@Palmyrene
Yeah I know. I referred to the Levant because the earliest records of Arabic originate around there.
Then Greek must also originate from the Levant.
I can't find death tolls for the initial Byzantine and Persian conquests because they were started in antiquity and any records of death tolls would be woefully incorrect.
Early Islamic empires rampaged around the world destroying and killing people in mass. Far more than western empires.
Both are bad, but Arab and Islamic empires are worse.
If the Arabs and Muslims had the same tech western empires had, it would've been even worse.
Lebanon as a concept is not a local idea.
Lebanon and it's current borders were mentioned since the earliest inventions of writing.
Far before empires came along.
The formalized version of Greater Lebanon that the French succeeded in implementing is Lebanon today. Hell, the wikipedia page when searching for Greater Lebanon redirects you to the main Lebanon page and says that "Greater Lebanon" is another name for "Lebanon".
The wikipedia page shows you the map intended to be greater Lebanon, and then directs you to the page for Lebanon
where it mentions it as a chapter in Lebanese history.
French dealings with Lebanese people predates this era.
Lebanon is not geographically defined or was originally a concept at all.
It's literally surrounded by mountains. How exactly is this not a geographic border?
For most of it's history, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Palestine have all been grouped together in one province.
False.
The region was called the Levant, however within it were multiple kingdoms and nations.
Lebanon was its own nation. Palestine was one with Gaza separate on its own. Jordan was 2 nations, the north was ruled by Al-Ghazawi tribe (which still hold royal titles) and the south was ruled by the Idwan tribe (which the killing of the Idwan prince during the foundation of Jordan and the Hashimite rule is still controversial and occasionally lead to clashes between the southern tribes and the army, especially in Ma'an).
Syria, likewise, was multiple nations where Damascus, Aleppo, and Latakia were all capitals; With the tribes in Al-Jazeera (arab al hadid) being self-governing.
They're semi-nomadic meaning that they were settled in the area.
The parts that settled, settled by mixing with already existing settled peoples and tribes.
That's how nomads always settled in the era of civilizations.
I know? I don't see how that has to do with me saying that Arabs weren't all nomadic and that they lived in Lebanon for centuries. You seem to be responding to the wrong part of my post.
Because the example you gave of Arabs in Lebanon is wrong, the ones you mentioned aren't Arabs, the Aramaean.
There were Arab migrants over the ages, the Druze are an example along with other tribes, and if you go to Lebanon now they still identify as Arabs and everyone refers to them as Arabs in reference to their nomadic origins before migrating and settling in Lebanon.
Talk to anyone in Lebanon, open the topic of people in Anjar, west Beqa' in general, South east, and they'll refer to them as Arabs. Because they're distinctly Arabs, and not native.
What? You think humans didn't originate from Africa?
Both the prior claim and this question are retarded.
Look up what the word native means.
Then they're Assyrian or Aramiac
Aramaic, though their language is dead.
unless they engage in Arab customs
1- There is barely any such thing, each nation has its own traditions and customs (Beduoin customs are not all there is)
2- They don't. They're their own nation with their own history and tradition.
but they most certainly do not represent the majority of Lebanese and just because a minority doesn't speak Arabic or identifies as such doesn't meam the entire population is exactly the same.
There are tons of groups in Lebanon, there is literally no majority in Lebanon, it's a country of minorities as it had always been.
Even if we go back 4000 years in history, Lebanon was still a collection of independent city states with a net of alliances and unions between them and it will always be like that. That doesn't mean there is no such thing as Lebanon, because if it did, then there wont be such thing as a Greek or Italian or German, or Russian, etc identities.
A shared Lebanese identity arose during the Canaanite era 4000 years ago wherein the area was defined as Lebanon from the northern black mountains, to the north of Judea, and from the anti-lebanon (Nahl) mountains to the sea. And everyone started seeing themselves as Lebanese due to the massive cultural expansion that came with the early inventions of writing.
Is Syria suddenly not Arab because Assyrians exist?
It sure does seem like many Syrians don't like the current state and seem to act in accordance with the old traditional borders they used to have before colonial rule. Weird.
Is Iraq no longer Arab because a small village speaks Aramiac?
Iraqis are a mixture of Arabs and Persians. Sunnis are made up of Kurds ( not Arab), and an extension of the Jazeera tribes (Arabs), while Shias are mainly of the Shommari people who are mixed between Arabs and Persians and have distinct identity. This is another example of why colonial borders are useless.
I thought Muwahhiden is the Arabic name for them and Druze is the English name?
Druze is what Sunnis call them, and Muwahiden is what they call themselves.
That's strange since the Muwahhiden I've talked to said that they believe that in tanzih, that God is unity and that, unlike Muslims, they believe that there are no attributes of God distinct from his essence.
ok? What does this has to do with what I said?
Is any one of your Muwahhiden family members an uqqal?
Nope.
Those are very rare.
Do you have any evidence that there even is a standard classification of ethnic groups in the Middle East? Ethnicity is a cultural concept.
You can literally just check for the classification of Semitic people online, it's out there.
And no, it's not a cultural concept, you're referring to nationality which is a different thing.
Also Lebanese abroad would only be Arab if they identify as such. Lebanese is a nationality so of course they'd technically be "Lebanese".
Lebanese is both a nationality and an ethnicity.
So they identify as both.
The fact that there's bidets in bathrooms with electricity.
As is with most of Asia and Africa. How distinct.
Dakbe is common in weddings in Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, and Palestine.
Also common in Iran, Turkey, Iraq, Turkmenstan, Uzbekistan, Armenia, Azerbijan, most of central Asia in general.
But true, Dabke is most commonly seen in the Levant (Not all of the Arab world unsurprisingly), and it is distinct between countries and nations.
Lebanese Dabke is different from Northern Dabke in Jordan, which is distinct from southern Dabke in Jordan for example.
Belly dancing is the most famous one.
As is with most of the middle east and central Asia, so not Arab per say.
The maqamat style of music is popular around the world.
Not sure what that is but anyways.
The prominence of public baths around the area.
Turkish.
Mezze being a common before meals.
1- It's also in Iran.
And 2- It's different between countries.
Basically, it's appetizers, just like it is all around the world.
Thobes and some kind of headress being common in rural areas.
1- Again, common all over the middle east, central and south Asia.
2- In Lebanon mainly for religious people, and for Shias, for Asyad and Imams.
No I'm absolutely sure that's wrong. I've went to Lebanon to visit some relatives there and you can tell who's Arab and who isn't mostly because non-Arabs are talked about by Arabs.
You mean, foreigners are talked about. Don't worry, we talk about Syrians in Lebanon just like, if not worse, than we talk about Ethiopians and all other foreigners.
The common feature isn't non-Arab, it's non-Lebanese. And it's not hard to tell them apart actually, we Lebanese people talk in two very specific patterns and styles due to our speech being a mixture of several languages, one in the mountains and one in the coast, so it's very easy to tell who isn't Lebanese in Lebanon.
I'm sure if you've been to Lebanon, you noticed how every Lebanese person immediately knew you're not Lebanese.
English is the language of business (and it's generally seen as "cool" by the youth) there. Saying it's common is ridiculous.
I was talking about the languages I use as a reply to you prior statement.
You said they had a church.
Aramiac Christian Church is near by is what I said.
No. If anything they're Kurdish and some Arabs and Turks. Assyrians in Syria aren't really concentrated in one place in particular (Iraqi Assyrians are located in Eastern Central Iraq) so you're wrong on both accounts.
They ethnically are, even if not culturally.
Alevis are Turkish not Alawites. Alawites have an Arab origin.
They both hold the same religion and beliefs and are heavily mixed with each other due to them historically being one ethnicity and community.
It's also why Syria still maintains its claim on the Eskandarona region of Turkey.
Burakumin are a considered a differeny ethnic group even if they're genetically identical to native Japanese. The same goes for the different castes of India. Stop ignoring this.
You're conflating ethnic groups with caste systems.
India is made up of dozens of ethnic groups separate of the caste system.
Japanese people are made up of several ethnic groups, Japanese is a nationality not an ethnic group. They simply have a majority ethnicity so we often confuse the two.
Even in Middle Eastern ethnic groups it's difficult to see the differences between them. In each of Arabs, Persians, Kurds, etc. there are a wide range of physical features from blond, blue eyed people to dark skinned almost African people. And they would still be Arab, Persian, Kurdish, etc.
Here is a quick way to know the difference; Go on google images and search Lebanese people. Then search for Syrian Beduoins, then Iraqi Shias, then Kurds, then Northern Persians, then southern Persians, then Yemenis and look carefully at each of the sets you get.
You'll get distinct physical features that are prevalent in each of these groups because they're different ethnic groups.