Why US citizens leave to live abroad--summary via video - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15122188
@ingliz @Tainari88 @Rancid

And I do apologize if I offended anybody. I personally would be wary about visiting Mexico given Trump's past rhetoric towards Mexicans and how I would be treated down in Mexico if I went down there. Plus, I heard stories of missionaries from the U.S. getting killed down there by the drug cartels.
#15122192
AS I am planning to retire soon I will likely spend time in many different nations rather than just moving to one. Spain is at the top of the list as it is quite inexpensive. I would probably try other Western nations as a 3-4 month visitor and then move on. I may even try Cornwall in western UK. I want novelty and as a permanent migrant to any place the novelty will disappear after several years. Furthermore, I have five kids with kids of their own and do not want to move away from the family.

I don't mid gentrification as the quality of life rapidly improves. I also want a nation that feels like the USA but is not the USA.
#15122197
Julian658 wrote:AS I am planning to retire soon I will likely spend time in many different nations rather than just moving to one. Spain is at the top of the list as it is quite inexpensive. I would probably try other Western nations as a 3-4 month visitor and then move on. I may even try Cornwall in western UK. I want novelty and as a permanent migrant to any place the novelty will disappear after several years. Furthermore, I have five kids with kids of their own and do not want to move away from the family.

I don't mid gentrification as the quality of life rapidly improves. I also want a nation that feels like the USA but is not the USA.


YOu stole my idea! Though for me, it's 1-3 years in one place before moving on.
#15122199
Politics_Observer wrote:@Tainari88

Yeah, I know. I still would have liked to have had him as a U.S. citizen though. We could use some of these hard working Mexicans in our economy. I think it's a shame he couldn't become a U.S. citizen. I think it sucks and it hurts us here in America. I would have been proud to have had him as an American citizen.


He spent his years in Los Angeles, California.

He was deported and told never to come back. He had two children with his first wife. He had to divorce her and never stopped supporting his kids. They love him a lot. But they have to go to Mexico to see him. He said immigration destroyed his life in the USA and that is why he studied immigration law in Mexico.

Mexico fast tracks Puerto Ricans into dual citizenship. if you are from the UK, Ireland, Austalia and the USA it takes about 5 years to try to get citizenship. Puerto Rico is fast. Two years and out. You are a citizen. I asked him why. He said,to me in Spanish, "Latin Americans and Spanish speaking nations are fast tracked. We are all brother nations. And you are an educated lady and with skills. You will generate a lot of good things for Mexico. The USA lost a good woman in you. i tis our gain though." Lol. Smooth talking Mexican lawyer. He called me "Mi amor" "My love". They are smooth talkers Politics. :lol:
#15122202
Politics_Observer wrote:@ingliz @Tainari88 @Rancid

And I do apologize if I offended anybody. I personally would be wary about visiting Mexico given Trump's past rhetoric towards Mexicans and how I would be treated down in Mexico if I went down there. Plus, I heard stories of missionaries from the U.S. getting killed down there by the drug cartels.


Politics, do you know how many times I have to hear about Puerto Rican drug dealers and gangs and shit? How many Puerto Ricans are portrayed as gang members in NYC and so on? And how many stereotypes of shows and crap?

Do they talk about Puerto Ricans with PhD's like my mother? Or Master's degrees (two of them like my father)? Do they talk about Puerto Ricans who are pioneers in science, engineering and STEM work and outstanding artists and great people in the arts and sciences? Here is a man I worked with and admire. A Puerto Rican of great prestige. Most Latin Americans are like my immigration lawyer. Hard working, honest people trying to make a living by being honest. The system is rigged in Latin America AGAINST people being able to climb out of poverty. It is not because they don't have the intelligence or the education. They obviously do because the grinding poverty and lack of English and many other things like racism and shit never STOPPED their ambitions.

They made it in their own countries despite the huge obstacles in their way. My parents were like that.

The conclusion is that there is a lot of potential in all nations of people. But if you don't invest in education, and in building up all of your nation's people? You will not be able to progress. Mexico has wonderful people. But the elite SUCKED. They corrupted the system and they also sold their people's labor for SHIT wages of exploitation Politics. The average Mexican makes 500 pesos a week. Do you know what that is? $28 to $30 dollars for 40 damn hours of full time work. That is it. People got to live on that. Could you live on that shit for the rest of your life? No one can. You can't buy a home, you can't buy a used car, you got to use the bus and it better be on the cheap day and not during rush hour.

Most Mexicans got to live in that grinding ass exploitation day in and day out without relief. Then you got a bunch of ignorant people who think the entire nation are damn drug dealers? Lol.

The first Mexicans my mother met were a bunch of PhD's from Mexico City at San Diego State University. And also from the University of California San Diego. Mexicans with doctorates talking about a bunch of interesting things. Those were her first known Mexicans in her life. So her idea of Mexicans was not about drug cartels and gangs. That shit is Hollywood bullshit.

Mexico is vast. It has extremely wealthy people with servants, it has middle class people living well, it has grinding poverty, it has all kinds of people in it. An entire universe of realities. To boil it down into gangs and drugs is falling into stereotypes.

A bunch of Mexicans know I am a foreigner and not Mexican in Mexico. They don't threaten me or make my life difficult. Why? Most American citizens in their fifties are going to be just paying taxes and helping the economy. Mexico is not interested in kicking out foreigners. Not Cubans, Colombians, Peruvians, etc. None of them. Mexico has had Syrians, Kenyans, people from Palestine, Lebanon, Spain, Argentina, Venezuela, Honduras, etc. all running in there. None of them have told me...."I am afraid of Mexican immigration." they complain about the bad salaries that are paid. But Mexicans are paid the same shit salaries. It is about the lack of economic mobility that drives the quest north to the USA. RAISE THE DAMN WAGES. It is impossible to live on that shit.
#15122261
[quote="Politics_Observer"]:lol: I'm catching hell from Tainari again!

@Tainari88

You remind me of my wife. I catch hell from my wife too at times. :lol: She has french canandian in her.[/quoted]

You are a man with a different set of experiences than I have Politics.

One of the truths one must learn living in various nations in this world? is that the people who are poor and can barely make the rent? Have the least amount of freedom and the least amount of choices. They are in prison due to not having enough money to reach any of their ambitions. My parents came from poverty. the journey out of poverty was very difficult. But when they got to the point of understanding many things? They did something very strange. They CHOSE to live in poverty voluntarily. Because they said, 'If being rich means looking down on the people who I came from? Being a person of materialism only and not seeing what is wrong and needs change? Being blind to what has to happen and the truth of why poor people are kept that way through a series of social controls?

They CHOSE poverty. Poverty with a PhD. Those people are RARE Politics. Most people want to get an education to make more money and live comfortably. That is the issue we have with our current president and current crop of politicians in Washington DC and many many other political figures all over the world. They never CHOOSE to be poor and instead of using their office and power to serve their nations they use hem to profit off of their positions and to consolidate their privileges. That kind of use of political positioning? Is horrible. But unless people in general stop with the bullshit of looking down on poor people and instead see how extraordinary the human spirit is under duress and pressure? How many people are wasted in their potential because of class conscious stuff, and racist mentalities, believing bullshit like your average Mexxican is a drug dealer? American communities consume all the drugs. they love drugs. But they blame the Mexicans for selling something they consume and are willing to pay for.....total capitalists are drug dealers. That entire mentality of I want my money and fuck how the rest of society loses out due to the drug addiction. It is not my problem. that is a problem Politics Observer. That disregard for VALUES that are sound humne values. it is the same bad mentality that allows Mexicans to make $30 dollars a week and thinks that is acceptable. None of it is acceptable at all!
#15122265
Why do US citizens leave to live abroad?

1. Healthcare.
2. So they won't die of Covid-19.
3. To escape the rise of fascism in USA.


@Politics_Observer If you aren't in a bad area it's perfectly safe to live in Mexico. Every country has its regions where you don't want to live due to crime, or other problems.
#15122294
Godstud wrote:Why do US citizens leave to live abroad?

1. Healthcare.
2. So they won't die of Covid-19.
3. To escape the rise of fascism in USA.


Reason 2 is utter nonsense.

Anyone not observing the necessary social distancing rules and hygiene procedures are bound to catch, and thus die of, the disease, anywhere in the world.
#15122424
Patrickov wrote:Anyone not observing the necessary social distancing rules and hygiene procedures are bound to catch, and thus die of, the disease, anywhere in the world.
That's not true. Thailand where I live still has some rules in place, but everything is open, within the country(from bars to gyms).

No one has died of Covid-19 since June 2, in Thailand(59 deaths in total since the start of the pandemic. That's less than 1 death per million over the last 7 months). Infections are being caught in quarantine, and they are in the single digits weekly.
#15122580
Godstud wrote:That's not true. Thailand where I live still has some rules in place, but everything is open, within the country(from bars to gyms).

No one has died of Covid-19 since June 2, in Thailand(59 deaths in total since the start of the pandemic. That's less than 1 death per million over the last 7 months). Infections are being caught in quarantine, and they are in the single digits weekly.


Are you suggesting you guys are not wearing masks when you go outside then? That's not going to do well.

Hong Kong cases rebounded for about a month when the lockdown was loosened in July. Now that confirmed case figures drop again, I am not very confident with the upcoming (and inevitable) ease.
#15122717
Patrickov wrote:Are you suggesting you guys are not wearing masks when you go outside then? That's not going to do well.
No one has the disease, so it's pretty hard to spread it. Wearing masks outdoors isn't as important as wearing them indoors. Ventilation and social distancing are easier outdoors.

Big stores and shops still require mask use and contact tracing. Schools require mask use. Thais have not forgotten that there is a pandemic.

Here's an interesting note, as well... Thailand has no "flu season".

Patrickov wrote:Hong Kong cases rebounded for about a month when the lockdown was loosened in July. Now that confirmed case figures drop again, I am not very confident with the upcoming (and inevitable) ease.
They opened bars, gyms, schools, and all of its venues in July. The only cases Thailand has had has been from people entering the country in quarantine.

Thailand has managed to have a lower number of Covid cases than Hong Kong, despite having a population 10x great.
#15122735
@Patrickov

I think Godstud hit the nail on the head with his post. The U.S. government is failing to provide for the needs of the people. We need better and cheaper healthcare as well as universal healthcare. The U.S. government, despite having the expertise and resources, fails to protect it's citizens from COVID. The U.S. government has failed to regulate capitalism and has busted unions which is led to the rise of fascism and now we are on the brink of having a dictator officially here in the U.S. with our form of government completely destroyed by Trump and the republicans.

After January 20, 2021; we might not be able to honestly call ourselves a republic anymore and who knows, we might be in a war or we might just have a dictatorship or the country could just split apart. When that happens, if they are able, a lot of great brilliant minds will leave the U.S. and move to other countries with more stable governments who better provide and represent their people, IF those governments are willing to take them.

Which some governments will because they want the talent and brainpower. This is all the republicans and Trump's doing these past 4 years. Nobody else is to blame. These past 4 years are ALL on the republicans and Trump. The U.S. government is failing right now under republicans and Trump to offer the stability and security as well assure their rights of it's citizens to live in freedom with the genuine rule of law that people need. If they install a Trump dictatorship, people are going to leave and and live abroad even more. I don't blame them.
#15122906
Politics_Observer wrote:@Patrickov

I think Godstud hit the nail on the head with his post. The U.S. government is failing to provide for the needs of the people. We need better and cheaper healthcare as well as universal healthcare. The U.S. government, despite having the expertise and resources, fails to protect it's citizens from COVID. The U.S. government has failed to regulate capitalism and has busted unions which is led to the rise of fascism and now we are on the brink of having a dictator officially here in the U.S. with our form of government completely destroyed by Trump and the republicans.

After January 20, 2021; we might not be able to honestly call ourselves a republic anymore and who knows, we might be in a war or we might just have a dictatorship or the country could just split apart. When that happens, if they are able, a lot of great brilliant minds will leave the U.S. and move to other countries with more stable governments who better provide and represent their people, IF those governments are willing to take them.

Which some governments will because they want the talent and brainpower. This is all the republicans and Trump's doing these past 4 years. Nobody else is to blame. These past 4 years are ALL on the republicans and Trump. The U.S. government is failing right now under republicans and Trump to offer the stability and security as well assure their rights of it's citizens to live in freedom with the genuine rule of law that people need. If they install a Trump dictatorship, people are going to leave and and live abroad even more. I don't blame them.

I blame the Democrats and their MSM for resisting President Trump and the Republicans for our problems in the last four years, except for the China virus, which is the fault of the Chinese Communist Party.
#15123177
Politics_Observer wrote:@Patrickov

I think Godstud hit the nail on the head with his post. The U.S. government is failing to provide for the needs of the people. We need better and cheaper healthcare as well as universal healthcare. The U.S. government, despite having the expertise and resources, fails to protect it's citizens from COVID. The U.S. government has failed to regulate capitalism and has busted unions which is led to the rise of fascism and now we are on the brink of having a dictator officially here in the U.S. with our form of government completely destroyed by Trump and the republicans.

After January 20, 2021; we might not be able to honestly call ourselves a republic anymore and who knows, we might be in a war or we might just have a dictatorship or the country could just split apart. When that happens, if they are able, a lot of great brilliant minds will leave the U.S. and move to other countries with more stable governments who better provide and represent their people, IF those governments are willing to take them.

Which some governments will because they want the talent and brainpower. This is all the republicans and Trump's doing these past 4 years. Nobody else is to blame. These past 4 years are ALL on the republicans and Trump. The U.S. government is failing right now under republicans and Trump to offer the stability and security as well assure their rights of it's citizens to live in freedom with the genuine rule of law that people need. If they install a Trump dictatorship, people are going to leave and and live abroad even more. I don't blame them.



While I wholly agree that the Trump administration must be accounted for their failings (up to the point of, say, being killed if other means do not work), I still think you anti-Trumpers exaggerated their responsibility, very much because you guys had been too infatuated by the Obama administration.

I have two point to refute both your and Member Godstud's accusations of Trump administration:
1. The epidemic would not have spread like this if social distancing was observed better, and
2. There are other places whose governments often make measures in deliberate disregard of public safety in favour of political agenda, but the citizens, in control of their governments or not, observe measures to save themselves.

For example, Hong Kong Government's effort in distribution of resources and border shutoff have been less than optimal, and it's widely believed that this lackluster performance was to allow more privileged Mainland Chinese to get better treatment. Hong Kong's relative success compared to, say, Singapore, was largely credited to residents' own vigilance.

There were also Hongkongers trying to leave the place early in the epidemic because of belief similar to Member Godstud's point 2. Some of them had their plans badly backfired, and their lack of precautions made them catch the disease abroad.

All in all, I strongly believe individual behaviour matter much more than governmental response, and Trumpers are not totally pointless in pointing out that Democrat-controlled states are harder hit and their administration should also share some of the responsibility. Of course, I don't side with them either because they probably hide Republican sabotage, which I believe also exists to some extent.

On a side note, in the July epidemic of Hong Kong it's those who side with the CCP collaborating government suffering more, because they do not observe whatever measures necessary, and I indeed believe Republican supporters (even in bigger cities) had been the one hit harder in the United States. They had themselves to blame if such a phenomenon exists, and it costed them the election.

Last but not least, I find your lamenting of Trump's plan to steal power irrelevant to our topic, but I think you guys should have been better prepared for some necessary violence to be applied on Trumpers, no matter how much you guys do not want it.
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