The Next UK PM everybody... - Page 27 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

Political issues and parties in Europe's nation states, the E.U. & Russia.

Moderator: PoFo Europe Mods

Forum rules: No one line posts please. This is an international political discussion forum, so please post in English only.
#15032903
snapdragon wrote:Well, look at the opposition.

I wouldn't vote Labour with Corbyn as leader in normal circumstances, but these aren't normal circumstances, so I probably will.

I'm sure many other people feel the same way, especially as he's now stated Labour will campaign to remain and will ditch his fence sitting.



Sure, he dropped his Lib Dem act of sitting on the fence,but the fool came off on the 'wrong' side & fell head first into a cow pat. :lol: :lol:




Seeing as John BERCOW has carried out his wish in parliament, he has decided to step down by the election or exit date from europe.

Ok, so he got his wish by failing to keep to procedure rules,so, I would like to suggect to BoJo, that when he wins the election to come,that he introduces a specific law aimed at John BERCOW.
That law, passed in parliament, will withdraw any pension entitlements that have accrued to himself whilst acting as the Speaker, including any 'severence' payments & any that have been made are recovered.

I'm sure the law would pass without 'opposition' & in full accord with 'procedures' of the House.
#15034291
I have to revise my last posts about the prospects of the LibDems. They have gone over the edge in the last few days and it's hard to see how they're going to beat Labour with such an extreme position.
#15034452
People saying that Lib Dems are not a threat are posting how bad the Lib Dems are. You don't criticise parties that are not a threat. I am loving this. Tories and Labour feelies are hurt?
#15034888
I'm taking into account FPTP and how I think fanatical remainers are distributed around the country. The percentages you see in the polls don't necessarily translate into seats.
#15034933
Kaiserschmarrn wrote:I have to revise my last posts about the prospects of the LibDems. They have gone over the edge in the last few days and it's hard to see how they're going to beat Labour with such an extreme position.

They seem to have gone up a couple of points in the poll of polls. :)

I have argued that the in / out referendum should have been treated with total and utter contempt, that of course includes when it was proposed by the Lib Dems in 2007.
#15034976
Forgot the past. She intends to call off Brexit, which is good enough for me.
Look, their time is limited. Brexit is forever.
#15035031
Rich wrote:They seem to have gone up a couple of points in the poll of polls. :)

They need more than that to beat Labour when it comes to seats.

My original thoughts were that the LibDems might be able to unite Remain voters if both parties had a similar policy and if people got the impression that the LibDems could actually win. They have now set themselves apart quite clearly and hence in my view have reduced their chances.

And as always, I might be wrong. :)
#15035040
Kaiserschmarrn wrote:They need more than that to beat Labour when it comes to seats.

My original thoughts were that the LibDems might be able to unite Remain voters if both parties had a similar policy and if people got the impression that the LibDems could actually win. They have now set themselves apart quite clearly and hence in my view have reduced their chances.

And as always, I might be wrong. :)

What is the alternative? To argue for winning a General Election, when ever that takes place and then argue for a fourth extension, beyond the 31st Jan, so as you can renegotiate a deal, which you can then put to a referendum, which you then recommend that the British people reject? What happens if the British public vote for the deal? Are you then going to implement it? Why would you want to own an a deeply uninspiring soft Brexit deal.

And that's with out going into the question of whether you can have a referendum without offering a no-deal option. The Lib Dem's job is to rebuild their position, establish themselves as the serious third party after the disaster of the coalition. I was watching Ed Davey, it looked like he's been reading my posts. The Lib Dems have no responsibility to deliver the Tory referendum. Where he was at fault was defending the Lib Dems call for an in out referendum in 2007. It was a cynical ploy and they should own up to it.

There may well be a Tory majority or a Tory / DUP /Brexit majority after the next election. There's no way the Lib Dems can stop that from happening. The best chance of stopping a Tory and partners majority would be for Labour to look serious about delivering a Brexit deal. With the benefit of hind sight, I think Labour should have attempted to engage in parallel negotiations with the EU. They should have attempted to negotiate an alternative deal. The EU would almost certainly have rejected such a demand, but that wouldn't matter, as long as Labour looked like it had a clear vision and plan for delivering a Brexit.

Labour's strategy has been to hope that the Tories would deliver Brexit, they've never wanted to take responsibility for the Brexit situation. Both Boris and the LIB Dems are taking responsibility for ending the Brexit impasse, even if many think they are doing it in irresponsible ways.
#15035047
Rich wrote:What is the alternative? To argue for winning a General Election, when ever that takes place and then argue for a fourth extension, beyond the 31st Jan, so as you can renegotiate a deal, which you can then put to a referendum, which you then recommend that the British people reject? What happens if the British public vote for the deal? Are you then going to implement it? Why would you want to own an a deeply uninspiring soft Brexit deal.

Something like this which was the LibDem policy before they came out for revoke. In that case think their chances of beating Labour would have been higher.

Whether they want to own an unpopular Brexit is neither here nor there, and owning revoke is surely even more unpopular. There is no easy way out of this for remainers I'm afraid.

Rich wrote:And that's with out going into the question of whether you can have a referendum without offering a no-deal option. The Lib Dem's job is to rebuild their position, establish themselves as the serious third party after the disaster of the coalition. I was watching Ed Davey, it looked like he's been reading my posts. The Lib Dems have no responsibility to deliver the Tory referendum. Where he was at fault was defending the Lib Dems call for an in out referendum in 2007. It was a cynical ploy and they should own up to it.

There may well be a Tory majority or a Tory / DUP /Brexit majority after the next election. There's no way the Lib Dems can stop that from happening. The best chance of stopping a Tory and partners majority would be for Labour to look serious about delivering a Brexit deal. With the benefit of hind sight, I think Labour should have attempted to engage in parallel negotiations with the EU. They should have attempted to negotiate an alternative deal. The EU would almost certainly have rejected such a demand, but that wouldn't matter, as long as Labour looked like it had a clear vision and plan for delivering a Brexit.

Labour's strategy has been to hope that the Tories would deliver Brexit, they've never wanted to take responsibility for the Brexit situation. Both Boris and the LIB Dems are taking responsibility for ending the Brexit impasse, even if many think they are doing it in irresponsible ways.

What's this idea that the referendum is a Tory referendum? The LibDems voted to hold it too, as did Labour.

All I know for certain about Labour's position is that the party is divided, no less than the Tories, with Labour MPs often seemingly contradicting Corbyn.
#15035891
I'm leaning towards the view that prorogation was a mistake. I did feel it might have been better for Boris to have Parliment sitting, keeping him in office but not in power.

Anyway Jeremy Corbyn has laid down the gauntlet, taunting Boris with being the shortest PM in history. So its game on! Fantastic. Boris has got to survive another 58 days, he's got to hang on for 69 days to over take George Canning.
#15035902
Rich wrote:I'm leaning towards the view that prorogation was a mistake.

It definitely appears so indeed, constitutionally speaking BoJo now looks like Trump on steroids. Trump's greatest challenge to the constitution has been that he called a fake emergency to get $5+ billion for his wall without congressional approval. :lol:
#15035903
Beren wrote:It definitely appears so indeed, constitutionally speaking BoJo now looks like Trump on steroids. Trump's greatest challenge to the constitution has been that he called a fake emergency to get $5+ billion for his wall without congressional approval. :lol:

Hmm... I wonder what Tiberius Gracchus' next move will be.... :excited:
#15035956
B0ycey wrote:Just leaning? :lol:

Understandment of the year.

I'm a great fan of the British upper class's understatement and stiff upper lip, as exemplified in "Carry On up the Khyber." Interestingly up the khyber is actually more realistic than "A Bridge to Far", which quite falsely portrays Captain Frost as running across the road.

However I was not trying to understate in this case. I think we should always be wary (I would not go as far as to say chary) of criticising the strategy and tactics of our political /ideological enemies /opponents/ competitors. Hence although I definitely didn't want an in / out referendum (I did want a Lisbon treaty referendum), I think it was the right move to promise the referendum in 2013, to further Cameron's primary goals of preserving the position of the Tory party and his own premiership.

It was also the price for his other big priority, pushing through Gay Marriage. No "Call me Dave", wasn't going to trust the unkempt masses with a vote on that one. The significance of this has been badly missed by the commentate. Cameron ended the Conservative party as a traditional Christian Conservative party. Christianity with Gay marriage is Christianity in name only. If David Cameron is the Toussaint L'Ouverture of British Conservatism, will Boris prove to be its Jean-Jacques Dessalines.
  • 1
  • 25
  • 26
  • 27
  • 28
  • 29
  • 48

Rich's post could potentially be Anti-semetic, lo[…]

In other words, believers must be "the leave[…]

@blackjack21 this is your opportunity to argue yo[…]

@jimjam is watching it though No, I quote other[…]