Trump hands over Syria to Turkey then threatens to "totally destroy & obliterate" her economy if... - Page 16 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15042994
Presvias wrote:Sorry, but no.

You are brainwashed by years of Greek-fried "the turks are always the enemy" propaganda.

They committed mass human rights abuses and that is unaccrptable in any war. They're as bad as the Turkish army is and they've mass persecuted their own fellow Kurdish people terribly.

(The waters aren't muddy they're filled with rotting corpses of civilians killed by all sides..including the Kurdish 'freedom fighters')..

I could care less what the prevailing forum groupthink says is right, they're wrong 9.9 times out of 10 about everything anyway, usually it's a sign that you're right when they're trying their best to be condemnatory. Don't fall for it, you know better..


Like most Turkish trolls in this forum, you too follow the exact same pattern using a fake Greek name pretending to be something else when in fact you are merely parroting Erdogan statements from yesterday. Fact is you are not fooling anybody and you will hardly find any sane individual on the western side of this planet to actually blame the Kurds for civilian collateral damage in their fight against ISIS. If anything that only has the potential to increase their support as it reminds everyone the fact that the Kurds are the only effective fighting force against ISIS.

in villages previously captured by IS, or where a small minority were suspected of supporting the group.”


Lastly the fact that you choose to ad-hom your interlocutor instead of address the argument and face the truth speaks for itself. The Kurds fight for their survival, the Turks fight for their expansion. You can be screeching at the top of your voice about human rights abuses against ISIS(as if that gains you something) this reality will always remains constant and true.
Turkey is invading her neighbours shamelessly, your attempts to justify her and muddy the waters to gain sympathy for the Turkish cause is cute but does not change the fact that she is the aggressor in Syria and in Cyprus.

Here is why Erdogan and Turkish trolls are engaged in blaming the Kurds for human rights abuses against ISIS from 2016, because yesterday Turkey was caught by Amnesty International committing war crimes against the Kurds.

Independent wrote:They left the northern Syrian city of Qamishli in a convoy of buses, motorbikes and cars. Men and women, young and old. They sang songs and flashed peace signs as they passed slowly through towns and villages along the way.

The convoy of Kurdish protesters was heading to Ras al-Ayn, a border town that had seen days of heavy fighting between the Turkish military and Kurdish forces.

They planned to show their opposition to Turkey’s military operation with a symbolic demonstration, and then leave. But many of them never made it back.

At around 4pm on Sunday, shortly after they arrived in the city, a large group of people was hit in what is believed to be a Turkish airstrike or artillery attack as they stood outside their vehicle at the front of the convoy. Twelve people were killed, most of them civilians. Among them were two journalists who were there to cover the protest. A further 70 people were injured.

The incident, coming just days into Turkey’s highly controversial incursion into northern Syria, may be the first recorded war crime by the Nato power since the start of the offensive.

As video evidence has emerged in the last few days, Amnesty International said its own investigation found that the attack constituted a war crime.

“The convoy attack is one of the most horrific incidents that’s taken place in the past few days,” said Lynn Maalouf, Amnesty’s Middle East research director. “Amnesty verified the imagery and corroborated with witness testimony – and concluded that this attack clearly violated international humanitarian law.

“There is nothing safe about this zone that Turkey claims it wants to create – so far, its actions and those of its allies on the ground just demonstrate their utter disregard for civilian lives.”

The Independent understands the United Nations is also investigating the incident to determine if it constituted a war crime.

The war has already killed around 80 civilians in Syria and injured more than 400. Over 300,000 people have been displaced by the fighting so far. Turkish authorities said at least 18 civilians have been killed in Turkey by mortar fire from Kurdish forces.

The international community has widely condemned the offensive, which was sparked when Donald Trump withdrew US troops from the Syria-Turkey border, effectively giving Ankara a green light to attack the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces.

The details of what happened on Sunday have emerged slowly. The good spirits of the protesters belied the obvious danger they were in as they made their way to Ras al-Ayn. They were heading towards an active warzone, to a city that was being pummelled by airstrikes and artillery. The presence of a small number of armed men in the convoy made the journey even more perilous.

And yet, international investigators have told The Independent they believe it would have been unlikely for Turkey – a country with an advanced drone programme, and with the sophisticated surveillance that provides – to mistake the convoy for a military target. Videos of previous strikes released by the Turkish military show the clarity of view provided by its aircraft.

The Turkish military would have seen the convoy make its way slowly along the road for more than 80 miles, stopping along the way. In the town of Tell Tamr, more people joined. It was large and visible. They would have seen many women in the group.

Return of Assad’s forces to Kurdish areas brings fear for future
“You might have thought they were going to a wedding, not a war,” said Lindsey Hilsum, a journalist for Channel 4 News, in her dispatch from along the convoy’s route, shortly before it was hit.

One protester was asked whether she was afraid. She replied: “We’re not scared of fighting. Erdogan has been threatening us for eight years, but we’re not afraid.”

When they reached the city of Ras al-Ayn, perhaps more than 100 people had joined in dozens of minibuses. They stopped in a street lined with shuttered shops, where they stepped out.

They had purposefully chosen a point in the centre of the city to hold their protest, away from the fighting to the west and the east.

One video shows the group dancing and singing, somewhat nervously. Another video shows what appears to be the same group gathering. There is a loud bang and a bright flash, followed by darkness. Another video posted online shows the gruesome aftermath of the strike. Bodies lie scattered on the floor while survivors sit up dazed and burned.

A witness later said they did not hear jets in the sky prior to the bombing, which suggests that the explosion could have been caused by artillery or a drone attack, rather than an airstrike. Investigations are now under way to discover the type of munition used.

Images posted online show some of the dead appeared to be holding guns. The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said at least nine people were killed, including five civilians. Kurdish authorities put the number at 12 killed and 74 injured, but did not say how many were civilians.

An elderly mother of two named Dayika Akide was among the dead, according to local reports. Mohammed Hussein Rasho, a Syrian Kurdish reporter and cameraman for Cira TV, was injured in the blast and died of his wounds the following day, according to the Committee to Protect Journalists. Syrian Kurdish journalist Saad Ahmed, a reporter for the local news agency Hawar News, was also killed in the strike.

The United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs said on Tuesday that the strike the “worst incident we are aware of so far”, in the conflict.

The Middle East and North Africa representative of the Committee to Protect Journalists, Ignacio Miguel Delgad, said: “Judging by the evidence we have, the footage and pictures we have seen and testimonies from eyewitnesses, it was clearly a civilian convoy on their way to Ras al-Ayn to protest the Turkish offensive.

“International law expressly prohibits attacks on civilians and journalists. CPJ believes this airstrike could constitute a war crime and we call on Turkish authorities to immediately cease their attacks on journalists and civilians.”

Further investigations are now likely to focus on whether the attack meets the conditions to be a breach of international humanitarian law. That process can be extremely complicated.

“There are certainly elements here that could lead you to conclude that they knew it was not a military objective,” William Schabas, professor of international law at Middlesex University in London, told The Independent.

He said: “There is a burden on the person who drops the bomb to take reasonable efforts to make sure they know the answer to the question about whether the target is military, and even if it is, whether there is an acceptable level of collateral damage to non-combatants.

“This case is complicated by the fact that there were armed people with the convoy. It’s not implausible Turkey would say it has a military dimension.”

Professor Schabas added that much of how the investigation proceeds will depend on how Turkey responds, or if it responds at all.

“Let’s assume we don’t get a credible explanation from Turkey, we still have to reach conclusions of whether there was a war crime,” he said.

The Turkish foreign ministry did not respond to a request for comment from The Independent.
#15043020
Hindsite wrote:The point I was trying to make is that President Trump does not want the USA to have the responsibility to police the world with our military. The Executive Branch, which the President is head, has the responsibility for foreign policy through the State Department. The Congress is trying to dictate foreign policy to President Trump by their interference in this Turkish - Syrian incident. The Congress should do what they are responsible for and stay out of Executive branch affairs.



They know what your point is. It is so apparent how Trump lives in the heads of his opposition. We have people on this thread who claim to be geniuses talking about supposed threats to other counties by Trump when they support Iran getting nukes "death to America" pallets of cash in the secret of night. Democrats are now war hawks they supposedly worry about ISIS but don't want to have borders. They are just surprised by another campaign promised met, they are not used to that. They are a hot mess.
#15043154
Atlantis wrote:I agree. Only Europeans can defend their own interests. Americans will always defend their own interests and not ours, which is normal.


Of course. Europe is as big as America or China. India will also join the great power league in the not too distant future. You can’t expect these other great powers to be nice to you. They see you as a rival for world power. Whether that is right or wrong is immaterial.


However, I have little hope that any of the 5-eyes countries will join us. We need to make peace with Russia. Europe and Russia complement each other. Both Putin and Macron have understood this.



That is not the case. Australia is a member of the 5-eyes, yet it is building a close relationship with France. Remember that the French have territories in the S Pacific and Indian Oceans. Also the French have a claim in Antartica. France, Australia, New Zealand and Norway are all members of a pact regarding Antartica. NZ is another 5-eyes country.

We like the French because they are a proactive partner and seem to be the one European country that still has a global perspective. Currently Australia and France are working on an environmental protection treaty in Antartica, much to the chagrin of Russia and China. I think the next step is to start working more closely with the French in space.

Might I recommend some reading for you? The works of naval strategists such as Mahan and Colbert would give you some insight into the importance of maintaining economic access to the global commons. Back in their day, that mean’t access to the oceans. Today it also means access to space and cyberspace as well as the world’s oceans.

Ideally these issues of access to the global commons would be resolved through a system of laws and treaties. It should be no surprise to you that Australia is cooperating with the EU to that very ends in both economic and cyber law matters. The alternative is to use various levels of force, up to and including war. Given Australia and the EU aren’t the aggressors, how exactly things will pan out will depend in large on China, the US and similar players. Will they agree to a set of rules for a peaceful world order? Or will they return to old fashion imperialism?

Regarding Russia, I think Macron’s approach makes sense. It isn’t a new idea for the French. French strategists have been discussing Russia as a shield for Europe from rising Asian power since the 1930’s. Asia will continue to growth in strength and eventually it will get too hot for the Russians in the East as competition increases. So I expect the Russians will want to play ball with Europe in the longer term.
#15043161
foxdemon wrote:Australia is a member of the 5-eyes, yet it is building a close relationship with France.


Nothing prevents multi-lateral cooperation. Even after Brexit, there will be cooperation between the UK and European countries, including France, on security and other issues.

That's not my point. My point is that the loyalty of the 5-eyes countries are ultimately with the US and not with continental Europe. We have always known that, but Brexit and Trump have made this blindingly obvious.

As an example, I used to represent European companies in the Far-East. We could always count on the support from European governments to defend our interests. In particular the French and German embassies and the European delegation were always ready to assist us. The odd ones out always were the British, even though they had a substantial stake in the project I represented. While all European countries helped each other in my field of business in the Far-East, the British always stood aside to cooperate with the Americans. They participated in meetings of the European business community in the Far-East to profit as much as possible, but when it came to take action, they always excused themselves. And it was no secrete that they informed our American competitors on us.

The same can be observed in different fields of business, technology, politics, etc.

The identitarian revolution marked by Brexit and Trump will make Anglophone countries move closer together while the multi-ethnic EU will establish global networks irrespective of ethnicity.
#15043166
Washington's thugs, which originally were to fight the "brutal dictator", failed to fight the Islamic State, but now found a new mission in fighting the Kurds on behalf of the Sultan, presumably to reanimate the Islamic State. With friends like these, Europe does not need enemies.

The US has backed 21 of the 28 ‘crazy’ militias leading Turkey’s brutal invasion of northern Syria

Former and current US officials have slammed the Turkish mercenary force of “Arab militias” for executing and beheading Kurds in northern Syria. New data from Turkey reveals that almost all of these militias were armed and trained in the past by the CIA and Pentagon.

Footage showing members of Turkey’s mercenary “national army” executing Kurdish captives as they led the Turkish invasion of northern Syria touched off a national outrage, provoking US government officials, pundits and major politicians to rage against their brutality.

In the Washington Post, a US official condemned the militias as a “crazy and unreliable.” Another official called them “thugs and bandits and pirates that should be wiped off the face of the earth.” Meanwhile, former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton described the scene as a “sickening horror,” blaming President Donald Trump exclusively for the atrocities.

But the fighters involved in the atrocities in northern Syria were not just random tribesmen assembled into an ad hoc army. In fact, many were former members of the Free Syrian Army, the force once armed by the CIA and Pentagon and branded as “moderate rebels.” This disturbing context was conveniently omitted from the breathless denunciations of US officials and Western pundits.

According to a research paper published this October by the pro-government Turkish think tank, SETA, “Out of the 28 factions [in the Turkish mercenary force], 21 were previously supported by the United States, three of them via the Pentagon’s program to combat DAESH. Eighteen of these factions were supplied by the CIA via the MOM Operations Room in Turkey, a joint intelligence operation room of the ‘Friends of Syria’ to support the armed opposition. Fourteen factions of the 28 were also recipients of the U.S.-supplied TOW anti-tank guided missiles.” (A graph by SETA naming the various militias and the type of US support they received is at the end of this article).

In other words, virtually the entire apparatus of anti-Assad insurgents armed and equipped under the Obama administration has been repurposed by the Turkish military to serve as the spearhead of its brutal invasion of northern Syria. The leader of this force is Salim Idriss, now the “Defense Minister” of Syria’s Turkish-backed “interim government.” He’s the same figure who hosted John McCain when the late senator made his infamous 2013 incursion into Syria.

The “sickening horror” this collection of extremists is carrying out against Kurds is, in fact, the same one it imposed on Syrians across the country for the past seven years. Before, when their goal was regime change in Damascus, they had the blessing and wholehearted support of official Washington. But now that they are slaughtering members of a much more loyal US proxy force, their former patrons and enablers are rushing to denounce them as “bandits and pirates.”

The FSA and White Helmets become Turkey’s mercenary army

Turkey employed anti-Assad insurgents against the Kurdish YPG for the first time in March 2018, when it invaded the northern Syrian city of Afrin during Operation Olive Branch. That onslaught saw an array of heinous atrocities, from the vandalism of the corpse of a female Kurdish fighter to the looting of Afrin. These war crimes were committed largely by fighters of the defunct Free Syrian Army – the collection of “moderate rebels” once armed by the CIA.

In a video message, one of the invading fighters promised mass ethnic cleansing if Kurds in the area refused to convert to his Wahhabi strain of Sunni Islam. “By Allah,” the fighter declared, “if you repent and come back to Allah, then know that you are our brothers. But if you refuse, then we see that your heads are ripe, and that it’s time for us to pluck them.”

Also present in Afrin were the White Helmets, the supposed civil defense outfit that was nominated for a Nobel Prize, celebrated by the Western media as life-saving rescuers, and heavily funded by the US and UK governments. The White Helmets had arrived as auxiliaries of the Islamist mercenary forces, and were operating as Turkish proxies themselves.



This October, when Turkish-backed Islamist fighters stormed back into northern Syria, atrocities immediately followed.

Hevrin Khalaf, a Syrian Kurdish legislator, was pulled from her car by the militiamen and executed along with her driver. Other Kurds, including two unarmed captives, were filmed as they were murdered by the Turkish proxies. The mercenary gangs went on to deliberately free ISIS captives from unguarded prisons, releasing hundreds of their ideological soulmates to the battlefield.



The most shocking footage allegedly showed the Turkish mercenaries sawing the heads off of Kurdish fighters they had killed. For those familiar with Nour al-Din al-Zinki, a participant in the Turkish invasion that was formerly supplied by the CIA, and which beheaded a captive Palestinian-Syrian fighter on camera in 2016, this behavior was not surprising.

Left out of the coverage of these horrors was the fact that none of them would have been possible if Washington had not spent several years and billions of dollars subsidizing Syria’s armed opposition.

Prolific promoters of the “moderate rebels” run from their records

When the Turkish military and its proxy force overwhelmed the Kurdish YPG this October, Hillary Clinton angrily denounced their brutality.

Back in 2012, however, when Clinton was Secretary of State, she junketed to Istanbul to rally support for those very same militias during a “Friends of Syria” conference convened by Erdogan.

She later remarked, “The hard men with the guns are going to be the more likely actors in any political transition than those on the outside just talking. And therefore we needed to figure out how we could support them on the ground, better equip them…”

One of those “hard men” is Salim Idriss, today the “Defense Minister” of Syria’s non-existent “provisional government” and de facto leader of the mercenary forces dispatched by Turkey into northern Syria. He has pledged, “We will fight against all terror organizations led by the PYD/PKK.”

Back in 2013, however, Idriss was lionized in Washington and hyped as a future leader of Syria.

When the later Sen. John McCain made his notorious surprise visit to the Turkish-Syrian border in May 2013, hoping to inspire a US military intervention, he was warmly welcomed by Idriss, the then-leader of the US-backed Free Syrian Army.

“What we want from the US government is to take the decision to support the Syrian revolution with weapons and ammunition, anti-tank missiles and anti-aircraft weapons,” Idris told Josh Rogin, a reporter and neoconservative booster of regime change in Syria.

Though Idriss and his allies never got the full-scale intervention they sought from the Obama administration, they did receive shipments of heavy weapons, including hundreds of anti-tank TOW missiles.

They were also showered with adulation by droves of hyper-ambitious foreign correspondents from corporate Western outlets.

CNN’s Clarissa Ward was an especially enthusiastic promoter of the FSA, embedding with its fighters, painting them as a heroic resistance. When she returned to Syria years later, she used a top mouthpiece of Syria’s local Al Qaeda affiliate as a fixer for her unequivocally pro-opposition “Inside Aleppo” series.

Image

Danny Gold was also among the flocks of Western reporters that embedded with the armed opposition during the height of the insurgency against Damascus. In 2013, he churned around a piece for Vice on “chatting about ‘Game of Thrones'” with a group of fighters from Jabhat al-Nusra, Al Qaeda’s local franchise.



Gold and a clique of rabid online regime change zealots spent the rest of their time clamoring for US intervention in the country and viciously denigrating anyone who disagreed. Gold has, for instance, likened The Grayzone’s factual coverage of Syria to Nazi propaganda.

This October, when the Turkish invasion of northern Syria began, Gold reported that one of the FSA fighters he embedded with back in 2013 was taking part in the assault on Kurdish positions.



Like Hillary Clinton and the rest of the Islamist fighters’ former boosters, Gold was clearly struggling with a case of cognitive dissonance. Unable to take responsibility for promoting these extremists as they rampaged across Syria for years, or for smearing anyone who forcefully opposed the regime change agenda, he lashed out at his critics: “Almost as if war is complicated and doesn’t fit into the neat little box the anime teens in my mentions don’t realize,” he tweeted.

As members of a former US proxy ruthlessly prey on a present day US proxy, Western pundits and politicians are hoping that no one notices that they spent the past seven years celebrating the former group. They are initiating a cover-up, not only of the blowback unfolding in northern Syria, but of their own records.

This band of hacks is now fully exposed for foisting a bloody scam on the public, marketing some of the most brutal fanatics on the planet as revolutionaries and “moderate rebels” while they destabilized an entire region. Like the extremists they once promoted, most have somehow managed to evade accountability and remain employed.

Below is SETA’s list of Turkish “national army” militias, outlining the type of US support each one received over the years:

Image
#15043169
Atlantis wrote:Nothing prevents multi-lateral cooperation. Even after Brexit, there will be cooperation between the UK and European countries, including France, on security and other issues.

That's not my point. My point is that the loyalty of the 5-eyes countries are ultimately with the US and not with continental Europe. We have always known that, but Brexit and Trump have made this blindingly obvious.



This is a potential problem. While the UK was in the EU, there was a strong link across the Atlantic. Trojan horse or not, at least they kept everyone on the same side.


As an example, I used to represent European companies in the Far-East. We could always count on the support from European governments to defend our interests. In particular the French and German embassies and the European delegation were always ready to assist us. The odd ones out always were the British, even though they had a substantial stake in the project I represented. While all European countries helped each other in my field of business in the Far-East, the British always stood aside to cooperate with the Americans. They participated in meetings of the European business community in the Far-East to profit as much as possible, but when it came to take action, they always excused themselves. And it was no secrete that they informed our American competitors on us.

The same can be observed in different fields of business, technology, politics, etc.



How much is this just English ‘Europhobia’? They have had that mindset for at least 300 years.


The identitarian revolution marked by Brexit and Trump will make Anglophone countries move closer together while the multi-ethnic EU will establish global networks irrespective of ethnicity.


It is not at all clear that a pan-Angloism will emerge from the culture wars. NZ, Australia and Canada are very close on a cultural level. You can see this in the form of more progressive socio-economic systems in these three countries. It is more reminiscent of N Europe social democratic market economies. At least in the 20th century, the US and the UK have be closer at the cultural level. I am not convinced that the three smaller countries have any desire to be part of a pan-Anglo block. The English do often reminisce about their former glory, so they seem to be keen on the idea.

Anyway, Trump’s unpredictability has resulted in Australian leaders realising a more self reliant posture is wise. So we will continue to build relationships with various partners, such as France and Japan. Also there is a realisation we need to build up domestic defense industries. As to what becomes of 5-eyes in the end depends largely on what US and UK leaders do. Honestly, I am wondering if these two are heading for a Soviet style melt down. The next decade will require some good decision making from US and UK leaders or else their debts and internal instability will set them on the path to terminal decline.


In fact, the US won’t be able to continue being the world’s policeman. Trump is right that the US has to pull back from never ending military commitments. They will go broke if they don’t. But it does show that Europeans needs to take responsibility for their own defense. The current situation in Syria clearly demonstrates what will happen when America goes home.
#15043232
The Oct. 9 letter demanded that Erdogan call off his invasion of northern Syria, warning that he would be viewed as “the devil” in history if “good things don’t happen.” It came after Trump had already received bipartisan and widespread backlash for pulling U.S. troops out of the region, smoothing the way for the incursion.

“Let’s work out a good deal!” Trump penned. “You don’t want to be responsible for slaughtering thousands of people, and I don’t want to be responsible for destroying the Turkish economy — and I will.”

Erdogan reportedly threw the letter in the trash upon receiving it.

Donald is having some difficulty understanding that foreign leaders/nations are not hapless NYC contractors that he is trying to screw and shake down with his stable of a few hundred lawyers.
#15043252
jimjam wrote:Donald is having some difficulty understanding that foreign leaders/nations are not hapless NYC contractors that he is trying to screw and shake down with his stable of a few hundred lawyers.

President Trump doesn't seem to have any difficulty understanding "carrot and stick" diplomacy or the use of aid, tariffs, or sanctions to affect the behavior of foreign leaders/nations.
Praise the Lord.
#15043259
Istanbuller wrote:Now Syrian rebels are estimated to be almost 150.000 men. It is the newest and biggest force in Syria. I hope this will revival the civil war against Assad.


500,000+ dead people is not enough for you ?
#15043266
Hindsite wrote:President Trump doesn't seem to have any difficulty understanding "carrot and stick" diplomacy or the use of aid, tariffs, or sanctions to affect the behavior of foreign leaders/nations.
Praise the Lord.


Erdogan must have some really big stick that Trump bent so quickly and so deeply.

Should serve as a lesson to other leaders, the only way to deal with Trump is by being an even bigger bully.
#15043277
Atlantis wrote:Erdogan must have some really big stick that Trump bent so quickly and so deeply.

Should serve as a lesson to other leaders, the only way to deal with Trump is by being an even bigger bully.

Why don't you rally behind Turkey and Erdogan?

We are trying to protect your interests either. It would be better if you joined to us for efforts to create safe zone inside Syria and resettle all migrants and refugees there. Your concern is our concern. We are understanding Europe's sensibilities. You should do the same and back your strategic partner.
#15043278
Istanbuller wrote:Why don't you rally behind Turkey and Erdogan?

We are trying to protect your interests either. It would be better if you joined to us for efforts to create safe zone inside Syria and resettle all migrants and refugees there. Your concern is our concern. We are understanding Europe's sensibilities. You should do the same and back your strategic partner.

Good point.
#15043296
Istanbuller wrote:Why don't you rally behind Turkey and Erdogan?


Sorry, can't do. Because

Imperialism bad

Ethnic cleansing bad

Invasions bad

Sunni terror bad

Jailing journalists bad

Bombing your own population bad

Fiddling with the judiciary bad

Jingoism bad ...

I'm sure there is more.
#15043348
Atlantis wrote:Sorry, can't do. Because

Imperialism bad

Ethnic cleansing bad

Invasions bad

Sunni terror bad

Jailing journalists bad

Bombing your own population bad

Fiddling with the judiciary bad

Jingoism bad ...

I'm sure there is more.


Denying the armenian, pontic genocides and wanting to annex Cyprus, trying to surround and draw a noose around greece, suppressing Christians, being responsible for messing around with Agia Sophia. Admin Edit: Rule 16 Violation

As I said elsewhere, before this thread, Erdogan needs to go. IMHO a moderate CHP govt is what's needed and a restoration of Turkey's true democracy; they're under constant threat of full military junta rule like Greece was in the 60's and 70's.

Yes, you need an EU military without the UK, because we will just hold you back'.

This extension BS is BS, the EU ought to reject it and say...get stuffed you fat pseudointellectual globule. It's ironic that certain communist less-than-amoeba lifeforms think that no deal brexshit is gonna lead to a great revolution but totally typical of this place. Admin Edit: Rule 16
#15043356
White House deputy "press secretary" Hogan Gidley pushed back against the criticism of Obese Donald's insulting grammar school level letter to the President of Turkey, describing it as a “chattering class ‘we know best’ mentality.”

“While the media allow so many in Congress, the D.C. establishment and Beltway bureaucracy to complain anonymously from the shadows because their precious swamp is being drained,” he said, “President Trump continues to be out front working tirelessly and successfully for the American people.”

O.K. now have we ever seen anything more farcical and meaningless than comments by Obese Donald's "press secretary"? :lol:

"Working tirelessly and successfully for the American people (Left unsaid "who are billionaires")." :eek: :lol:
I mean, you gotta be really really dumb to believe this sort of clap trap.

I feel bad for Ms. Gidley ………. she's got to stick her nose up Obese Donald's ass way further than most to earn her pay and bask in the radiance of The Great One.
#15043360
jimjam wrote:White House deputy "press secretary" Hogan Gidley pushed back against the criticism of Obese Donald's insulting grammar school level letter to the President of Turkey, describing it as a “chattering class ‘we know best’ mentality.”

“While the media allow so many in Congress, the D.C. establishment and Beltway bureaucracy to complain anonymously from the shadows because their precious swamp is being drained,” he said, “President Trump continues to be out front working tirelessly and successfully for the American people.”

O.K. now have we ever seen anything more farcical and meaningless than comments by Obese Donald's "press secretary"? :lol:

"Working tirelessly and successfully for the American people (Left unsaid "who are billionaires")." :eek: :lol:
I mean, you gotta be really really dumb to believe this sort of clap trap.

I feel bad for Ms. Gidley ………. she's got to stick her nose up Obese Donald's ass way further than most to earn her pay and bask in the radiance of The Great One.


Her commentary and theirs is truly worthless.

Most world leaders are puppets, Erdogan is, Trump is, Boris is and so is the 'great' Mitsotakis, working for the billionaire scum class to pay off the foreign debt and ruin the prospects of working class greeks. Of course, blinded by capitalist ideology, many people are unable or unwilling to see this.
#15043373
Another bridge burned by Obese Donald.

General Mattis:
“The only person in the military Mr Trump does not feel is overrated,” he added, was Colonel Sanders, the founder of KFC. :lol:

William McRaven, a retired four-star navy admiral who led the US special operations command under George W Bush and Barack Obama, piled on Friday in a scathing New York Times op-ed, criticizing Trump for abandoning the Kurds in Syria. “If our promises are meaningless, how will our allies ever trust us?” he wrote. “If we can’t have faith in our nation’s principles, why would the men and women of this nation join the military?”
#15043403
jimjam wrote:Another bridge burned by Obese Donald.

General Mattis:
“The only person in the military Mr Trump does not feel is overrated,” he added, was Colonel Sanders, the founder of KFC. :lol:

William McRaven, a retired four-star navy admiral who led the US special operations command under George W Bush and Barack Obama, piled on Friday in a scathing New York Times op-ed, criticizing Trump for abandoning the Kurds in Syria. “If our promises are meaningless, how will our allies ever trust us?” he wrote. “If we can’t have faith in our nation’s principles, why would the men and women of this nation join the military?”


Well, like annatar said to you...your shiftable, shifty political loyalties are unreliable, hence you'll end up as the above; and contradicting yourself.

That's the truth. He was right..western fake liberalism is too deeply engrained in people's minds. Sadly, you find a lot of obese balding boomers who are full of it and burn plenty of bridges.
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black21, you seem to be having a hard time connec[…]

The issue is money. Wrong! How much is spent on[…]

Good stuff! That would be a very long trip, that's[…]

Canada is the worst. We just have good PR. Satan […]