[foxdemon]

Apparently the alternative prototypes for the wall have been completed.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-20/donald-trump-border-wall-models-take-shape-in-san-diego/9071032

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/the-8-prototypes-for-trumps-border-wall-photos/article/2638241


So which one do you like best? Be aware that one design criteria is that the wall should be aesthetically pleasing when viewed from the American side.

[Zagadka]

Well, no wall will stop drug smuggling. People can literally throw things over it. Probably a lot of drones, too. You can't just build a 20 story wall. Any wall could be breached quickly and moved through before authorities could arrive. Vandalism against the entire structure will probably be high, as will constant repairs.

The best defense would be, as the border patrol agencies want, more sensors and fast response teams, not an, at minimum, $15 billion wall. But Trump cut the funds for the Coast Guard, so that isn't looking promising. So caveman logic will blow a lot of time and money, and destroy border community economics.

There is something better than a wall: A fucking lot of desert and hilly terrain. There aren't many places you can cross the border to and immediately hide. This is why the border patrol plays zone defense.

But playing idiot's advocate, it would be two walls, as prisons are designed; one outer, one inner, with the middle operating like a trap. That would be an easy place to put sensors and make response times more reasonable, since you are doubling the time it takes. You can also add impediments in that buffer zone. Height is kinda irrelevant. Construction materials are a matter of cost... that is a long fucking wall. It has to be strong enough to not be cut or driven through, but cheap enough to build and maintain. A mesh would probably work best; a solid wall would just give cover to anyone approaching from the Mexican side. Electricity is out as an option due to the size and remoteness of the wall, unless you also want to build and maintain hundreds of solar farms. I'd probably go with a two-material design, like a mesh along with a gate or lattice, mesh south side so it can't be scaled by hand. Adding the other material would make it harder to cut through; you'd need two different systems.

I'd say look to prisons or military bases, but the scale we're talking about is so much larger that it is pointless to do more than take cues from them, and military bases rely increasingly on sensors anyway.

[Suntzu]

A couple of consideration:

Along the Rio Grande River the wall will act as a levy/dike.

In hurricane country wind load will have to be considered.

If this is a continuous barrier, will wildlife corridors be provided.

[foxdemon]

What about retro style?




Or Israeli style?




Look, they even come with neat remote fired machine guns. How cool is that?

[MistyTiger]

I don't like walls. Walls are ugly and they symbolize ugliness to me, unless they are walls instead a building. I like murals though, murals with people from all the different countries and there should be trees and houses in the background.

[Suntzu]

A better way to keep out the illegal aliens would be a national I.D. card. No job, no social services, no bank account, utility connection, no schooling, no medical treatment without showing I.D. Who doesn't have a driver license, birth certificate, social security card, etc.?

[Zagadka]

I don't like walls. Walls are ugly and they symbolize ugliness to me, unless they are walls instead a building. I like murals though, murals with people from all the different countries and there should be trees and houses in the background. :D

A lot of inner city places do that. Works nicely.

A better way to keep out the illegal aliens would be a national I.D. card. No job, no social services, no bank account, utility connection, no schooling, no medical treatment without showing I.D.

I'm up for a national ID.

I'm also up for punishing employers who knowingly hire illegal immigrants (provided there is a structure for legal employment of people like seasonal workers or extended work visas)

The generally point is that a wall is a dumb thing to rely on, when you can make policy changes that would address the issue more dynamically.

Currently, people don't NEED a drivers license, namely, if they don't drive. They also vary by state.

[ingliz]

A cardboard box (flatpack) to be issued to every Trump supporter to hide in. No need to see a brown face ever again. Can be put together in seconds.

Just as effective and a lot cheaper than a wall.

[Zagadka]

Will only work with white cardboard.

[Suntzu]

A lot of inner city places do that. Works nicely.


I'm up for a national ID.

I'm also up for punishing employers who knowingly hire illegal immigrants (provided there is a structure for legal employment of people like seasonal workers or extended work visas)

The generally point is that a wall is a dumb thing to rely on, when you can make policy changes that would address the issue more dynamically.

Currently, people don't NEED a drivers license, namely, if they don't drive. They also vary by state.

E-verify is already in place and could be made mandatory by a simple majority vote of both houses and Trump's signature. Prison (no fines) for violators. Liberal visas for seasonal workers with draconian measures for those who overstay.

Anyone who isn't living under a bridge or an illegal alien needs a government issued picture I.D.

[foxdemon]

I don't like walls. Walls are ugly and they symbolize ugliness to me, unless they are walls instead a building. I like murals though, murals with people from all the different countries and there should be trees and houses in the background.

That’s the right way to think. Aesthetically pleasing is what we should be talking about.

I think the wall should have a walkway on it, so bemused tourists in 100 years can walk up and down the wall wondering “what the f*** where they thinking when they built this?”.

There is money to be made from tourism. What about this quaint little wall in China as a prototype? (Note the tourists)

[Sivad]

I'm also up for punishing employers who knowingly hire illegal immigrants (provided there is a structure for legal employment of people like seasonal workers or extended work visas)

That's a dick move that just punishes immigrants. Increasing and enforcing labor rights would be much better. But really any immigration reform that doesn't first acknowledge and address America's role in the corruption and impoverishment of Latin America would be unscrupulous.

[Suntzu]

Latin America certainly didn't need American help to be impoverished. Mexico is one fucked up place, plenty of natural resources. If Japan and Mexico traded populations, the Japanese in Mexico would rule the world and the Mexicans in Japan would starve.

[Libertarian353]

@Suntzu

So you admit your white inferiority? Good to know, now say that Blacks built this nation.

[Suntzu]

Sayin' Blacks built America is like sayin' mules built America. Look around you. Everything you see was invented by some inferior White.

[Godstud]

This would be as effective, and more decorative, as any other wall, seeing as most illegals come thru the border crossings. It'd also be a lot cheaper.


No wait... is this to keep people out, or keep Americans IN?

[Suntzu]

A wall can be effective, after all, prisons work. They need to be overwatched/manned. This gets very expensive. If I were in charge of building a wall I would first do some research, Israel, East Germany.

I live on the Mexican border. Thousand/million cross legally every day. I go to Mexico at least once a month. I can't see a wall being very effective. We have some of the early wall sections in place, already. They are doing survey and property acquisition work, already. Mexicans down here ain't happy! This is good!

[Ter]

They could plant nettles and other painful and poisonous plants on the Mexican side of the border ?
And a deep ditch filled with acid.
And a second ditch with pigs running around in it.
So many ideas come to mind...

[Godstud]

Oh yeah, Ter. A nice moat with alligators in it!

Also, Mexicans are too smart for Trump.

[Ter]

Oh yeah, Ter. A nice moat with alligators in it!

I withdraw my proposal for the ditch with the pigs. I now realise they will be eaten by the would-be illegal aliens. Godstud's idea about the alligators is better.
Maybe they could import those monster salt water crocodiles from Australia, they like to snack on people.