Citizen-Democracy - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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By Sandzak
#15152137
starman2003 wrote::lol: And that's supposed to work better than the party system? The majority would vote for the same costly benefits (or avoidance of sacrifice) they currently get with the "hole parcel." At least under representative democracy economic and other experts can advise elected "leaders," limiting the impact of the masses' irresponsibility.


In Switzerland works this, the country with the highest wages for common workers. The population votes but the parlaiment implements this.
#15152138
Sandzak wrote:In Switzerland works this, the country with the highest wages for common workers. The population votes but the parlaiment implements this.


One democracy…in which circumstances are atypical. Maybe the "parlaiment" takes liberties with voter decisions...
#15152169
Well this is more or less oligarchy of the worthy. But this system can becoke very corrupt very fast.
The elite who judge who will get the right to vote or not will eventually use this huge power for their own purposes.
Democracy either works in its fullest either its not democracy at all.
Afterall democracy means reign of the people (res publica - >Republic). If we accept the fact that the majority of people aren't qualified to reign then it means democracy at its very core is not possible, or at least viable.
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By starman2003
#15152347
Hellas me ponas wrote: If we accept the fact that the majority of people aren't qualified to reign then it means democracy at its very core is not possible, or at least viable.


Right; it's a dangerous luxury. If it has survived in the US this long it's because only an incredibly rich and safe nation can afford such a luxury. But that was the past.

So it works.


By undermining or reducing democracy.
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By Odiseizam
#15152754
I've made intrusion in this thread not elaborating further what I understand as citizen-democracy solely taken out of context from the name, but not the context as postulated by the OP ...

... first of all voting is one thing and governing another, but lets say the voting system is known, then we need to know who will bear the responsibility, thus logically we need either Representative or Participatory Democracy > engaged by the principle for O-Gov, but such strict concept would be maybe ideal in libertarian circumstances eventually constructive anarchism , anyway ideal participatory democracy its not feaseable, but more reachable would be amalgam of representative and participatory democracy, like it or not every car should have one particular driver ... now how particular participation in the system would be managed (on any levels) that is something completely different, responsible eligible or cyborg that could be arranged easily in manner of technocratic meritocracy like nowadays chinese exam system for administration ...

... in these e-circumstances O-Gov governance should be implemented through institutional e-forums, in a way it would be participative technocracy in every sector monitored by every citizen, and polished by any with expertise in the field, tho also polished by any common citizen too but through ngo e-forums i.e. their experts as middle man so there would be less overload for the system, in the last case predominately in question is open corruption magnifier, but altogether as open system would mean instant polishing of laws and projects through constant institutional debate on institutional e-forums pushed by all citizens ...

    Odiseizam wrote:... this can be simplified as > philosophy will reemerge from the current crisis of will as annatar1914 points through promotion of True Open Society if not Open Government concepts, manageable through modern e-tools like e-forums that would be boosted also by local blogging and social platforms ~ for greater momentum as such additionally stimulated by the states ... kind of concept exists now just on e-Gov but not O-gov (open government) level, probably because as such is proposed in/from large states, but actually it would be possible and selfsufficient in small countries, normally any huge system reshape in such way would mean risk for the current liberal capitalist elites in power that in this way would be cornered till bone in their corrupt habits, strange why this kind of proposition its not still at least active as experiment somewhere nowadays!? researchgate is close to it, but we need first to act locally and then rush in globbaly i.e. compacting own forces so we could bring higher vibe in the field ...

_______________________________________________________________________

    Jesse wrote:Thats what I envision, save perhaps not for just Soldiers. A person signs on to become a Citizen, and they're monitored for a set period of time, and after that, granted Citizenship, and the magical right to vote.

this in meritocratic system would mean having higher limit for privileges, in this case the right to vote, but I'll say that is wrongly postulated and as such its not democracy if we know that in any the right for vote its basic principle, what on other hand could be introduced is responsibility i.e. those who wants to vote to need to stay till next rotation in the country or to be obligated to participate in the institutional or nongovernmental e-forums so he would not loose the right to vote next roll of elections ...

but, hm, all this to be done, first there should be clever biometric encryption and cyber security for such system, but also e-citizenship like eg. in Estonia, and all of this secured by local social network on top of what it would be stimulated by national discounts or benefits eg. free public transoirt for those who are regular institutional e-forum polishers ...

as noted above by Sandzak, some current similar model of Participator Democracy is the swiss one, but way rudimentary and just as referendum prone, instead what nowadays we need is quick but painless engaging through eventual institutional e-forums, and that would meant e-citizenship but biometric so referendum voting could be offered regularly on e-polls , and think this would be cheapest and fastest way of voting as substitute for the current unfunctional right of public participation, instead the current through street protests and riots which by all means is wrong waste of time will and energy!

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