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User avatar
By BigSteve
#15012507
Godstud wrote:It was Iran's money...[/b]


So what?

There had already been a precedent set for not giving back to them what was theirs.

After the revolution in Iran in 1979, we kept four warships which Iran had bought and paid for. They ended up becoming the Kidd Class guided missile destroyers in the US fleet (I served on USS Chandler, DDG-996).

The argument of "It was their money" rings hollow...
User avatar
By Drlee
#15012524
There is a difference between sanction and confiscation of property. Clearly you and I would both favor confiscation of all of the money that Russia has on deposit in US banks and investments.
User avatar
By Godstud
#15012547
BigSteve wrote:The argument of "It was their money" rings hollow...
Yes. Don't let facts get in the way of your ignorance.
User avatar
By BigSteve
#15012566
Godstud wrote:Yes. Don't let facts get in the way of your ignorance.


The facts are that Obama signed off on giving $150 billion to arguably the world's largest state sponsor of terrorism.

That makes no sense on any level...
User avatar
By Drlee
#15012569
The facts are that Obama signed off on giving $150 billion to arguably the world's largest state sponsor of terrorism.

That makes no sense on any level...


And it is not true either. Obama did not sign off on "giving" $150 billion to Iran. Full stop. So you can drop that shit entirely.

The money that Iran got access to was theirs to start with. Further the $150 billion figure is more Trump bullshit. In a tweet he wrote:



The Democrats and President Obama gave Iran 150 Billion Dollars and got nothing, but they can’t give 5 Billion Dollars for National Security and a Wall?

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 12, 2018


This was a bald face lie. Everyone who is surprised raise your hand. :roll:

Here is what testimony before the republican controlled senate was:

We must also be measured and realistic in understanding what sanctions relief will really mean to Iran. Estimates of total Central Bank of Iran (CBI) foreign exchange assets worldwide are in the range of $100 to $125 billion. Our assessment is that Iran’s usable liquid assets after sanctions relief will be much lower, at a little more than $50 billion. The other $50-70 billion of total CBI foreign exchange assets are either obligated in illiquid projects (such as over 50 projects with China) that cannot be monetized quickly, if at all, or are composed of outstanding loans to Iranian entities that cannot repay them. These assets would not become accessible following sanctions relief.


Nader Habibi, professor of economics of the Middle East at Brandeis University, told us via email his best estimate was that between $30 billion and $50 billion of unfrozen funds were made available to Iran as a result of the deal.

On 8 May 2018, President Trump announced that he was pulling the U.S. out of the nuclear deal with Iran, which had been negotiated over the course of two years.


And I will remind you again, so you do not misunderstand, none of this money came from the US taxpayer. Nor did the US "pay" Iran $1.7 billion for the deal. I don't expect any right winger to bother to understand what was going on, understand what the tribunal at the Hague was all about, or have the comprehension to put it together if he/she tried. Suffice it to say that Bush released about $600 million in Iranian assets and we did not hear a peep.

But this is not about the truth because I simply do not know a Trump supporter who gives a rats ass about the truth. Not one.

Now I don't like Iran. I think we should have stayed in the deal which was working. I also do not favor a war with them though God knows they desperately need an ass whipping. It is a despicable country with a horrible record not only on terror but also on human rights. But to go to war with them now? I don't think anyone here is deceived by what that would be all about.
User avatar
By Godstud
#15012570
:roll:
@BigSteve it was an agreement to stop nuclear research done by Iran, which makes complete sense.

AGAIN. It was no $150 billion. Repeating a lie isn't going to make it true, @BigSteve.

Saudi Arabia is the largest state sponsor of terrorism. Your facts are not straight, and USA has no problem making deals with Saudi Arabia. :knife:

The Real Largest State Sponsor Of Terrorism
Saudi Arabia—not Iran—is the biggest state sponsor of terrorism in the world today and Wahhabism remains the source of most radical Islamic extremism. For years Iran has borne the unenviable title of “world’s biggest state sponsor of terrorism.” However, out of the 61 groups that are designated as terrorist organizations by the U.S. State Department, the overwhelming majority are Wahhabi-inspired and Saudi-funded groups, with a focus on the West and Iran as their primary enemy. Only two are Shi’a—Hezbollah and Kataib Hezbollah, and only four have ever claimed to receive support from Iran. Nearly all of the Sunni militant groups listed receive significant support from either the Saudi government or Saudi citizens.
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-real ... 05db4da8aa

But hey, don't let facts get in the way of ignorance.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15012585
Drlee wrote:But this is not about the truth because I simply do not know a Trump supporter who gives a rats ass about the truth. Not one.

It is certainly clear that you do not give a rats ass about the truth.

On 22 May 2015, President Obama signed the Iran Nuclear Agreement Review Act of 2015 into law;[g] this legislation passed by the Senate in a 98-1 vote and the House in a 400-25 vote, and was approved by President Obama on 22 May 2015. Under the Act, once a nuclear agreement was negotiated with Iran, Congress had sixty days in which it could pass a resolution of approval, a resolution of disapproval, or do nothing. The Act also included additional time beyond the sixty days for the president to veto a resolution and for Congress to take a vote on whether to override or sustain the veto. Republicans could only defeat the deal if they mustered the two-thirds of both houses of Congress needed to override an expected veto by Obama of any resolution of disapproval.

In comments made in the East Room of the White House on 15 July 2015, President Obama urged Congress to support the agreement, saying "If we don't choose wisely, I believe future generations will judge us harshly, for letting this moment slip away."

Also on 15 July, Vice President Joe Biden met with Senate Democrats on the Foreign Relations Committee on Capitol Hill, where he made a presentation on the agreement.

On 18 July, Obama devoted his weekly radio address to the agreement, stating, "this deal will make America and the world safer and more secure" and rebutting "a lot of overheated and often dishonest arguments about it". Obama stated "as commander-in-chief, I make no apology for keeping this country safe and secure through the hard work of diplomacy over the easy rush to war." On 23 July, President Obama met in the White House Cabinet Room with about a dozen undecided House Democrats to speak about the agreement and seek their support.

A hearing on the JCPOA before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee took place on 23 July 2015. Secretary of State Kerry, Treasury Secretary Jack Lew, and Energy Secretary Moniz testified. Republican Senator Bob Corker of Tennessee, the committee chairman, said in his opening statement that when the talks began the goal was to dismantle the Iranian nuclear program, whereas the achieved agreement codified "the industrialization of their nuclear program".[252][253] Corker, addressing Secretary of State Kerry, said, "I believe you've been fleeced" and "... what you've really done here is you have turned Iran from being a pariah to now Congress, Congress being a pariah." Corker asserted that a new threshold in U.S. foreign policy was crossed and the agreement would "enable a state sponsor of terror to obtain sophisticated, industrial nuclear development program that has, as we know, only one real practical need".

On 30 July, Republican Senator Ted Cruz of Texas introduced a resolution seeking a delay in the review period, arguing, "The 60-calendar day period for review of such agreement in the Senate cannot be considered to have begun until the Majority Leader certifies that all of the materials required to be transmitted under the definition of the term 'agreement' under such Act, including any side agreements with Iran and United States Government-issued guidance materials in relation to Iran, have been transmitted to the Majority Leader."

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky, said the deal "appears to fall well short of the goal we all thought was trying to be achieved, which was that Iran would not be a nuclear state".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Com ... _of_Action

U.S. Sent Cash to Iran as Americans Were Freed

The Obama administration secretly organized an airlift of $400 million worth of cash to Iran that coincided with the January release of four Americans detained in Tehran, according to U.S. and European officials and congressional staff briefed on the operation afterward.

Wooden pallets stacked with euros, Swiss francs and other currencies were flown into Iran on an unmarked cargo plane, according to these officials. The U.S. procured the money from the central banks of the Netherlands and Switzerland, they said.

U.S. Payment of $1.7 Billion to Iran Raises Questions of Ransom

A deal that sent $1.7 billion in U.S. funds to Iran, announced alongside the freeing of five Americans from Iranian jails, has emerged as a new flashpoint amid a claim in Tehran that the transaction amounted to a ransom payment.

The U.S. Treasury Department wired the money to Iran around the same time its theocratic government allowed three American prisoners to fly out of Tehran on Sunday aboard a Dassault Falcon jet owned by the Swiss air force.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-paymen ... 1453421778

U.S. to pay Iran $1.7 billion in legal settlement

The U.S. State Department announced the government had agreed to pay Iran $1.7 billion to settle a case related to the sale of military equipment prior to the Iranian revolution, according to a statement issued on Sunday.

The settlement comes as the U.S. is unfreezing a much larger pool of Iranian assets, estimated at between $100-$150 billion, as part of the nuclear deal.

https://www.cnn.com/2016/01/17/politics ... 7-billion/
User avatar
By Godstud
#15012587
FFS, read what you post...
From the article wrote:The U.S. State Department announced the government had agreed to pay Iran $1.7 billion to settle a case related to the sale of military equipment prior to the Iranian revolution


The $1.7 Billion was a debt, that was owed to Iran, by the USA.

The $150 Billion in frozen assets was not $150 Billion, but around $55 Billion. I used a more recent source than you did(2018), and the previous amount was an overblown estimate.

This money was not American money, but IRANIAN money. USA didn't spend a dime on anything it didn't have to, @Hindsite.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15012595
Godstud wrote:FFS, read what you post...


The $1.7 Billion was a debt, that was owed to Iran, by the USA.

The $150 Billion in frozen assets was not $150 Billion, but around $55 Billion. I used a more recent source than you did(2018), and the previous amount was an overblown estimate.

This money was not American money, but IRANIAN money. USA didn't spend a dime on anything it didn't have to, @Hindsite.

That $55 Billion is another lie from the left.
How Obama Secretly Gave Iran Access To Billions Of Dollars — And Enabled Terrorism

Obama and his officials at the Treasury Department and State Department were clear: They would work assiduously to freeze out Iran from getting dollars to fund its mischief and mayhem around the world.

The Associated Press, puts it this way: "As the Treasury and State Department worked behind the scenes to help Iran access the dollar, the message to Congress remained the same: The JCPOA (Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action) did not allow Iran to access the U.S. financial system."

Obama sent a clear message to Congress: If you don't block this nuclear deal, we will bar Iran's access to our financial system.

Obama lied, and so did others in his administration.

That's the conclusion of a report by the Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations. It alleges Obama officials pushed the U.S. Treasury to let Iran convert the equivalent of $5.7 billion of funds held in Oman's Bank of Muscat from rials into dollars and subsequently into euros.

It required a special license by the U.S. Treasury, which was granted in February of 2016. But it was never disclosed, either to Congress or the American people.

Washington Times national security correspondent Bill Gertz in February of this year reported that some of the $1.7 billion that the Obama administration officially handed over to the Iranians had ended up in the hands of terrorist groups. Those terrorist groups included Hezbollah, the Houthi rebels in Yemen, and Iran's own Quds Force, the dirty tricks and terror branch of the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps.

No one knows how much of the $5.7 billion that Obama allowed Iran to access also went to terrorist activities. Or, for that matter, how much went to further research activity on Iran's nuclear bomb project. That awaits a later investigation.

But it's important to note that the Iran nuclear deal also removed some $100 billion in sanctions on Iran. This made Iran once again a big player in the Mideast. It's almost certain that a good piece of that went to the Islamic Revolutionary Guards, which by some accounts control as much as 40% of Iran's economy.

It's clear from Obama administration actions, under both his Secretaries of State, Hillary Clinton and John Kerry, that the Obama White House despised Israel and did all they could to undermine its security. How else can you explain the enabling of a terrorist-supporting regime?

The Obama administration failed to enforce its own "red line" in Syria on chemical weapons. By doing so, it in effect invited both Russia and Iran into that disintegrating country. Iranian troops today are within striking distance of our one true ally in the region, Israel.

The disintegration of Libya, the collapse of Egypt, and Turkey's embrace of radical Islam, all took place under Obama's watch. None of them were in the U.S.' interest.

All of this because the Obama administration signed a deal that not only didn't end Tehran's nuclear program, but merely postponed it for a decade, all while doing nothing about its terrorist activities. Now we find that Obama also helped finance that.

Paying to support terrorism, and not telling the American people about it. Still think the Obama administration was "scandal-free"?

https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... terrorism/
User avatar
By Godstud
#15012596
:roll: Removing sanctions and letting Iran have their money back, is not USA giving them money. Trump's a liar. The people who propagate this myth of USA giving $Billions to Iran, are also liars.

@Hindsite You always call things you don't like, fake news. Grow up.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15012599
Godstud wrote::roll: Removing sanctions and letting Iran have their money back, is not USA giving them money. Trump's a liar. The people who propagate this myth of USA giving $Billions to Iran, are also liars.

@Hindsite You always call things you don't like, fake news. Grow up.

When you disagree with Trump, you call him a liar. Grow up.
User avatar
By Godstud
#15012602
That Trump lies is a fact, and very much supported by numerous sources. That you can't come to grips with this only shows that you've bought his con.

Obama Didn’t Give Iran ‘150 Billion in Cash’
https://www.factcheck.org/2019/03/obama ... n-in-cash/

Trump makes repetitious false claims regarding Iran
https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2018/12/ ... -Democrats

FACT CHECK - Trump’s Favorite Iran-Obama Cash Story, Still Bogus No Matter How Often He Tells It
https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-new ... -1.6032057
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15012616
Godstud wrote:That Trump lies is a fact, and very much supported by numerous sources. That you can't come to grips with this only shows that you've bought his con.

Obama Didn’t Give Iran ‘150 Billion in Cash’
https://www.factcheck.org/2019/03/obama ... n-in-cash/

Trump makes repetitious false claims regarding Iran
https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2018/12/ ... -Democrats

FACT CHECK - Trump’s Favorite Iran-Obama Cash Story, Still Bogus No Matter How Often He Tells It
https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-new ... -1.6032057

Is Fake News all you have?
HalleluYah
User avatar
By Godstud
#15012620
Is that the only thing your piss-lord Trump has taught you?
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15012625
Godstud wrote:Is that the only thing your piss-lord Trump has taught you?

Not hardly, since Trump is a genius and the Trump of God.
Praise the Lord.
User avatar
By Drlee
#15012677
The complexities of the case before the international tribunal is far to complicated for Hindsite or Trump supporters to understand. Besides. They don't want to anyway. IF I try to explain that the money Obama transferred was not only money we owed Iran but a fraction of the actual amount he simply would not understand or want to.

So I will leave it at that. The claim that Obama gave Iran 150 billion dollars is hogwash.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15012700
Since taking office Obese Donald has relentlessly favored the wealthy over members of the working class, whatever their skin color. His only major legislative success, the 2017 tax cut, was a huge break for corporations and business owners; the handful of crumbs thrown at ordinary families was so small that most people believe they got nothing at all.

At the same time, he keeps trying to destroy key provisions of Obamacare — protection for pre-existing conditions, premium subsidies and the expansion of Medicaid — even though these provisions are highly popular and have been of enormous benefit to states like Kentucky and West Virginia that favored him by huge margins.
By Finfinder
#15012703
The complexities of the case before the international tribunal is far to complicated for Hindsite or Trump supporters to understand. Besides. They don't want to anyway. IF I try to explain that the money Obama transferred was not only money we owed Iran but a fraction of the actual amount he simply would not understand or want to.

So I will leave it at that. The claim that Obama gave Iran 150 billion dollars is hogwash.



He certainly facilitated it and played king maker after 25 years. Your spin is the better spin? LOL
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15012734
jimjam wrote:Since taking office Obese Donald has relentlessly favored the wealthy over members of the working class, whatever their skin color. His only major legislative success, the 2017 tax cut, was a huge break for corporations and business owners; the handful of crumbs thrown at ordinary families was so small that most people believe they got nothing at all.

At the same time, he keeps trying to destroy key provisions of Obamacare — protection for pre-existing conditions, premium subsidies and the expansion of Medicaid — even though these provisions are highly popular and have been of enormous benefit to states like Kentucky and West Virginia that favored him by huge margins.

Dobbs: The Obama legacy has become one of shame
Published on Aug 18, 2016
User avatar
By Drlee
#15012778
He certainly facilitated it and played king maker after 25 years. Your spin is the better spin? LOL


Obama helped pass an internationally very popular treaty. So popular that the rest of the world is abiding by it. Still.

Ah grasshopper. My spin is very powerful.
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