Is Trump a Kremlin stooge? - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14933214
Beren wrote:Do you think such a video is the only thing they have on Trump? The Trumps have been laundering money for the Russian mob for a while, for example. And what has he actually done to benefit Putin since his election prior to today? Well, I wonder if he could have deteriorated the North Atlantic relationship more than he's done so far. You've been here all along since he was elected, I wonder how you missed all that.

Didn't he shame the euros into spending more on defence? How is that helping Russia?
#14933220
B0ycey wrote:He thinks his allies are ripping him off. So he calls them out as foes.

Calling them out as foes and treating them accordingly is still too much in my view. However, it seems America just has to decide between Putin and their own intelligence community and allies.

SolarCross wrote:Didn't he shame the euros into spending more on defence? How is that helping Russia?

It doesn't help Russia, it helps the US military industrial complex, but I never said Putin is the only one whose interests Trump has to serve. It's a lot more complicated, but I'm sure Putin has a stake in Trump too.
#14933222
Beren wrote:Calling them out as foes and treating them accordingly is still too much in my view. However, it seems America just has to decide between Putin and their own intelligence community and allies.


Naturally. It is too much for anyone's view btw. But this is Trump we are talking about. He speaks out for what he thinks are correct. And he thinks the EU is ripping off the US. So he says things that harm relationships to please his supporters at home. Just like Johnson and his Brexiteers btw.

As for siding with Putin over his countries intelligence. Ask yourself why he would do this? The simple reason is to do so would declare his presidency has no legitimacy and no more than that I suspect. It is not rocket science.
User avatar
By maz
#14933224
SolarCross wrote:Didn't he shame the euros into spending more on defence? How is that helping Russia?


Don't forget that the president also criticized Germany for their reliance on Russian gas. How does that benefit Russia?
#14933227
B0ycey wrote:As for siding with Putin over his countries intelligence. Ask yourself why he would do this? The simple reason is to do so would declare his presidency has no legitimacy and no more than that I suspect. It is not rocket science.

You don't suspect more than that because you don't want to, like you insist on EUREF2 as well, although it's just wishful thinking. Maybe you should rather ask yourself why he's in conflict with the FBI and the rest while he's friends with Putin.
#14933229
Beren wrote:You don't suspect more than that because you don't want to, like you insist on EUREF2 as well, although it's just wishful thinking. Maybe you should rather ask yourself why he's in conflict with the FBI and the rest while he's friends with Putin.


Do you think I am naive Beren? He is in conflict with the FBI because I suspect there was Russian interference in the US election. And I suspect Trump knows and was part of it. So even less reason give the investigation any legitimacy today btw. So again, what were people expecting Trump to say today? It is as if people are somehow surprised by this for the sakes of being surprised.

As for EUREF2, it is wishful thinking, but only because the UK government has yet to understand that the 'White paper' will get rejected and the only way to spare Hard Brexit is by remaining in the EU. But this is slowly sinking in and today another MP
Acknowledged the bleeding obvious.
#14933232
Albert wrote:Trump is not a puppet of Russia, it is left-wing never-Trumpist propaganda.


No, Trump is a puppet of the Zionist lobby, not of Russia. Is that not obvious?

If Putin wanted to to control the USA, he would have subverted the American financial system, the academia, the MSM, created an ARPAC... and nobody in the USA would dare to say that Russia has any influence on the political process of the USA.

All these American MSM, owned by Russians, would repeat 24x7 that Russia is the best friend of the USA, and American taxpayers would pay money to support Russia.

Even if Russia had sunk an American ship and killed Americans, the MSM would call this "friendly fire" and any investigation would confirm that it was just a mistake, not a deliberate attack.

It does not make any sense to influence the American elections, because any POTUS is just a soldiers who has to follow the marching orders of people who were not elected.

Trump can single out some most hideous MSM-outlets and call them "fake news", but he would never dare to disobey the orders he gets from his real masters.
Last edited by ArtAllm on 16 Jul 2018 21:25, edited 3 times in total.
#14933233
B0ycey wrote:So again, what were people expecting Trump to say today? It is as if people are somehow surprised by this for the sakes of being surprised.

I don't have high expectations regarding Trump, but I didn't expect such a clusterfuck myself. Avoiding such clusterfucks is part of the art of politics. I'm not surprised he failed, though.
#14933241
anarchist23 quoting FakeNews wrote:US President Donald Trump, in a stunning rebuke of the US intelligence community, declined on Monday to endorse the US government's assessment that Russia interfered in the 2016 presidential election, saying he doesn't "see any reason why" Russia would be responsible.

Instead, Trump — standing alongside Russian President Vladimir Putin — touted Putin's vigorous denial and pivoted to complaining about the Democratic National Committee's server and missing emails from Hillary Clinton's personal account.

This is hilarious! Deep state is trying to conduct foreign policy independent of the president and he's shafting them! Awesome!

Rancid wrote:I am totally convinced that Russia has a prostitute video on him.

Trump is a buffoon, this guy really really needs to be thrown out.

I don't understand how his supposed red blooded patriotic base could support him in such bullshit?

Let's see: Medvedev (Putin) invades Georgia. Bush does nothing. Palin characterizes Russia as an American rival. She is lampooned on Saturday Night Live with Tina Fey mocking, "I can see Russia from my house." Obama later says about her, "You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig." Hillary Clinton and other warhawks sign off on selling American uranium mining equities to Russian interests. Bill Clinton takes $500k speaking fees in Moscow and the Clinton Foundation gets over $10M in donations from the procuring actors. Nobody says boo. During a 2012 presidential debate, Romney declares Russia a threat. Obama retorts, "The 80's called and they want their foreign policy back. Obama chides Putin as acting like a "tough guy" and "the bored kid in the back of the class." Putin annexes Crimea. Obama does nothing. DNC servers get hacked. Trump says that the system is rigged and that the election could be hacked. Obama tells the Russians to "knock it off" and then tells Trump in a news conference that there is no way a foreign power can hack our elections and that Trump should go out and make his case for votes.

Trump wins. Suddenly, the people pooh-poohing Russia now see Russia as the great bogeyman. Get real.

Rancid wrote:He certainly looks like a puppet to side with Russia rather than his own intelligence agency

They are obviously operating in a rogue manner and clearly don't like Trump. Hillary lost bigly to Trump. It was Heeeyuuuuge!

Rancid wrote:I'm telling you, there is a prostitution sex tape with Trump in it. I'm now damn sure of it.

And nobody cares. Even if they make prime time all network expose of it, Trump's approval numbers will probably go up, not down. If we have to approve of gay marriage, then a billionaire banging a porn star is no big deal.

Zagadka wrote:He's already literally on record sexually assaulting married women, and his Base just cheers.

Right. If you can show that he regularly performed felatio on Obama and was willingly sodomized by Obama, then you have scandal.

Rancid wrote:If it's not a sex tape, then it's the promise of a lot of business dealings in Russia. If he's not getting blackmailed, then he's somehow going to benefit.

It's a red herring. There's nothing there, but his detractors want to believe it. So he will keep the story alive, just like Obama kept the birther story alive.

SolarCross wrote:If it involved something really scandalous like children, corpses or animals then that would be pretty good leverage.

Right, or homosexuality. Maybe paying for abortions or something. The Russian thing clearly doesn't sell. I don't know why they waste so much time on it.

Beren wrote:I don't have high expectations regarding Trump, but I didn't expect such a clusterfuck myself. Avoiding such clusterfucks is part of the art of politics. I'm not surprised he failed, though.

It's by design. That's why we like him.
#14933242
blackjack21 wrote:It's by design. That's why we like him.

I'm sure it was by design to please his "base". It's easy to imagine him being glad while watching media coverage on his way home on the board of Air Force One.
#14933259
Donald Trump's voter base do not care about Russian meddling stories and his sex life. They do care about what the president does on immigration. He was elected through anti immigration platform and he will be easily re elected for another term.

I think it is not possible to get elected president with pro-,immigration manifesto. You have to be more hawkish on immigration than Trump. Your only way to White House. There is no other way possible.
#14933273
blackjack21 wrote:Right, or homosexuality. Maybe paying for abortions or something. The Russian thing clearly doesn't sell. I don't know why they waste so much time on it.

Desperation, they don't have anything else other than he likes tanning beds, has a trophy wife and supposedly has small hands, none of which are grounds for impeachment.
#14933306
Even Fox News...

Vladimir Putin ignores Fox News journalist who tries to show him election meddling indictment
VLADIMIR Putin laughed his way through a fiery interview but wasn’t happy when he was handed a controversial document.

The document which Mr Putin so brazenly ignored was released on the eve of today’s mega-meeting and it claims that twelve Russian military intelligence officers hacked into the Clinton presidential campaign and the Democratic Party.

These officers are said to have released tens of thousands of private communications in a sweeping conspiracy by the Kremlin to meddle in the 2016 US election.

The case follows a separate indictment that accused Russians of using social media to sow discord among American voters.

The 29-page indictment lays out how, months before Americans went to the polls, Russians schemed to break into key Democratic email accounts, including those belonging to Mrs Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta, the Democratic National Committee and the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. Stolen emails, many politically damaging for Mrs Clinton, appeared on WikiLeaks in the campaign’s final stretch.

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/le ... 94b5cf62c2

'An absolute disgrace': Republicans blast Trump for his 'disgusting' press conference with Putin
Some Republicans responded to Trump's remarks within moments of the press conference ending:

Sen. Ben Sasse of Nebraska issued a statement calling Trump's comment that both countries were responsible for the state of US-Russia relations "bizarre and flat-out wrong."

"The United States is not to blame," Sasse said. "America wants a good relationship with the Russian people but Vladimir Putin and his thugs are responsible for Soviet-style aggression. When the President plays these moral equivalence games, he gives Putin a propaganda win he desperately needs."

Rep. Justin Amash of Michigan tweeted that someone could be in favor of improved relations with Russia and of Trump meeting Putin "and still think something is not right here."

Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, a golfing partner of the president, called the event a "missed opportunity" for Trump "to firmly hold Russia accountable for 2016 meddling and deliver a strong warning regarding future elections."

He later added that he would advise Trump to "check the soccer ball" Putin gave him at the press conference "for listening devices and never allow it in the White House."

Sen. Jeff Flake of Arizona, who has frequently sparred with the president, described the remarks as "shameful."
"I never thought I would see the day when our American President would stand on the stage with the Russian President and place blame on the United States for Russian aggression," he said. "This is shameful."

Sen. Orrin Hatch of Utah, a close Trump ally, said in a statement that "Russia interfered in the 2016 election."
"Our nation's top intelligence agencies all agree on that point," he said. "From the President on down, we must do everything in our power to protect our democracy by securing future elections from foreign influence and interference, regardless of what Vladimir Putin or any other Russian operative says."

Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming, the daughter of former Vice President Dick Cheney, tweeted that she was "deeply troubled by President Trump's defense of Putin against the intelligence agencies of the U.S. & his suggestion of moral equivalence between the U.S. and Russia."

Sen. Bob Corker of Tennessee, who has bristled with Trump, said he "did not think this was a good moment for our country."
Sen. John McCain of Arizona, who also has not seen eye-to-eye with the president, said the press conference "was one of the most disgraceful performances by an American president in memory."

Rep. Trey Gowdy, the chairman of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, said in a statement that "Russia attempted to undermine the fundamentals of our democracy, impugn the reliability of the 2016 election, and sow the seeds of discord among Americans" and that he hoped Trump administration leaders "will be able to communicate to the President it is possible to conclude Russia interfered with our election in 2016 without delegitimizing his electoral success."
House Speaker Paul Ryan said in a statement that "there is no question that Russia interfered in our election and continues attempts to undermine democracy here and around the world."

"The president must appreciate that Russia is not our ally," Ryan continued. "There is no moral equivalence between the United States and Russia, which remains hostile to our most basic values and ideals. The United States must be focused on holding Russia accountable and putting an end to its vile attacks on democracy."

Other Republicans called Trump's remarks "outrageous," "an absolute disgrace," and "moronic." A former chairman of the Republican National Committee even said Trump was acting as if he were an "asset" next to his "handler."

http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-pu ... ond-2018-7
#14933315
The problem may have been that the whole event couldn't be run by a script written by the Kremlin. Putin was great and well-prepared, but he couldn't tell him what and how to say, so Trump was ill-prepared and spontaneous as usual. Maybe his "great success" with Kim and 18 months in office made him believe he's a masterful statesman that can easily handle a joint press conference like that.
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