Many shot dead at Texas school. Another school shooting. Why? - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14916452
@blackjack21

It predates the 1990s. The terminology arose as a result of the non-aligned movement that was established in 1961. The first world represented NATO-aligned countries, the second world represented Soviet-aligned countries and the third world represented non-aligned countries.


I was talking about worldism as an economic and cultural concept rather than as a political concept during the Cold War. Most people today identify the worlds as socio-economic concepts with the first world being the most developed, second world being slightly less so, and the third world being undeveloped.

Rich wasn't being anachronistic. You just need to understand history a little better, and you won't be able to do that by relying on today's colleges and universities to educate you properly, because they serve to indoctrinate not to educate. Seek out primary sources yourself. Do not rely on professors to give you solid guidance.


He was in fact being anachronistic even if I didn't know that worldism was created as conceivable form in 1961. He applied two modern concepts to the politics of 1940s Germany and the Roman Empire. The world was very much still multi-polar during the 1940s, America was still not considered to be a global superpower by that point despite many political scientists anticipating it's ascension and the Roman Empire existed at a time in which racism did not exist in the way we see it.

I also find it odd that you assume that A. I am getting this information from professors for some reason and B. that I don't look into primary sources when getting my information. Most of my historical knowledge is based on historians who have clear credentials and sources to verify their viewpoints. If there is a debated issue in the historical community, I look at both sides and try to identify what the issue really is about and then come to my own conclusions. In the case of Rich, I think have a professor teach about history is beneficial to him as he clearly does not understand even the basics of European history let alone Middle Eastern history.
#14916458
Finfinder wrote:School shootings are just a cash cow for the news business which serves as the Democratic parties mouth piece. A party which is completely lost and at rock bottom for their continued sensationalizing of then for political gain.


That is true. Networks are losing news viewers to the internet and major news sites are loosing readers because more intelligent and compelling people are distilling news articles on YouTube and alt-news sites. Everyone else is binge watching garbage on Netflix.

These school shootings are the best thing ever for dinosaur news outlets, and now the symbiotic nature of schools shooters and the media is starting to become more pronounced.
#14916507
Texas school shooter killed girl who turned down his advances and embarrassed him in class, her mother says
As he heard the gunshots approaching down the hall Friday morning, Santa Fe High School student Abel San Miguel, 15, hid with a few classmates in the art class storage closet.

He wasn't sure if he was going to survive. Through the door, he could see the barrel of a shotgun. Then the shooter began shooting through the door, killing at least one student inside, and grazing Abel's back.

When the shooter left the room briefly, Abel and others left the closet and tried to barricade the door. But the shooter pushed it open, spotted a student he knew, and with anger said, "Surprise!" before shooting the student in the chest.

"I'm still trying to process everything," Abel said in an interview.

As more details emerged about the shooting that left 10 people dead and 13 injured at the Houston-area school, the student who authorities said confessed to the attack was being held in isolation Saturday as officials identified the victims.

The family of the 17-year-old suspect, junior Dimitrios Pagourtzis, is "as shocked and confused as anyone else by these events that occurred," according to a statement released to the media.

"We are gratified by the public comments made by other Santa Fe High School students that show Dimitri as we know him: a smart, quiet, sweet boy," the family statement said. "While we remain mostly in the dark about the specifics of yesterday's tragedy, what we have learned from media reports seems incompatible with the boy we love."

One of Pagourtzis' classmates who died in the attack, Shana Fisher, "had 4 months of problems from this boy," her mother, Sadie Rodriguez, wrote in a private message to the Los Angeles Times on Facebook. "He kept making advances on her and she repeatedly told him no."

Pagourtzis continued to get more aggressive, and she finally stood up to him and embarrassed him in class, Rodriguez said. "A week later he opens fire on everyone he didn't like," she wrote. "Shana being the first one." Rodriguez didn't say how she knew her daughter was the first victim.

The gunman repeatedly taunted students during the attack, according to another harrowing account posted to Facebook by one survivor's mother.

After scrambling to escape the shooter's blasts in the art room, Isabelle Van Ness, covered in dust from rounds hitting her classroom walls, could hear the shooter in a next-door classroom yelling, "Woo hoo!" while shooting, according to her mother, Deedra Van Ness.

"The gunman then comes back into their room and they hear him saying … are you dead? Then more shots are fired," Deedra Van Ness wrote. "By this time, cell phones all over the classroom are ringing and he's taunting the kids in the closet asking them … do you think it's for you? do you want to come answer it? Then he proceeds to fire more bullets into the closet and tries to get in."

Police arrived within 10 minutes later as Isabelle hid among the bodies of her classmates, and she could hear the shooter reloading after an "exchange" with police, her mother wrote.

Soon after, the shooter surrendered. "She and her friends had been in the same room with the gunman the ENTIRE TIME," her mother wrote. "As the media announces the names of the confirmed dead, Isabelle falls apart. ... She had prayed that her friends lying around the school were just injured and the confirmation of their deaths was crushing."

The dead included two teachers, Glenda Perkins and Cynthia Tisdale, along with Shana Fisher and seven of her classmates: Kimberly Vaughan, Angelique Ramirez, Christian Riley Garcia, Jared Black, Christopher Jake Stone, Aaron Kyle McLeod and Sabika Sheikh, an exchange student from Pakistan.

Two bombs that Pagourtzis allegedly brought to the school Friday were "intended to be IEDs," improvised explosive devices, but turned out to be "nonfunctional," Galveston County Judge Mark Henry said Saturday.

Pagourtzis, a football player who had allegedly posted images of guns and a T-shirt with the words "Born to kill" on social media in the weeks before the shooting, is being held without bond while facing charges of capital murder and aggravated assault on a public servant.

His schoolmates were allowed to return to parts of the school Saturday to retrieve their abandoned belongings.

One student wrote on Twitter: "as i walked into the school today to grab my things all I felt was emptiness. the entire vibe of the school was sad. you could look at the doors and see where they had to use [sledge]hammers to get into the doors. … i never want to be there again."

After surrendering to police at the school, Pagourtzis waived his right to remain silent and confessed to the shooting, authorities said. According to a probable-cause statement, Pagourtzis said that "he did not shoot students he did like so he could have his story told."

The judge questioned the teenager at his initial court appearance Friday. Pagourtzis answered the questions, admitting to the shooting, but said little else, Henry said.

Officials also upped the number of injured at Friday's shooting to 13 from 10. One of the wounded, school police Officer John Barnes, remained in critical but stable condition Saturday after nearly dying from blood loss, according to police officials.

"This guy ran toward danger. I can't thank him enough," Henry said in an interview. "He's a hero in my book."

A close friend, Capt. James Dale of the Houston Police Department, said Barnes might lose his right arm.

"We want to know exactly what went on in there," Dale said. "All we know is he was the first one in there and he was shot in both arms."

Walter Braun, chief of the Santa Fe Independent School District Police Department, declined to answer questions about the police response to the shooting or whether the department had seen any warning signs from Pagourtzis before the massacre.

"Our officers went in there and did what they could," Braun said at a news conference. "They did what they were trained for, and went in immediately."

Though the school is now believed to be free of explosives, all district schools will remain closed until at least Tuesday as officials sort through the crime scene.

Officers have been bringing in students 10 at a time to gather belongings from parts of the school that were not closed off, Braun said.

With assistance from the Red Cross, officials have set up an assistance center at a local Methodist church where affected families can receive emotional support, community services and food.

"This is the second time in eight months that we've gone through tragedy," Rep. Randy Weber, the area's Republican congressman, said at a news conference, noting Hurricane Harvey's assault on the area last summer.

"We will pull together," Weber said. "We will grieve together, we will love one another, we will work together. We did it after Harvey, still doing it after Harvey. We'll do it after this."
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-tex ... story.html
#14916514
Authorities: Explosives in Santa Fe shooting were functional


Police and FBI carrying tools towards a home believed to be related to the fatal school shooting earlier in the day at Santa Fe High School on Tuesday, May 18, 2018, in Santa Fe, TX. Photo: Mark Mulligan, Houston Chronicle / 2018

Photo: Mark Mulligan, Houston Chronicle
Image 1 of 3
Police and FBI carrying tools towards a home believed to be related to the fatal school shooting earlier in the day at Santa Fe High School on Tuesday, May 18, 2018, in Santa Fe, TX.

Some explosives found in connection to the Santa Fe High School mass shooting that killed 10 Friday were functional -- a revelation that could result in federal charges against 17-year-old Dimitrios Pagourtzis, authorities said Sunday.

Early reports indicated that bomb materials -- CO2 canisters wrapped with duct tape -- were non-operational. Testing by experts concluded that at least some of them were functional, officials said.

Explosives were reportedly found at the high school, at the teen's home and in a vehicle. Officials did not say where the functional devices were found.

Federal agents are continuing to investigate the shooting and test evidence, according to a source familiar with the investigation.

anta Fe ISD warned community members to avoid suspicious items Friday.

"There have been explosives devices found in the high school and surrounding areas adjacent to the high school," Santa Fe ISD tweeted around noon on Friday. "Because of the threat of explosive items, community members should be on the look-out for suspicious packages and anything that looks out of place."


We need common sense bomb control legislation.
#14916532
Finfinder wrote:The news makes these shooters famous they also use these shootings to broadcast their political agenda and are now using the children to advance it.

Conspiracy ? Please tell us about this upcoming extinction.

I think the saddest thing about our upcoming extinction is that lefists and green-types will use it to promote their own agendas.

The greens are a lot like gun-control-nuts that way. They use mass death as a way to manipulate people into thinking.

I really hope people wake up and realize this school shooting is simply an opportunity to practice thoughts and prayers production, and don't get fooled into thinking there's anything wrong with arming everyone (or destroying the environment).
#14916563
QatzelOk wrote:I think the saddest thing about our upcoming extinction


There's nothing sad about the end of a shit show. I'm pretty confident that some form of intelligent life will eventually arise on this planet and if the human race ends up being the channel for its emergence then the whole bloody slog was entirely worth it.
#14916691
So apparently he used a shotgun and a pistol, both guns (last I checked) that anti-gunners like @Godstud, were not suggesting new legislation on in other threads.

Thus, if semi-automatic weapons were *poof* instantly banned after Parkland, this shooting would still have occurred.

Banning all guns in the U.S. is not going to happen, thanks to the U.S. Constitution.

We have had guns for like ever. Everybody is comparing the U.S. gun violence to European gun-violence and inferring (fallaciously I might add) that the causal relationship is the prevalence of guns (cum hoc ergo propter hoc).

However, Americans, even when it had less gun restrictions, 50-100 years ago, did not have school shootings like we have now.

What this indicates is that the fallacy I am charging the anti-guns folks with holds, historically speaking. This is because even when the prevalence of guns was still high in the U.S. many years ago, school shootings were still low-to-non-existent.

Thus, guns are not, logically speaking, the causal explanation for the issue of school shootings we have been having.

This is also besides the fact that the populations in the U.S. with the highest rate of legal gun-ownership (rural whites) have some of the lowest rates of gun related crimes in the nation.

Let that sink in, the regions of the U.S. with the most AR-15s per capita are some of the safest places in the nation where people keep their doors unlocked and leave their car windows down!

Indeed, if we removed the urban crime rate of inner city blacks from U.S. crime statistics, the nation would be similarly safe as Europe. Indeed, a better correlation might be demographics, as the violent crimes committed even in Europe are likewise committed by minorities at a grossly disproportionate rate.

I'll give you another clue, there is something the gun-banning low-violence Japan shares with rural America which has high gun ownership and likewise low-violence....and its not guns. Its a traditional culture, ethnic-homogeneity, and general sanity.

But since that topic is "untouchable", lets just take all the guns based on fallacious inferences under the new motto of the left: "Fuck Logic! Fuck Guns!"

:roll:

However, none of this sentimentalism will change the fact that it is equally if not more rational to presume that the issue of U.S. rates of violent crime has more to do with being a post-Christian, nihilistic, multi-ethnic state as it has to do with rates of gun ownership or the lack thereof....OR, as others pointed out, that we have an over-medicated population that is, in high numbers, teetering on edge of sanity and mental health.

To be honest, these debates are as redundant and they are retarded, and in regards to U.S. law, the are ultimately futile.

Guns are here to stay and i'm afraid to say that the wackos are as well. Nothing is going to change anytime soon.

Carry on.
#14916699
Victoribus Spolia wrote:Thus, if semi-automatic weapons were *poof* instantly banned after Parkland, this shooting would still have occurred.

This argument is a non-starter. The obvious overblown comparison is like saying if nukes went poof, fertilizer-based bombs would still happen, so we shouldn't "regulate" nukes.
#14916703
Zagadka wrote:This argument is a non-starter. The obvious overblown comparison is like saying if nukes went poof, fertilizer-based bombs would still happen, so we shouldn't "regulate" nukes.


but the context of this objection was to the specific argument being made by those who have advocated for semi-automatic rifles as a solution to school shootings.

Which is patently false.

Your critique would only be valid if I made this claim as a "general one."

Which I wasn't.
#14916713
Zagadka wrote:It isn't the best solution and would by no means completely end the problem, but it is a reasonable one, especially given how many automatic weapons have been used.


Let me ask a few questions.

1. Did we have lesser or higher rates of school shootings when BOTH full automatic and semi-automatic rifles were not only legal but had less regulation (lets say the 1960s) or now when both are more greatly restricted (and some even banned)?

2. Is the rate of gun violence higher in rural communities with a higher per capita ownership of semi-automatic rifles, or in urban centers where the per capita ownership of guns is lower?

3. If there is not a demonstrable causal relationship between rates of legal gun ownership and rates of gun violence, in proportion, then on what rational grounds should a constitutional right be further encroached upon?

To me, it sounds like hysterics. Trying to legislate our way out of a complicated problem that cannot be legislated away and purely out of a spirit of media induced-panic propagated by those who seek to benefit politically by such a move.

The only losers in such scenario are law-abiding citizens, and the only winners are the bureaucrats.

Students WILL NOT be saved by more gun laws. Indeed, as we have had increased gun laws in the nation overall, shootings have increased, and just like it would be ridiculous to make too much of that correlation, the same is true of the inverse.

regulating for the sake of regulating is not the way to go.
#14916715
Victoribus Spolia wrote:.....

Indeed, if we removed the urban crime rate of inner city blacks from U.S. crime statistics, the nation would be similarly safe as Europe. Indeed, a better correlation might be demographics, as the violent crimes committed even in Europe are likewise committed by minorities at a grossly disproportionate rate.

I'll give you another clue, there is something the gun-banning low-violence Japan shares with rural America which has high gun ownership and likewise low-violence....and its not guns. Its a traditional culture, ethnic-homogeneity, and general sanity.

...

However, none of this sentimentalism will change the fact that it is equally if not more rational to presume that the issue of U.S. rates of violent crime has more to do with being a post-Christian, nihilistic, multi-ethnic state as it has to do with rates of gun ownership or the lack thereof....OR, as others pointed out, that we have an over-medicated population that is, in high numbers, teetering on edge of sanity and mental health.

.....


Hilarious.

When black people shoot someone or get shot, black people are to blame.

Now a white kid shoots up a school and black people are still to blame....
#14916719
Pants-of-dog wrote:Hilarious.

When black people shoot someone or get shot, black people are to blame.

Now a white kid shoots up a school and black people are still to blame....


Take a chill-pill cupcake.

Not blaming blacks, not really talking about race as my main point either, only pointed out that they make a disproportionate contribution to violent crime statistics and also in spite of lower per capita gun ownership (compared to rural whites) which is not news.

If we eliminated urban crime rates, and only took into account the crime rates for the demographic with the highest rate of gun ownership, we would have a scenario where the crime rate would be extremely low in the U.S.

This meaning, that guns cannot logically be the cause of the U.S.'s gun-crime statistics.
#14916722
Victoribus Spolia wrote:Take a chill-pill cupcake.

Not blaming blacks, not really talking about race as my main point either, only pointed out that they make a disproportionate contribution to violent crime statistics and also in spite of lower per capita gun ownership (compared to rural whites) which is not news.

If we eliminated urban crime rates, and only took into account the crime rates for the demographic with the highest rate of gun ownership, we would have a scenario where the crime rate would be extremely low in the U.S.

This meaning, that guns cannot logically be the cause of the U.S.'s gun-crime statistics.


This has nothing to do with school shootings.

It seems like you are trying to confuse school shootings with violence in general, and then using this confusion to blame black people.

People of colour are not disproportionately represented in school shootings.

This discussion about race is irrelevant, which makes me wonder why you brought it up. It makes even less sense than the people arguing for banning semi-autos.
#14916725
Pants-of-dog wrote:This has nothing to do with school shootings.

It seems like you are trying to confuse school shootings with violence in general, and then using this confusion to blame black people.

People of colour are not disproportionately represented in school shootings.

This discussion about race is irrelevant, which makes me wonder why you brought it up.


Triggered.

I already explained this.

Pants-of-dog wrote:It makes even less sense than the people arguing for banning semi-autos.


Well at least we agree that banning semi-automatic rifles doesn't make sense.....

You are becoming a more consistent communist every day PoD, congrats.

The grace of TIG and Potemkin shines upon you.
#14916727
Victoribus Spolia wrote:Triggered.

I already explained this.


Yes, you did repeat your irrelevant thing. And i then repeated why it is irrelevant.

Well at least we agree that banning semi-automatic rifles doesn't make sense.....

You are becoming a more consistent communist every day PoD, congrats.

The grace of TIG and Potemkin shines upon you.


If you think I ever argued for gun control, then your reading comprehension needs work. You are probably just incorrectly assuming I hold that position because of your preconceived notions about “liberals”.

If there was a type of gun control that would work for school shootings, it would be to arm leftist women and ban guns for everyone else. The vast majority of school shooters are men.
Last edited by Pants-of-dog on 21 May 2018 18:21, edited 1 time in total.
#14916732
Pants-of-dog wrote:If there was a type of gun control that would work for school shootings, it would be to arm leftist women and ban guns for everyone else. The vast majority of school shooters are men.


:eek:

PLEASE present your case for this.

It would absolutely make my day. :lol:
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