Blast in Beirut, Lebanon - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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By skinster
#15111489
The news coming out of Lebanon is horrible. Close to 100 dead and over 3000 have been injured after a bomb blast on a port in Beirut. We don't know who's responsible as yet but I'm sure some of us can guess.

A clip of an explosion.








Last edited by noemon on 05 Aug 2020 02:33, edited 1 time in total. Reason: Title edited.
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By MadMonk
#15111493
Latest I've heard (nothing confirmed) that the explosion consisted of 2700 tons of ammonium nitrate, confiscated sometime ago.
Comparisons to a similar explosion in Galveston, US in 1947 when 2300 tons of ammonium nitrate exploded at the port, killing 400 to 600 people.

So far I've heard most say that it was a fire that was the immediate cause for the explosion.
Last edited by MadMonk on 04 Aug 2020 23:44, edited 1 time in total.
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By ThirdTerm
#15111504
It was a chemical warehouse that exploded accidentally near Beirut's port. Ammonium nitrate, used in chemical fertilizer production, had been left unsecured for six years in a warehouse. Combustible chemicals were stored in a warehouse and ammonium nitrate had been among the materials stored. The Oklahoma City bombing involved nine barrels of ammonium nitrate.
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By JohnRawls
#15111528
skinster wrote:The news coming out of Lebanon is horrible. Close to 100 dead and over 3000 have been injured after a bomb blast on a port in Beirut. We don't know who's responsible as yet but I'm sure some of us can guess.

A clip of an explosion.










There is no evidence to suggest it was an attack by anybody but hey, well all know that you are anti-israel and may be even anti-semitic so this behaviore is expected from you.

It seems that there was a fire in the port which ignited the chemicals. Most of the videos online are basically evidence of that.
By skinster
#15111532
When first discussing this in TLTE I said it could be entirely accidental. But if it was Israel nobody would be surprised since it's been attacking Lebanon for decades. And fuck off with antisemitism accusations, you're the anti-semites for supporting Zionism (Palestinians are semites you boring and dumb nerd).
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By JohnRawls
#15111537
skinster wrote:When first discussing this in TLTE I said it could be entirely accidental. But if it was Israel nobody would be surprised since it's been attacking Lebanon for decades. And fuck off with antisemitism accusations, you're the anti-semites for supporting Zionism (Palestinians are semites you boring and dumb nerd).


You are an anti-semite the same way as the people you supported in Labour. You don't bat an eye at spreading rumours and linking Israel AND the Jews to any negative things happening in the world.
By wat0n
#15111540
ThirdTerm wrote:It was a chemical warehouse that exploded accidentally near Beirut's port. Ammonium nitrate, used in chemical fertilizer production, had been left unsecured for six years in a warehouse. Combustible chemicals were stored in a warehouse and ammonium nitrate had been among the materials stored. The Oklahoma City bombing involved nine barrels of ammonium nitrate.


Just to put this into perspective, ammonium nitrate was the culprit behind the Texas City disaster in 1947 (581 dead, 1000+ buildings destroyed and the largest industrial disaster in the US). And they had 2,200 tons of it in the Texas City incident, it seems the storage in Beirut had 2,750 tons.
By skinster
#15111557




Politics_Observer wrote:@skinster
The CIA has attacked Lebanon too in the past if I remember correctly.

At the end of the day, the CIA never got their man, U.S. troops that were killed I think were not avenged and Lebanon was left with a bunch of dead civilians from the CIA operation that bombed an area trying to target a cleric it thought was behind the attack on U.S. troops and it later on turned out the cleric wasn't behind the attack on U.S. troops, but the damage had already been done.


Yup. The U.S. never got any revenge on their men killed on the USS Liberty though, eh? :hmm:

Godstud wrote:So far, there has been no indication that Israel is involved. We'll have to wait and see what the cause of the explosion was.


There is plenty of indications Israel could be responsible since it's been threatening and attacking Lebanon consistently for years, including earlier today, and because this is the type of shit Israel does (it bombed Gaza and Syria yesterday). But it could be an accident too.
#15111561
@skinster

Israel is an ally and they paid substantial damages to the U.S. Navy service member families of those killed in the USS Liberty attack. The also officially apologized for that mistake. That is a settled matter between the U.S. and Israel and we remain steadfast allies. We have put that behind us and have moved forward. We don't dwell on that and it does no good to do so.
#15111567








Politics_Observer wrote:@skinster

Israel is an ally and they paid substantial damages to the U.S. Navy service member families of those killed in the USS Liberty attack. The also officially apologized for that mistake. That is a settled matter between the U.S. and Israel and we remain steadfast allies. We have put that behind us and have moved forward. We don't dwell on that and it does no good to do so.


Weird that you don't get mad when allies kill your peeps. Fair enough.
#15111570
@skinster

Ohh we were pissed about it, but we are not going to go to war with our allies that are of great importance to us when it comes to the relations between our two countries. On the same token, Israel paid a lot of money in compensation for it and officially apologized. But we were mad, but it's not worth going to war over or letting it get in the way of our relations permanently. It also doesn't do any good to dwell on it either given that it is a settled matter and you have to move forward.
#15111573


Politics_Observer wrote:@skinster

Ohh we were pissed about it, but we are not going to go to war with our allies that are of great importance to us when it comes to the relations between our two countries. On the same token, Israel paid a lot of money in compensation for it and officially apologized. But we were mad, but it's not worth going to war over or letting it get in the way of our relations permanently. It also doesn't do any good to dwell on it either given that it is a settled matter and you have to move forward.


When did Israel apologise? And how do ordinary Americans like you benefit from this special relationship between the U.S. and Israel?
#15111582
@skinster

Here is a quote from an authoritative source on how both Israel and the U.S. benefits from having a relationship with each other:

Michael Eisenstadt and David Pollock of the Washington Institute wrote: At the final presidential debate of the 2012 campaign season, President Barack Obama and Governor Mitt Romney mentioned Israel some 30 times, more than any other country except Iran. Both candidates called the Jewish state "a true friend," pledging to stand with it through thick and thin. Some political commentators criticized these effusive declarations of support as pandering, suggesting that the candidates were simply going after Jewish and pro-Israel votes.

But if support for Israel is indeed such a political winner, then it's at least in part because the voters know best. The U.S.-Israeli alliance now contributes more than ever to American security, as bilateral cooperation to deal with both military and nonmilitary challenges has grown in recent years. The relationship may not be symmetrical; the United States has provided Israel with indispensable diplomatic, economic, and military support totaling more than $115 billion since 1949. But it is a two-way partnership whose benefits to the United States have been substantial. The other, less tangible costs of the U.S.-Israeli alliance -- mainly, damage to Washington's reputation in Arab and Muslim countries, a problem also caused by American interventions and decades of U.S. support for autocratic leaders in the Middle East -- pale in comparison with the economic, military, and political gains it affords Washington.

U.S.-Israeli security cooperation dates back to heights of the Cold War, when the Jewish state came to be seen in Washington as a bulwark against Soviet influence in the Middle East and a counter to Arab nationalism. Although the world has changed since then, the strategic logic for the U.S.-Israeli alliance has not. Israel remains a counterweight against radical forces in the Middle East, including political Islam and violent extremism. It has also prevented the further proliferation of weapons of mass destruction in the region by thwarting Iraq and Syria's nuclear programs.

Israel continues to help the United States deal with traditional security threats. The two countries share intelligence on terrorism, nuclear proliferation, and Middle Eastern politics. Israel's military experiences have shaped the United States' approach to counterterrorism and homeland security. The two governments work together to develop sophisticated military technology, such as the David's Sling counter-rocket and Arrow missile defense systems, which may soon be ready for export to other U.S. allies. Israel has also emerged as an important niche defense supplier to the U.S. military, with sales growing from $300 million per year before September 11 to $1.1 billion in 2006, due to the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Israel's military research and development complex has pioneered many cutting-edge technologies that are transforming the face of modern war, including cyberweapons, unmanned vehicles (such as land robots and aerial drones), sensors and electronic warfare systems, and advanced defenses for military vehicles.

The U.S.-Israeli alliance has paved the way for the countries to cooperate on far more than just traditional security issues. In part because of the long-standing political and security relationship between the United States and Israel, most Israelis know the United States and harbor positive feelings toward it. Israeli companies looking for a global market for their products have often viewed their American counterparts as partners of choice. So today, Israeli civilian technological innovations are helping the United States maintain its economic competitiveness, promote sustainable development, and address a range of non-military security challenges.


https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/pol ... or-america

That is how I benefit with the Israel relationship as an American citizen.

Israel immediately apologized following the incident:

Captain William McGonagle was later awarded a Medal of Honor for his leadership under fire in an unconventionally secret ceremony. The Israeli government quickly apologized for the incident and paid compensation to the victims and their families.


https://adst.org/2013/06/israels-attack ... s-liberty/

The source above is also an authoritative source of information on the experiences of U.S. diplomats. So, there you have it skinster!
#15111585
skinster wrote:
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Weird that you don't get mad when allies kill your peeps. Fair enough.



The 'friendliest fire'.


Also, I posted this news item to my newswire thread this afternoon:


Lebanon calls Israeli threats 'a declaration of war'

https://www.israelhayom.com/2020/08/04/ ... on-of-war/


https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/redmarx ... 859#p24859


[EDIT: Posted the item this afternoon, not this morning.]
#15111589
Politics_Observer wrote:



Israel remains a counterweight against radical forces in the Middle East, including political Islam and violent extremism.



Take a look at Israel being listed in the 'Allies' section (right-hand column) for FSA:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Syrian_Army


And:



In March, FSA and Jordanian sources and video evidence suggested that the FSA received a Saudi shipment of anti-tank missiles through Jordan, and sold these to al-Nusra fighters for $15,000 each.[293] Abu Yusaf, a high-level commander of Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL), said in August 2014 that many of the FSA members who had been trained by United States' and Turkish and Arab military officers were now actually joining ISIL. "In the East of Syria, there is no Free Syrian Army any longer. All Free Syrian Army people [there] have joined the Islamic State" he said.[294]



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Syrian_Army
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