word, for exploitation, veiled by religious and political illusions, it has substituted naked, shameless, direct, brutal exploitation.
The bourgeoisie has stripped of its halo every occupation hitherto honoured and looked up to with reverent awe. It has converted the physician, the lawyer, the priest, the poet, the man of science, into its paid wage labourers.
The bourgeoisie has torn away from the family its sentimental veil, and has reduced the family relation to a mere money relation.
#14800255
Hong Wu wrote:If this surrender seems controversial to you, maybe it shouldn't. The truth is that the west died quite awhile ago and only economic zones based upon the previous civilizations remain in its place. There are no traditions, no religion, no philosophy, few families, no shared genetics, no unified and agreeable perception of history, no consensus on anything (literally), no optimism for the future, little happiness without drugs (either psychiatric drugs or marijuana, certainly not without alcohol), no uniquely western art forms or styles, this is just off the top of my head.


Traditions still exist like travelling with family during Christmas or during the summer or watching sports on TV every year. Families still exist although families can now include co-workers, so you have work families. Or if you have roommates, your roommates become your family. I disagree with the statement that there is "little happiness without drugs". People can be happy spending time with those they love or doing their hobbies or even just shopping. There is still a lot that people can find to make them happy.
#14800265
Hong Wu wrote:I mean come, isn't it obvious? If China's currency was accurately valued, the abrupt shock to the world economic system would be too great. So they are biding their time. But why do all of these Eurocrats keep importing foreign workers and saying it's important for the economy if they don't want their economies to be based upon industry and production? There are only two viable answers; either 1) they are completely insane, or 2) they expect Europe to have a more industrial economy some time in the near future. That will only work if someone is buying their products. It boggles my mind to try and grasp the amount of cognitive dissonance it must take to not see this despite how often it is made into an issue while the future workers are killing the natives in the streets.

If this surrender seems controversial to you, maybe it shouldn't. The truth is that the west died quite awhile ago and only economic zones based upon the previous civilizations remain in its place. There are no traditions, no religion, no philosophy, few families, no shared genetics, no unified and agreeable perception of history, no consensus on anything (literally), no optimism for the future, little happiness without drugs (either psychiatric drugs or marijuana, certainly not without alcohol), no uniquely western art forms or styles, this is just off the top of my head.

If you think this is irrelevant, consider that other major regions actually have all of those things. They still have traditions, religions, strong families, shared genetics, a shared perception of history that they largely mutually appreciate, consensus on many things, optimism, low rates of substance abuse and real happiness, culturally unique and popular art forms. The trend is obvious and in my opinion, you need to have your head in the sand to not appreciate where all of this is going.


There aren't only two possible answers. Another possibility is that they want to drive down the cost of domestic skilled labor.
#14800268
All of this worry assumes that global markets are necessary. Countries like the US, Australia and Canada have the natural resources and intellectual capital to pull up the gangplank and motor along just fine. What then? What if fortress North America simply decides not to play?
#14800299
Drlee wrote:All of this worry assumes that global markets are necessary. Countries like the US, Australia and Canada have the natural resources and intellectual capital to pull up the gangplank and motor along just fine. What then? What if fortress North America simply decides not to play?

Welcome to the Trump train, and here I was starting to think there was no hope for you :excited:
#14800420
We never really recovered from the first world war.

It probably takes the ruin of a completely destroyed civilisation to foster the kinship and religiosity that sustained population growth in the past.

On the other hand an aging and steady or even falling population could be dealt with . It's hardly something that's crept up on us. However that would involve politicians giving us the bad news that the elaborate health and welfare systems we've become accustomed to are going to have to radically change, as will the expectation of ever rising incomes, asset (especially house) prices, comfortable pensions and early retirement.

The genuine insanity creeps in when rather than facing this uncomfortable fact they decide they can delay it by being "kind" and taking in millions of people from the third world in the hope they will become tax payers.
#14800493
However that would involve politicians giving us the bad news that the elaborate health and welfare systems we've become accustomed to are going to have to radically change, as will the expectation of ever rising incomes, asset (especially house) prices, comfortable pensions and early retirement.


So Trump and the conservatives were lying when they said that their plan would give us all of these things? I knew that already. We all know that already. Well. Trump voters do not know that. They are simply not smart enough to know that.

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