Election 2020 - Page 119 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

Political issues and parties in the USA and Canada.

Moderator: PoFo North America Mods

Forum rules: No one line posts please.
User avatar
By Beren
#15094402
Doug64 wrote:Biden can’t pick Obama—any vice-presidential candidate must meet the qualifications to be president, and since Obama has already served two terms he isn’t qualified.

How unfortunate! :lol:
User avatar
By Ter
#15094424
Drlee wrote:If he could get Michelle Obama to run with him he would cruise to an easy victory.

Probably.
And her husband won't have to be jealous, the worst that could happen would be Biden smelling her hair.
User avatar
By Drlee
#15094449
‘Absentee ballots remain the largest source of POTENTIAL voter fraud.”

So you went back 15 years to find that there is POTENTIAL voter fraud? :eek:

Then you cited two cases and they were caught?

One is unspecified but in the red state of Texas. The other is a republican operative helping a republican candidate.

Sorry Doug. You just don't want poor people, the elderly and people of color to vote. I don't blame you. If they don't your leader Trump has a chance.
By Pants-of-dog
#15094450
Doug64 wrote:Heed Jimmy Carter on the Danger of Mail-In Voting ‘Absentee ballots remain the largest source of potential voter fraud.’

    ‘Absentee ballots remain the largest source of potential voter fraud.” That quote isn’t from President Trump, who criticized mail-in voting this week after Wisconsin Democrats tried and failed to change an election at the last minute into an exclusively mail-in affair. It’s the conclusion of the bipartisan 2005 report of the Commission on Federal Election Reform, chaired by former President Jimmy Carter and former Secretary of State James Baker III....

    Intimidation and vote buying were key concerns of the commission: “Citizens who vote at home, at nursing homes, at the workplace, or in church are more susceptible to pressure, overt and subtle, or to intimidation. Vote buying schemes are far more difficult to detect when citizens vote by mail.” The report provides examples, such as the 1997 Miami mayoral election that resulted in 36 arrests for absentee-ballot fraud. The election had to be rerun, and the result was reversed.

    There are more recent cases, too. In 2017 an investigation of a Dallas City Council election found some 700 fraudulent mail-in ballots signed by the same witness using a fake name. The discovery left two council races in limbo, and the fraud was much larger than the vote differential in one of those races. The case resulted in a criminal conviction.


This seems incorrect.

https://www.dallasobserver.com/news/dal ... ns-9484686

    What We Know — And What We Don't — About the Ongoing Voter Fraud Investigation in West Dallas
    STEPHEN YOUNG | MAY 22, 2017 | 4:00AM

    One thing is clear two weeks after the 2017 Dallas City Council election: Something went wrong with absentee voting in West Dallas. While rumor and innuendo have been plentiful, very little has emerged in the way of fact, especially since many key players in the drama have clammed up because of the ongoing investigation into the potential vote fraud.

    In hopes of keeping this all straight, let's take a look at what we know and what we don't about the ongoing investigation into the District 6 election.

    We know that approximately 700 mail-in ballots were impounded on election day.

    This is what started the whole thing. On May 4, two days before the election, the Dallas County District Attorney's Office asked Carl Ginsberg, Dallas County's 193rd District Court judge, to hold 700 or so mail-in ballots. The common thread among the ballots, which would not be counted until Thursday of the following week, was Jose Rodriguez, who helped the voters receiving the contested ballots with their mail-ballot applications.

    We know that Rodriguez does not exist, at least not as Jose Rodriguez.

    In its request to sequester the ballots, the district attorney's office said it believes Jose Rodriguez is a fictitious name.

    We know that the county, despite the investigation into the ballots tied to Rodriguez, elected to count most of them anyway.

    On Thursday, May 11, the Dallas County Elections office released its final totals for the City Council election. Between District 6 and District 2, where investigators also discovered several hundred ballots connected to Rodriguez, Dallas County added 629 votes to the various candidates involved.

    We know that those ballots didn't swing any city of Dallas elections.

    Adam Medrano won more than 91 percent of the vote in District 2, so that race is a moot point. District 6, while highly contested, wasn't affected by the sequestered ballots. Any way you slice the ballots in District 6, incumbent Monica Alonzo, mayor pro tem, and Dallas County Schools board member Omar Narvaez go to a runoff. If you only count ballots cast in person, Alonzo beats Narvaez by five points, winning 35 percent of the vote in a six-person field. If you count all undisputed ballots cast on Election Day, Alonzo beats Narvaez by a 39 to 27 margin.

    If you count only the disputed ballots that ended up in the final totals, Alonzo wins by a nearly identical margin, 48 to 37. Even if every ballot that got tossed out — 98, according to The Dallas Morning News' Robert Wilonsky's account of a meeting of the Dallas County Election officials and members of the Dallas City Council — went for either Alonzo, Narvaez or any other candidate in the race, the outcome would've be the same.

    ...

So, 700-629=71.

That is how many ballots were not acceptable.

And they did not affect the vote at all.

Also....

    .....
    He shows off some of the evidence he’s gathered: open records requests from a familiar name in Dallas politics, asking only for voting lists of people who’ve never before cast a vote; a name he identifies as a harvester seen all over the campaign finance report of a recent Dallas City Council victor. He names big fish, too, and their families. He’s not afraid of getting sued, he says, because he has the evidence. D Magazine is opting not to disclose the names due to the pending criminal investigation. That said, the names are not surprising.

    Harris’ work has earned the scorn of those who say he’s simply a Tea Partier intent on undermining Democrats, especially Latinos. He says this theory ignores several details: one, he has gone after Republicans; two, mail-in ballots only work in low-turnout races usually found in poor majority-minority precincts; three, his unusual background.
    .....

Since the federal election is not a low turnout race, nor is it decided in poor majority-minority precincts, it would be hard to argue that this would have a significant (or even measurable) effect on the federal election.

    In a 2018 North Carolina congressional race, Republican Mark Harris edged out Democrat Dan McCready by 905 votes. Fortunately, the state had relatively complete absentee-ballot records. Election officials became suspicious when they discovered that the Republican received 61% of mail-in votes, even though registered Republicans accounted for only 19% of those who had requested mail-in ballots.

    A Republican operative, L. McCrae Dowless Jr., had allegedly requested more than 1,200 absentee ballots on voters’ behalf and then collected the ballots from voters’ homes when they were mailed out. Mr. Dowless’s assistants testified that they were directed to forge voters’ signatures and fill in votes. A new election was required, but Mr. Harris didn’t run. Mr. Dowless faces criminal charges for absentee-ballot fraud in both the 2016 and 2018 elections and has pled not guilty.


This one is more applicable. It is actually a federal election. It is not low turnout (for US elections).

The more interesting aspect is how they caught this guy: by simply comparing the number of ballots collected through one person. Mary Rosh mentions that “the state had relatively complete absentee-ballot records”, but does not explain how this helped the investigation. Point being, that in any jurisdiction where absentee ballots are the deciding factor, and a large portion of said ballots have gone through one person or group, you can verify those votes. That would be enough to prevent this type of fraud.

It also shows that Republicans are just as likely to benefit from mail in voting as Democrats, so there is no partisan benefit. This also provides a reason for allowing mail in voting.

There seems to be no need to disenfranchise anyone who feels that in person voting is unsafe during the ongoing pandemic.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15094555
Pants-of-dog wrote:It also shows that Republicans are just as likely to benefit from mail in voting as Democrats, so there is no partisan benefit. This also provides a reason for allowing mail in voting.

There seems to be no need to disenfranchise anyone who feels that in person voting is unsafe during the ongoing pandemic.

Actually, we should all want accurate and lawful votes in elections. The fact that the Democrats will not support voter I.D., but instead support all kinds of irregular voting, is more evidence to me that they wish to win elections by hook or crook.
User avatar
By Drlee
#15094702
The fact that the Democrats will not support voter I.D., but instead support all kinds of irregular voting, is more evidence to me that they wish to win elections by hook or crook.


Fake News.
By Doug64
#15094877
@Pants-of-dog When you respond with an article about a case that’s three years old, you might want to use one that was written later than two weeks after the crime when the investigation is just getting started.

Drlee wrote:Fake News.

This from someone that thinks that wanting to prevent one of the most simple kinds of voter fraud (and anyone that thinks there won’t be voter fraud, given both our history and basic human nature, is lying to themselves) means we “just don’t want poor people, the elderly and people of color to vote.” Yes, advocating for secure elections means you’re a bigot!
By Pants-of-dog
#15094882
Doug64 wrote:@Pants-of-dog When you respond with an article about a case that’s three years old, you might want to use one that was written later than two weeks after the crime when the investigation is just getting started.


That particular criticism is irrelevant.

The evidence shows that Democrats would not have a partisan benefit, and it also shows that voting irregularities are easy to catch and only have an impact on close races with low turnout.

It also shows that it would be easy to catch these irregularities if yo know what you are looking for.

So it would make sense to have mail voting as it would not disenfranchise anyone who thinks it is unsafe to go to a voting station.
User avatar
By Drlee
#15094888
Yes, advocating for secure elections means you’re a bigot!


No. The obvious (and admitted) Republican attempts at voter suppression means that they are bigots as a party.

Let's not fool ourselves. This is not about secure elections. That has been studied to death and disproved for a few decades now. It is about which identity group gets to vote.

One of Donald Trump’s top re-election advisers told influential Republicans in swing state Wisconsin that the party has “traditionally” relied on voter suppression to compete in battleground states, according to an audio recording of a private event.


“This will be extremely devastating to Republicans and conservatives,” Georgia State House Speaker David Ralston said this week, citing proposals that will “certainly drive up turnout.”


In
this article, former GOP chairman, former Gov. Charlie Crist, and others revealed that prevention of voter fraud was not the underlying motivation behind voting restrictions; a GOP win was.


Tell your story walking. We are not buying your bullshit.

But I am absolutely prepared to admit that most of Trump supporters are either not smart enough to understand what their party is doing, are just fine with racism, or never watch/read news that would tell them what the party is doing. Most of them are probably fine with all three.

Gonna' call racism out whenever I see it and some bullshit assertion that this is about voter security is just that. Bullshit.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15094988
Drlee wrote:No. The obvious (and admitted) Republican attempts at voter suppression means that they are bigots as a party.

Let's not fool ourselves. This is not about secure elections. That has been studied to death and disproved for a few decades now. It is about which identity group gets to vote.

I am not buying your bullshit. The so-called "voter suppression" and racist charge is just more left-wing propaganda to draw people's attention away from Democrats attempts to rig elections in their favor. The lie "that has been studied to death and disproved for a few decades" is another old propaganda line about anything the Democrats don't want to be studied impartially and fairly. The truth is that the Democrats do not want a secure and fair election that will not allow their criminals and illegals immigrants to vote for them. The Democrats just want to cheat their way to power.
User avatar
By Drlee
#15095012
I am not buying your bullshit. The so-called "voter suppression" and racist charge is just more left-wing propaganda to draw people's attention away from Democrats attempts to rig elections in their favor. The lie "that has been studied to death and disproved for a few decades" is another old propaganda line about anything the Democrats don't want to be studied impartially and fairly. The truth is that the Democrats do not want a secure and fair election that will not allow their criminals and illegals immigrants to vote for them. The Democrats just want to cheat their way to power.


Fake news.

I presented evidence. You provided lies.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15095024
Drlee wrote:Fake news.

I presented evidence. You provided lies.

Your bogus opinion is not evidence. :lol:
User avatar
By Drlee
#15095029
Your bogus opinion is not evidence.


Get someone to help you read the direct quotes I posted from Republican lawmakers.

I think you are 15, in your mom's basement and trolling for a few bucks. You can't prove me wrong. You are fake news and a fake Christian.
By pugsville
#15095031
Hindsite wrote:Actually, we should all want accurate and lawful votes in elections. The fact that the Democrats will not support voter I.D., but instead support all kinds of irregular voting, is more evidence to me that they wish to win elections by hook or crook.


they not teh ones going aorund they will only repsect the result of elections if they win and making FALSE claims about voter faud
User avatar
By Hindsite
#15095034
Drlee wrote:Get someone to help you read the direct quotes I posted from Republican lawmakers.

You actually posted some quotes from Republican lawmaker? Are those quotes supposed to make your bogus opinions evidence? I think not.

Drlee wrote:I think you are 15, in your mom's basement and trolling for a few bucks. You can't prove me wrong.

I wish that were true and I do not want to prove you wrong on that point. Happy days!

Drlee wrote:You are fake news and a fake Christian.

No. CNN and MSNBC are Fake political news and I am a professing Christian.
Praise the Lord.
User avatar
By colliric
#15095049
Sometimes I ponder if Hindsite is some kind of Republican supporting Israeli Hasbara troll masquerading as a Christian Zionist.....

Sometimes that would seem to be the only sane explanation for his posts.

But then you realise he probably is a legit Christian Zionist nutter because they usually believe in extremist Zionism-first Christianity-second inspired mental illness.
User avatar
By Drlee
#15095147
@colliric Sometimes I ponder if Hindsite is some kind of Republican supporting Israeli Hasbara troll masquerading as a Christian Zionist.....

Sometimes that would seem to be the only sane explanation for his posts.

But then you realise he probably is a legit Christian Zionist nutter because they usually believe in extremist Zionism-first Christianity-second inspired mental illness.


Yes. Possibly. Or one of the "take up serpents" folks that brighten up tent meetings in the South.

Maybe a prosperity Gospel type who believes a few bucks to Trump will knock off a few decades in Purgatory or hasten the apocalypse by a fortnight or two.
User avatar
By jimjam
#15095516
A second wave and concomitant lock down is inevitable. Trump, knowing that he is facing a landslide defeat and loss of putative Presidential immunity from prosecution, will resort to increasingly unlawful and desperate attempts to control the outcome of the election. A trade war, if not military conflict, with China is looming on the horizon. And all of these factors will have a synergistic effect to increase the destruction of the fabric of our life.

Not to worry. Mitch with fix it all with a really big corporate tax cut.

Make America Great Again? Depends how "Great" is defined. Will Private Bone Spurs strategy of divide and conquer, hatred, anger and making the rich richer lead to civil war 2? Looks like we may well be there already.

And Mother Nature is about to pitch in. We are looking at what multiple forecasters anticipate will be a hyper-active tornado season and what has a good shot at being the hottest year in recorded history.
Last edited by jimjam on 30 May 2020 17:55, edited 2 times in total.
By Patrickov
#15095518
jimjam wrote:A trade war, if not military conflict, with China is looming on the horizon.


I must say that there are actually people who see this as a hope spot because they run out of hope (of defeating CCP's tyranny) otherwise.

There are probably even more people thinking CCP, or even the Chinese people supporting CCP, deserve this.

Please stop saying it as if it is some kind of pure evilness.
  • 1
  • 117
  • 118
  • 119
  • 120
  • 121
  • 599
Israel-Palestinian War 2023

The Settlement program is an example of slow ethn[…]

Russia-Ukraine War 2022

Meanwhile, your opponents argue that everyone e[…]

People tend to forget that the French now have a s[…]

Neither is an option too. Neither have your inte[…]