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By late
#15051049
jimjam wrote:
It is very clear what happened. Donald J. Trump conspired with Vladimir Putin to take the US Presidency and make it Russian-controlled. An incentive to this "deal" was the Trump Moscow Tower project netting the Trump Organization and Trump personally over 500M and giving Vladimir Putin not only control over the world's largest nuclear army, but an apartment in Trump Moscow Tower. Michael Cohen, Trump's personal lawyer, lied to Congress about the dates of the project, so much so the report describes the Moscow Tower as "central to the Trump presidential campaign." From January 2016 to June of 2016 The Trump Tower Moscow was in full progress with letters of intent, travel plans being made, and meetings held in New York and in Europe to advance the goal.

All 5 conspirators now in prison: Popodopolous (campaign liaison to Russia), Flynn (National Security Director), Manafort (Trump Campaign Manager), Cohen (Trump’s personal lawyer of many years) and Stone (Campaign liaison to Wikileaks and Nixon associate) were all convicted of lying to Congress, campaign finance crimes, witness intimidation, tax evasion and FARA violations (not registering as a foreign agent).

And what is all this connected to? The Russian Military. specialized GRU Units, at the direct, uncontested behest of Vladimir Putin, directly attacking the Democratic presidential candidate, Hillary Clinton.



You have overstated the case, if not by a lot.

Which has given our Excuse Junkies all the excuse they needed.

Trump ought to wind up in court over this, but you never know. When a new administration comes in, they always have a full plate to deal with. But this time, what they face will be Herculean. The usual result is they let a lot of things slide. But Trump has been so corrupt that expedience may not be equal to the moral gravity of the situation. At least that's my hope.
By Hindsite
#15051395
jimjam wrote:It is very clear what happened. Donald J. Trump conspired with Vladimir Putin to take the US Presidency and make it Russian-controlled. An incentive to this "deal" was the Trump Moscow Tower project netting the Trump Organization and Trump personally over 500M and giving Vladimir Putin not only control over the world's largest nuclear army, but an apartment in Trump Moscow Tower. Michael Cohen, Trump's personal lawyer, lied to Congress about the dates of the project, so much so the report describes the Moscow Tower as "central to the Trump presidential campaign." From January 2016 to June of 2016 The Trump Tower Moscow was in full progress with letters of intent, travel plans being made, and meetings held in New York and in Europe to advance the goal.

All 5 conspirators now in prison: Popodopolous (campaign liaison to Russia), Flynn (National Security Director), Manafort (Trump Campaign Manager), Cohen (Trump’s personal lawyer of many years) and Stone (Campaign liaison to Wikileaks and Nixon associate) were all convicted of lying to Congress, campaign finance crimes, witness intimidation, tax evasion and FARA violations (not registering as a foreign agent).

And what is all this connected to? The Russian Military. specialized GRU Units, at the direct, uncontested behest of Vladimir Putin, directly attacking the Democratic presidential candidate, Hillary Clinton.

Sounds like you have been taking lessons in parody from lying "shifty" Adam Schiff.

jimjam wrote:Kid stuff. You had better stick with Obese Donald's windmills cause cancer or his weather reports on hurricanes …. or hundreds of whoppers aimed to amuse and distract his semi literate "base".

You better stay clear of those windmills and hurricanes. :lol:
User avatar
By jimjam
#15052971
Deutsche Bank is Mr. Trump’s primary lender after a string of bankruptcies and loan defaults cost other banks hundreds of millions of dollars; over the past two decades, the German bank lent him and his companies a total of well over $2 billion.

Russian oligarchs with dirty cash to launder? Deutsche bank? Donald? ……. :hmm:
By Hindsite
#15052982
jimjam wrote:Deutsche Bank is Mr. Trump’s primary lender after a string of bankruptcies and loan defaults cost other banks hundreds of millions of dollars; over the past two decades, the German bank lent him and his companies a total of well over $2 billion.

Russian oligarchs with dirty cash to launder? Deutsche bank? Donald? ……. :hmm:

Is conspiracy theories all you got?
#15052990
late wrote:Tell that to Duncan Hunter.

They do prosecute members of Congress, which is a good thing. I just can't remember the last time a dirty prosecutor was prosecuted.

jimjam wrote:Deutsche Bank is Mr. Trump’s primary lender after a string of bankruptcies and loan defaults cost other banks hundreds of millions of dollars; over the past two decades, the German bank lent him and his companies a total of well over $2 billion.

Russian oligarchs with dirty cash to launder? Deutsche bank? Donald? ……. :hmm:

Banks are a layer of indirection between depositor and borrower. Besides, banks are generally fractional reserve. There isn't a 1:1 relationship between a depositor and a borrower.

Hindsite wrote:Is conspiracy theories all you got?

I think he's an adviser to Joe Biden now. Did you see Biden call that 83 year-old guy "fat" and challenge him to a push up contest?
By late
#15053006
blackjack21 wrote:
1) They do prosecute members of Congress, which is a good thing. I just can't remember the last time a dirty prosecutor was prosecuted.


2)Banks are a layer of indirection between depositor and borrower. Besides, banks are generally fractional reserve. There isn't a 1:1 relationship between a depositor and a borrower.




1) You assumed your conclusion. IOW, you are writing fiction again.

2) You didn't say anything. Deutschebank is dirty.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15053052
blackjack21 wrote:Banks are a layer of indirection between depositor and borrower. Besides, banks are generally fractional reserve. There isn't a 1:1 relationship between a depositor and a borrower.


You are a bbright young man and I am sure this is accurate, whatever it is, but, as is your style, irrelevant and besides the point. Your boy Donald has nothing to hide and never errs so …… lets put all this to rest with a peek at the Donald/Deutsche arrangement. Your comment may be technically accurate but my observation that humans and bankers will do pretty much anything if their palms are greased sufficiently has been proven accurate uncountable times down through history. I think the Donald/Deutsche records will make very interesting reading.

It isn’t hard to understand how such speculation got started. Deutsche Bank has a long history of operating in Russia, working with Kremlin-linked companies and laundering money for wealthy Russians. Congressional investigators subpoenaed any materials about suspicious activity that the bank detected in the accounts of Mr. Trump, his company or his family members, including Jared Kushner, Mr. Trump’s son-in-law and adviser. In 2016, Tammy McFadden, a former anti-money-laundering compliance officer at the bank, flagged transactions connected to Mr. Kushner as potentially suspicious.

Those transactions involved money flowing to Russian individuals, and Deutsche Bank’s files almost certainly include more information.
#15053057
late wrote:1) You assumed your conclusion. IOW, you are writing fiction again.

Ok. Name a federal prosecutor that's recently been prosecuted.

late wrote:2) You didn't say anything. Deutschebank is dirty.

jimjam is implying Trump is dirty, because he got loans form Deutschebank. That's lame.

jimjam wrote:Your boy Donald has nothing to hide and never errs so …… lets put all this to rest with a peek at the Donald/Deutsche arrangement.

Your implication is blanket--anyone who borrows money from Deutschebank is somehow tainted. That's painting with a broad brush.

jimjam wrote:Deutsche Bank has a long history of operating in Russia, working with Kremlin-linked companies and laundering money for wealthy Russians.

Uh huh. You don't like Russians, is that it? Didn't you share a picture of yourself at the Kremlin at the height of the Cold War? Could it be that @jimjam is the real Russian agent here?

jimjam wrote:In 2016, Tammy McFadden, a former anti-money-laundering compliance officer at the bank, flagged transactions connected to Mr. Kushner as potentially suspicious.

Chris Christie--also very fat--convicted Jared Kushner's father.
By late
#15053072
blackjack21 wrote:
jimjam is implying Trump is dirty, because he got loans form Deutschebank. That's lame.




See? Fiction..

No banker on the planet would touch Trump because of his casino bankruptcies. He was toxic. Yet Deutschebank gave him loans. Which makes no sense unless you also know Deutschebank was laundering billions for Putin...
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/apr/17/deutsche-bank-faces-action-over-20bn-russian-money-laundering-scheme

"Over two decades, Trump borrowed more than $2bn from Deutsche. In 2008, he defaulted on a $45m loan repayment and sued the bank. Its private wealth division in New York subsequently loaned Trump a further $300m – a move that bemused insiders and which has yet to be fully explained."

To get a handle on this, you need to spend some time understanding how Russia moves money after the sanctions kicked in. Then how intel guys connect the dots.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/08/29/deutsche-banks-10-billion-scandal

“The concern about Deutsche Bank is that they have a history of laundering Russian money,” Schiff said last December. “And this, apparently, was the one bank that was willing to do business with the Trump Organization.”

Since then, Trump has vehemently fought to block Deutsche Bank and other banks connected to him or his family from handing over documents to Congress, suing Deutsche to prevent it from cooperating with the intelligence and financial service committees’ investigations."

“Whether it’s Michael Cohen, [longtime Trump Organization CFO] Allen Weisselberg, Trump’s taxes, or Deutsche Bank, the thread connecting all of those,” O’Brien says, “is that this is a man who has something to hide and he’s not making any bones about it.”

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/donald-trump-deutsche-bank-investigations-850749/

You will likely counter by saying this picture is incomplete. Which is true, Trump is doing a successful coverup of the truth.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15053076
blackjack21 wrote:Ok. Name a federal prosecutor that's recently been prosecuted.


jimjam is implying Trump is dirty, because he got loans form Deutschebank. That's lame.


Your implication is blanket--anyone who borrows money from Deutschebank is somehow tainted. That's painting with a broad brush.


Uh huh. You don't like Russians, is that it? Didn't you share a picture of yourself at the Kremlin at the height of the Cold War? Could it be that @jimjam is the real Russian agent here?


Chris Christie--also very fat--convicted Jared Kushner's father.


fuck this "broad brush" shit. just show us the Donald/Douchbag records. As I said, your boy Donald has never erred & has nothing to hide ……. prove it.
#15053101
late wrote:No banker on the planet would touch Trump because of his casino bankruptcies.

Obviously, that's not true, because banks did lend him money. So your assertion is false as indicated by your own statement.

late wrote:"Over two decades, Trump borrowed more than $2bn from Deutsche. In 2008, he defaulted on a $45m loan repayment and sued the bank. Its private wealth division in New York subsequently loaned Trump a further $300m – a move that bemused insiders and which has yet to be fully explained."

Trump has zero personal bankruptcies. Businesses in which he had a stake have gone bankrupt. That is a separate question.

late wrote:To get a handle on this, you need to spend some time understanding how Russia moves money after the sanctions kicked in. Then how intel guys connect the dots.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016 ... on-scandal

Your article plainly says, "Mirror trades are not inherently illegal." It goes on to say, "Indeed, because the individual transactions involved in mirror trades did not directly contravene any regulations, some employees who worked at Deutsche Bank’s Russian headquarters at the time deny that such activity was improper."

So what is your point? Even direct actions like this are not illegal. So how do you try to infer that something inherently indirect like a loan is somehow money laundering?

late's article wrote:During the Nazi era, Deutsche Bank sullied its reputation by financing Hitler’s regime and purchasing stolen Jewish gold.

:roll: Godwin's law?

late's article wrote:Before the housing market collapsed in the United States, in 2008, sparking a global financial crisis, Deutsche Bank created about thirty-two billion dollars’ worth of collateralized debt obligations, which helped to inflate the housing bubble.

What bullshit! Deutschebank is definitely not the responsible party for the housing bubble.

late's article wrote:“There was cultural criminality,” he said. “Deutsche Bank was structurally designed by management to allow corrupt individuals to commit fraud.”

The entire financial system was doing this. There is no criminality here any more than at Wells Fargo, Citigroup, US Bank, Lehman Brothers, Goldman Sachs, and so on. Bush and Obama bailed these people out, and none of them went to jail. In fact, a big reason Trump is president is that voters will not vote for establishment politicians that bailed out the rich at middle class expense. The gall of these people!

jimjam wrote:fuck this "broad brush" shit. just show us the Donald/Douchbag records. As I said, your boy Donald has never erred & has nothing to hide ……. prove it.

The burden of proof isn't on Trump. Nobody has to prove their innocence. This is not the Middle Ages.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15053127
blackjack21 wrote:The burden of proof isn't on Trump. Nobody has to prove their innocence. This is not the Middle Ages.


In the legal system that Donald has been gaming with his stable of 243 lawyers for years ….. perhaps. This is, however, the court of public opinion and I want to see which Russian oligarch's my president has been using the Deutsche Bank to facilitate the ole Quid Pro Quo game with ….. the only game Donald plays.
#15053163
jimjam wrote:In the legal system that Donald has been gaming with his stable of 243 lawyers for years ….. perhaps. This is, however, the court of public opinion and I want to see which Russian oligarch's my president has been using the Deutsche Bank to facilitate the ole Quid Pro Quo game with ….. the only game Donald plays.

I find your sincerity wanting in view of Hillary Clinton, whose husband received a $500k payment from Russians for a speech in Russia, while their "charitable" foundation received over $15M in donations from Russians around the time they were approving the sale of US uranium interests to Russians. In fact, I find the whole Russian kerfuffle to be somewhat bewildering given the number of political actors in Washington--most with ties to the Democratic party--involved with the Russians and somehow trying to make it appear that Trump is some sort of Russian agent. It's quite possibly the weirdest scandal in US history.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15053177
blackjack21 wrote:I find your sincerity wanting in view of Hillary Clinton, whose husband received a $500k payment from Russians for a speech in Russia, while their "charitable" foundation received over $15M in donations from Russians around the time they were approving the sale of US uranium interests to Russians. In fact, I find the whole Russian kerfuffle to be somewhat bewildering given the number of political actors in Washington--most with ties to the Democratic party--involved with the Russians and somehow trying to make it appear that Trump is some sort of Russian agent. It's quite possibly the weirdest scandal in US history.


Hillary Clinton? Have you noticed? She lost the election. The Deutsche Bank! The Deutsche Bank! I want to see exactly which Russian oligarchs Obese Donald was Quid Pro Quoing with.
By Rich
#15053183
Personally I prefer Prime Ministerial government selected from a parliament elected by pure PR. But most of you seem happy with your current set up. Trump called on Putin to hack the Hilary's emails, before the election in 2016. Obviously Putin would expect some kind of reward for that illegal act if Trump won the election. You have your collusion there in plain sight on the TV. But Trump was elected anyway. Trump was given a clear mandate by the American people under the electoral system that most of you accept both to break the law and ignore the constitution. Who could have possible dreamt in 2016 that Trump would obey the letter of the law or the Constitution?

Please tell me, what terrible thing has Trump done as President, that he couldn't have been expected to do before he was elected? What possible justification is there for impeaching him? What is this amazing new information that we have now about Trump that the American people didn't have on November 8th 2016?

There's nothing partisan about this. I would have said exactly the same thing about President Clinton? What is this amazing discovery about Bill Clinton's character that we didn't know the day he was elected.
#15053226
jimjam wrote:I want to see exactly which Russian oligarchs Obese Donald was Quid Pro Quoing with.

You need a lawful predicate to violate people's private affairs. "Quid pro quo" isn't something illegal. It's just an exchange of value. Receiving $500k for a soporific speech from Bill Clinton looks a whole lot more like some kind of bribe than anything you could ever hang on Trump. Yet, nothing will ever come of that, because as Trump pointed out in 2016, the system is rigged. That's what he's exposing on a daily basis.

Rich wrote:Trump called on Putin to hack the Hilary's emails, before the election in 2016.

No. Hillary Clinton's email server had already been hacked. Trump insinuated that Putin could recover the emails that Hillary Clinton deleted which had been subpoenaed by Congress. The Democrats had already commissioned the dossier, so they simply twisted Trump's words to allege that Trump requested Putin to hack Hillary's server. The $40M Mueller investigation did not find that Trump solicited Putin either, because he didn't.

Rich wrote:You have your collusion there in plain sight on the TV.

Exactly, and that's why the fake news story is not successful, because people know that Trump did not solicit Putin to hack Hillary's emails. Guccifer had already done that. Trump's quip was about whether or not the emails Hillary deleted in defiance of a Congressional subpoena could be recovered by the people who had already hacked her email server.

It's because people can re-run what Trump actually said that these assertions can be easily rebutted. It's why the media failed to paint Trump as a racist for ostensibly calling all Mexicans murderers and rapists. He didn't. He said of illegal immigrants "some are murders, some are rapists, and some, I assume, are good people." The media hurt its own credibility, not Trump.

This is one of the reasons--as much as Trump has nobody to follow his act--that I think re-electing Trump would be a good thing. To listen to Pelosi, Trump is an existential threat to the very existence of the establishment. Their will is breaking. Their resolve almost pointless. They've thrown everything at this guy, and they can't make any of it stick. It's hurting them more than it hurts Trump, and yet they cannot stop. It's quite remarkable. I cannot wait for November. If he wins again, I think they are going to be profoundly demoralized.
User avatar
By Finfinder
#15053280
jimjam wrote:fuck this "broad brush" shit. just show us the Donald/Douchbag records. As I said, your boy Donald has never erred & has nothing to hide ……. prove it.



You just hit the nail on the head. Innocent until proven guilty, used to be a covenant in America, now the left has bastardize it down to nothing. All because they cannot cope with loosing an election and dealing with the fact that Trump relishes it and rubs their noses in it every day. That is where we are at today Republicans are guilty and have to prove their innocents and the Democrats can do whatever the fuck they want to. If not the left just throws a 4 years tantrum. :D
By Rich
#15053301
So I'm just trying to get to a grip on the agreed facts here. That the Ukrainians tried to interfere in the 2016 Presidential election is surly beyond doubt. The Ukrainian ambassador wrote an article attacking Trump. Its merely the depth of Ukrainian interference that is in doubt?
#15053318
Rich wrote:That the Ukrainians tried to interfere in the 2016 Presidential election is surly beyond doubt. The Ukrainian ambassador wrote an article attacking Trump. Its merely the depth of Ukrainian interference that is in doubt?

Yes. That is correct. However, while it is "unprecedented", it's hardly illegal. Even Russians pulling for Trump isn't illegal. What would be illegal is if the Russians had commissioned the hacking of the DNC server, Hillary Clinton server, or John Podesta's email account. That's when involvement becomes criminal. That has been asserted, but never been proven as the DNC took affirmative steps to prevent any criminal investigation into their server--possibly, because the leaker was Seth Rich.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15053356
On Monday, when the Justice Department’s inspector general, Michael E. Horowitz, rejected one of Mr. Trump’s main attacks on the F.B.I. and declared the bureau had adequate reason to investigate the Trump campaign’s ties to Russia, Mr. Barr again stepped in, issuing a statement saying that the F.B.I. instead should not have opened the investigation in 2016.

“The F.B.I. launched an intrusive investigation of a U.S. presidential campaign on the thinnest of suspicions that, in my view, were insufficient to justify the steps taken,” so sez Donald's personal lawyer and America's pretend Attorney General in connection with Donald's latest farcical public relations blitz.

How about, now, an investigation into interference by Uruguay into the 2016 election.
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