Can Trump end the "Anchor Baby" policy with an executive order? - Page 5 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14961130
Drlee wrote:Correct. Because they, quite correctly, believe that the majority of the 30 million illegal aliens here now are helping the economy and living quiet and productive lives as American taxpayers.

And, of course, they are voting for Democrats.

Yes, both the Democrats and the Republicans have previously put forth a globalist vision, but President trump is fighting against it and has declared he is a nationalist, not a globalist. However, the mainstream liberal media is trying to claim he is a racist by falsely associating nationalist with "white nationalist", another example of the dishonest media bias.
#14961252
pugsville wrote:you got something to back that opinion?

The Trump administration has heavily favored wall st. Both in it's appointments and policies,

The Republicans have also made it easy for corporate money to influence elections,

Did you see republicans trying to do something about corporate money?


I have already responded to similar questions. You are conflating Trump with past Republicans. Their goals are not the same.
I and others posted links before but here is another one...

https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2018/1 ... democrats/
#14961296
Why is it that industry would contribute to democrats? Hmmmm. Let's see....

Well. Maybe it is that the republican president has destroyed our image in global markets.

Maybe it is tariffs that are destroying American farmers and dramatically hindering the free trade upon which American businesses rely.

Perhaps it is the uncertainly that Trump has introduced into global markets.

Perhaps it is the spectacularly large deficit that Trump has introduced into markets making the government compete with industry for the same dollars or worse introducing inflation.

No Skippy. Rich people, unlike their poorer countrymen are smart enough to vote their own self-interest.

In a spectacularly ignorant statement Hindsite said of illegal aliens, "And, of course, they are voting for Democrats."


It is just possible that someone could be stupid enough to be unaware that illegal aliens can't vote at all.

(But wait. Here comes the equally stupid claim that they do. Not a single study, including the President's own election committee, has found evidence of widespread fraudulent voting. In fact the number of fraudulent votes in the US is so small that there is absolutely no evidence of a single election having been influenced by it.

Hindsite. You have said some pretty uninformed things before but this is pretty bad even by your almost nonexistent standards.

Praise the Lord.
#14961328
Some 605,000 undocumented immigrants who live in California were granted driver’s licenses in 2015, the first year they have been able to enjoy that benefit, officials said.

The law known as AB60 took effect on January 2, 2015. The California Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) expects a total of about 1.4 million people will get their license under the law by late 2017.

Governor Jerry Brown, a Democrat, signed the law in October 2013 to give a legal document to the 2.5 million undocumented immigrants in California alone — most from Latin America and particularly neighboring Mexico.

That announcement renewed interest in another California law, the “New Motor Voter Act,” which was passed in October 2015. The combination of these two acts, one allowing undocumented residents to obtain driver’s licenses, the other automatically registering them to vote when obtaining driver’s licenses, sparked fears that California was allowing undocumented residents to vote.

In a stunning ruling, the Supreme Court of the United States struck down an Arizona law requiring voters to present citizenship proof to register in state and federal elections.

The law clears the way to illegal alien undocumented immigrants voting in national elections without substantive means of preventing it for many states. The highest court in the land ruled 7-2 that federal law “precludes Arizona from requiring a federal form applicant to submit information beyond that required by the form itself,” as Justice Scalia wrote. Professor Tom Caso of the Chapman University School of Law in California told the Associated Press that the decision “opened the door” to noncitizen voting.

“The court’s decision ignores the clear dictates of the Constitution in favor of bureaucratic red tape,” Caso said. Justices Clarence Thomas and Samuel Alito dissented from the court’s ruling.

The Constitution “authorizes states to determine the qualifications of voters in federal elections, which necessarily includes the related power to determine whether those qualifications are satisfied,” Thomas wrote in his dissent.

Democrats argue that requiring proof of citizenship is a needless burden on their “vulnerable” constituents. So how can they know that illegal immigrants are not voting if they are automatically registered to vote?
#14961399
Drlee wrote:Why is it that industry would contribute to democrats? Hmmmm. Let's see....

Well. Maybe it is that the republican president has destroyed our image in global markets.

Maybe it is tariffs that are destroying American farmers and dramatically hindering the free trade upon which American businesses rely.

Perhaps it is the uncertainly that Trump has introduced into global markets.

Perhaps it is the spectacularly large deficit that Trump has introduced into markets making the government compete with industry for the same dollars or worse introducing inflation.

No Skippy. Rich people, unlike their poorer countrymen are smart enough to vote their own self-interest.



It is just possible that someone could be stupid enough to be unaware that illegal aliens can't vote at all.

(But wait. Here comes the equally stupid claim that they do. Not a single study, including the President's own election committee, has found evidence of widespread fraudulent voting. In fact the number of fraudulent votes in the US is so small that there is absolutely no evidence of a single election having been influenced by it.

Hindsite. You have said some pretty uninformed things before but this is pretty bad even by your almost nonexistent standards.

Praise the Lord.


You don’t see a problem with your claims of ‘Trump’s disastrous policies’ resulting in a booming economy and better trade deals. It would appear you think they are ‘disastrous’ because they work. Even Europe is abandoning their ridiculous policies with Iran that everyone said Trump was wrong about. It seems the more he demonstrates the fallacy of past liberal policies, the more upset you are. :)
#14961634
TL;DR
In reply to the OP,
1] I'm 72 and all my life this has been settled law.
2] Just how is this going to be enforced? Are hospitals going to have to ask mothers for proof of citizenship? What proof would be required? Are you really willing to force every poor citizen to jump through hoops to make sure that their children are citizens from now on?
3] Or are we going to make it retroactive? That would be an even bigger can of worms.
4] After 3 generations you would have a large number of residents who's parents were born here and they and their parents would not be citizens. This number woud grow with every generation. This would create a class of 2nd class people in the nation. Just dumb.

If you wan to do something about illegals coming across the border to work, go after their employers.
Have the Gov. set up a real data base. From now on require everyone to have their birth certificate, passport, or green card handy for when they change jobs. The US Gov. could set up a program to require that the states not charge for a copy of your birth certificate and instead charge the US Gov. the amount it cost to do that. Requiring better proof of your right to work here can be done in one of these ways, it just costs money.
. . . And remember I think the Gov. can create all the dollars it wants to, for free. Within reason, not $100T all at once.
. . . If aliens can't earn a living here then they will go back to their nation of origin.

I think it makes more sense to go after the adults who want to work illegally than to force every mother to prove that their baby should be a citizen.
Last edited by Steve_American on 10 Nov 2018 06:56, edited 2 times in total.
#14961639
Suntzu wrote:Pretty easy to determine if someone has voted and also citizenship status.

Put illegals that vote in prison. ;)

The Democrats want to win, so they want do it as long as they believe the illegals will vote for them.
That is why they don't want voter ID. In California, they refuse to look at it even if someone tries to show an ID.
#14961657
Hindsite wrote:The Democrats want to win, so they want do it as long as they believe the illegals will vote for them.
That is why they don't want voter ID. In California, they refuse to look at it even if someone tries to show an ID.

Lordy, lordy, lordy, you do believe every fake news story that you see in your media of choice.
Repuds look hard to find evidence to prove such claims, and low and behold they find about 20 examples IIRC across the whole nation per election.
Yes, Trump say 3 million illegals voted for HRC in 2016, but he put forward not 1 shread of evidence.
#14961694
Steve_American wrote:Lordy, lordy, lordy, you do believe every fake news story that you see in your media of choice.
Repuds look hard to find evidence to prove such claims, and low and behold they find about 20 examples IIRC across the whole nation per election.
Yes, Trump say 3 million illegals voted for HRC in 2016, but he put forward not 1 shread of evidence.

No I do not believe the Fake news stories put out by CNN, MSNBC, NY Times, and Washington Post. But I do believe these reports:

Poll: 13% of Illegal Aliens ADMIT They Vote

June 3, 2015 By Stephen Frank 59 Comments


As we always knew, California and American elections are filled with fraud and corruption. Thanks to a new poll, we now know that approximately 13% of illegal aliens vote. Since they are already criminals, stealing ID’s or using phony ID’s. lie to get welfare, steal jobs—why not vote as they to lose. Since they can not be deported or jailed, they have nothing to lose. Obama is protecting these law breakers.

http://www.capoliticalreview.com/capoli ... they-vote/

Trump Is Right — Millions Of Illegals Probably Did Vote In 2016

A 2014 study in the online Electoral Studies Journal shows that in the 2008 and 2010 elections, illegal immigrant votes were in fact quite high.

"We find that some noncitizens participate in U.S. elections, and that this participation has been large enough to change meaningful election outcomes including Electoral College votes, and congressional elections," wrote Jesse T. Richman, Gulshan A. Chattha, both of Old Dominion University, and David C. Earnest of George Mason University.

More specifically, they write, "Noncitizen votes likely gave Senate Democrats the pivotal 60th vote needed to overcome filibusters in order to pass health care reform and other Obama administration priorities in the 111th Congress."

Specifically, the authors say that illegals may have cast as many as 2.8 million votes in 2008 and 2010. That's a lot of votes. And when you consider the population of illegal inhabitants has only grown since then, it's not unreasonable to suppose that their vote has, too.

Leftist get-out-the-vote groups openly urge noncitizens to vote during election time, and the registration process is notoriously loose. To suggest there is no illegal voting at all is absurd.

When the far left began insinuating that the Russians had hacked the election, the media treated the nonsupported claims with the utmost of respect. They still do. But not Trump's suggestion that illegals voted, and in large numbers, mainly for Democratic candidates, including Hillary Clinton. A Rasmussen Reports poll earlier this year found that 53% of the Democratic Party supports letting illegals vote, even though it's against the law. It's pretty clear why.

https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... e-in-2016/

Report: ‘Substantial Evidence’ Over a Million Illegal Aliens Voted in 2016

But according to California attorney and LawNewz contributor Robert Barnes, there is “substantial evidence” to make a great case. He writes:


The best study on the subject — a study that meets the Daubert standards for admissible evidence in a jury trial in a legal courtroom — provides substantial evidence that non-citizen voting alone likely reached over a million in this election. A trio of well-regarded scholars used scientifically approved methods to study the question of non-citizen voting in federal elections. The result of their study published in one of the best-regarded peer-review political science journals, Electoral Studies. The evidence from their study suggested upwards of 10% of non-citizens voted in 2008; given the issues implicated in this election, a higher number would be a reasonable inference for a jury to conclude. Given the increase in non-citizen members of the population, the same study’s conclusions would project out to millions of illegal votes from non-citizen voters in this election.

But that’s just the start. Those numbers don’t include other instances, such as illegal votes, illegally counted votes or counties and precincts which “accidentally” over-counted votes, states Barnes.

https://www.truthrevolt.org/news/report ... voted-2016
#14961702
As usual Hindsite has quoted fake news to support his stupid claim that illegals vote in large numbers. Who is surprised by that. And he likes to speak of democrats when he makes this claim. But what is the truth?

Well let's see. As for the claim that Californians do not want voter ID laws. You know the liberals in California that brought you those pillars of the liberal community Ronald Reagan and Richard Nixon. You know. The Californians who elected a republican governor to several terms recently. But how about the others?

In ultra-conservative North Carolina there is no voter ID requirement at all. In ultra-conservative South Carolina and Oklahoma you are required to show ID but any paper with your address on it is allowed. No photo required. You can vote on your phone bill.

But wait. Hindsite did not know this. If it is a persons first time voting in California they ARE required to show ID. California's voter ID standards are much stricter than North and South Carolina In every one of the deep red states no ID is required for mail-in ballots. Get that Hindsite. In your beloved deep red states anyone can get a mail in ballot and send it in with no ID. Why did the all-republican state governments allow people to vote without ID if there is a problem of the magnitude you express.

But what do the real objective sources say about the "problem"?

Under Rick Scott, Florida Governor, the state began an effort to purge Florida's voting rolls of potentially illegal voters. They started with a list of 185,000 voters. That was quickly whittled down to 2700, and then to 200. Finally it arrived at 85. Between 2000 and 2011 there were 56 confirmed cases of illegals voting nationwide. h
A massive study was done at Irvine. Here is the result expressed by the professor who oversaw the study.

Richard Hasen, an election law expert at the University of California, Irvine, called Phillips’ claim "fake news."
"There is no credible evidence I have seen to show large numbers of noncitizens voting in U.S. elections anywhere," Hasen said. "The idea that 3 million noncitizens could have illegally voted in our elections without being detected is obscenely ludicrous."


People who believe illegals are voting in large numbers and affecting our elections are stupid. They are too lazy to look at the data and myriad studies that prove their beliefs to be idiotic. But idiots abound in the right these days.

The assertion that 3 million illegals voted in the election, as expressed by Trump and a number of discredited propaganda outlets like Brietbart is pure propaganda. There is no truth to it. You know. Kinda' like Trump saying that he knows his new AG and that he is a good man less than a month ago and denying that he knows him three times yesterday. Out and out lying is a different thing from divergent political opinions. Unfortunately there is not a soul in the republican party, with the possible exception of Romney, who has the courage to call anyone on lies.
#14961707
Point of order, us lefties in CA are for a free and automatic voter ID given to everyone. We're fine with an ID check if everyone is given an ID automatically, and registration happens automatically.
#14961710
Hindsite wrote:No I do not believe the Fake news stories put out by CNN, MSNBC, NY Times, and Washington Post. But I do believe these reports:

Poll: 13% of Illegal Aliens ADMIT They Vote

June 3, 2015 By Stephen Frank 59 Comments


As we always knew, California and American elections are filled with fraud and corruption. Thanks to a new poll, we now know that approximately 13% of illegal aliens vote. Since they are already criminals, stealing ID’s or using phony ID’s. lie to get welfare, steal jobs—why not vote as they to lose. Since they can not be deported or jailed, they have nothing to lose. Obama is protecting these law breakers.

http://www.capoliticalreview.com/capoli ... they-vote/

Trump Is Right — Millions Of Illegals Probably Did Vote In 2016

A 2014 study in the online Electoral Studies Journal shows that in the 2008 and 2010 elections, illegal immigrant votes were in fact quite high.

"We find that some noncitizens participate in U.S. elections, and that this participation has been large enough to change meaningful election outcomes including Electoral College votes, and congressional elections," wrote Jesse T. Richman, Gulshan A. Chattha, both of Old Dominion University, and David C. Earnest of George Mason University.

More specifically, they write, "Noncitizen votes likely gave Senate Democrats the pivotal 60th vote needed to overcome filibusters in order to pass health care reform and other Obama administration priorities in the 111th Congress."

Specifically, the authors say that illegals may have cast as many as 2.8 million votes in 2008 and 2010. That's a lot of votes. And when you consider the population of illegal inhabitants has only grown since then, it's not unreasonable to suppose that their vote has, too.

Leftist get-out-the-vote groups openly urge noncitizens to vote during election time, and the registration process is notoriously loose. To suggest there is no illegal voting at all is absurd.

When the far left began insinuating that the Russians had hacked the election, the media treated the nonsupported claims with the utmost of respect. They still do. But not Trump's suggestion that illegals voted, and in large numbers, mainly for Democratic candidates, including Hillary Clinton. A Rasmussen Reports poll earlier this year found that 53% of the Democratic Party supports letting illegals vote, even though it's against the law. It's pretty clear why.

https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... e-in-2016/

Report: ‘Substantial Evidence’ Over a Million Illegal Aliens Voted in 2016

But according to California attorney and LawNewz contributor Robert Barnes, there is “substantial evidence” to make a great case. He writes:


The best study on the subject — a study that meets the Daubert standards for admissible evidence in a jury trial in a legal courtroom — provides substantial evidence that non-citizen voting alone likely reached over a million in this election. A trio of well-regarded scholars used scientifically approved methods to study the question of non-citizen voting in federal elections. The result of their study published in one of the best-regarded peer-review political science journals, Electoral Studies. The evidence from their study suggested upwards of 10% of non-citizens voted in 2008; given the issues implicated in this election, a higher number would be a reasonable inference for a jury to conclude. Given the increase in non-citizen members of the population, the same study’s conclusions would project out to millions of illegal votes from non-citizen voters in this election.

But that’s just the start. Those numbers don’t include other instances, such as illegal votes, illegally counted votes or counties and precincts which “accidentally” over-counted votes, states Barnes.

https://www.truthrevolt.org/news/report ... voted-2016


Let’s give you the benefit of the doubt and tentatively accept your proposition for the sake of argument. Let’s assume there is rampant voter fraud... If that were true, this would make Trump the single stupidest, most incompetent person to have ever existed for not taking serious action to fix this problem. So your point is mute.

Now... lets get back to reality. What IS a real problem is outside interference from powers such as Russia in our democracy. And Trump is taking no action either. Thus he is incopetent and stupid.

Either way, does not look very good for him. :lol:
#14961735
California allows illegals to vote in school elections and get driver’s license, but we are to believe they enforce them not voting in other elections? Come on. How do you even know when there is no attempt at verification process and an obvious bias to allow them full citizenship rights?
It’s like having a pedophile for a babysitter and only taking his word if he is abusing your child.
#14961808
Pants-of-dog wrote:Illegals do not vote, and the claim is based on the error margin of a study that has since been shown to be wrong.

Illegals should be allowed to vote.


On what basis?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.


Where are illegals included?
#14961817
Pants-of-dog wrote:On the idea that democratic governments should be accountable to the people they govern.


You don’t govern illegals, you deport them. Only by denying allegiance to your national government can you justify giving the same rights to illegals. This is why I find it absurd you use a constitution you are rejecting to justify your actions. Or are you arguing the US constitution applies to everyone in the world?
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