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Russian Losses in Chechen conflict as of June 3, 2003

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Post Sat Feb 07, 2004 1:42 am
Quote:
October 11, 2001

According to the numbers officially released by the Russian government sources on Oct. 10 2001, the federal security forces in Chechnya have sustained 3438 dead and 11,661 wounded. These numbers include 2136 dead and 5763 wounded Defense Ministry troops, 1196 dead and 5399 wounded Interior Ministry troops, and 106 dead and 499 wounded servicemen of other federal agencies (Emergencies Ministry, FSB, GRU, etc.)


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June 3, 2002

According to the Joint Group of Federal Forces in Chechnya source, between October 1 1999 and May 30 2002 the Russian Defense Ministry sustained 2410 killed and 6053 wounded. These casualty figures do not include losses sustained by the Interior Ministry troops (police) and other federal agencies. The number of killed rebels accounted for is 13,140. Between May 27 and June 2 2002 Russian Defense Ministry troops conducted 105 separate operations in 19 Chechen towns and villages killing 93 and arresting around 100 rebels, while 30 fighters have voluntarily surrendered.

Thus, between October 10 2001 and May 30 2001 Russian army troops suffered 274 killed and 290 wounded, or on the average of 1.18 killed and 1.25 wounded per day.

Venik

This is very very sad, so many ppl dying... I hate wars.

Also the first war.



Quote:
According to official figures, the Russian security forces, including the Ministry of Defense, Interior Ministry and other government agencies, have sustained 4379 KIA, 703 MIA and POWs, and 705 AWL (absent without leave).

The actual number of losses is lower than the published figures by about 1-2% due to some duplicate entries in the statistical data.

The number of personnel losses constitutes between 2 and 4 percent of the total number of troops deployed in support of the anti-terrorist operation in Chechnya in 1994-1996.

Venik

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Post Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:39 pm
The war in Chechnya is pretty stupid. One of the most powerful armies in the world is fighting against a bunch of pathetic half-trained terrorists. Over 10,000 casulties is a lot, that that doesn't include military vehicles, etc.

However, since the Russian army is in such a sad state right now, that is to be expected, and there are plenty of terrorists out there.

My solution is pretty brutal, but I think it'll work a lot better than what they've been doing up to this point. Bomb them, a lot. Chechnya has a very large mountainous region, and that's where most are probably hiding. So...take all the millions of bombs left over from the Cold War, and carpet-bomb the entire region. It won't kill everyone, but it sure will scare a whole lot of people to death.

I have an even better idea, but if Russia does that, Bush will put it on the Axis of Evil list, and that can't be good. Spray the mountains with the same stuff they used during the Theater seige in 2002.
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Post Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:47 pm
They havn't lost 10,000 men...yet...but they still have lost a hell of a lot.

And the Chechens aren't half trained terrorists...they'r highly trained and experienced former Red Army soldiers...thats why they know how to fight so well.

The solution...pull out of Chechnya.
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Post Mon Feb 09, 2004 12:00 am
What economic resource is there in Chechnya that the Russians would want? Or is it simply a matter of stopping other regions from attempted breakaways?
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Post Mon Feb 09, 2004 12:04 am
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They havn't lost 10,000 men...yet...but they still have lost a hell of a lot.


Maybe not 10,000 dead, but if you include those crippled and unable to fight, I'm sure the number is somewhere up there.

Quote:
And the Chechens aren't half trained terrorists...they'r highly trained and experienced former Red Army soldiers...thats why they know how to fight so well.


...but how many of them are Red Army soldiers? By now, they must have at least half their number made up of zealous 20-year-olds that have no idea what they're doing.

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The solution...pull out of Chechnya.


and let them secede? Isn't that what they are trying to do? If you let Chechnya go, others might try it too.
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Post Mon Feb 09, 2004 12:05 am
There is a MAJOR Caspian Sea oil pipeline going right through Grozny...

Thats partially the reason why Shevarnadze was overthrown in Georgia or why the US likes to get involved...and why Russia likes to get involved.
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Post Tue Feb 10, 2004 5:41 am
Kavkaz is VERY rich in different ores, and it is known that the Caspian bases hold the biggest oil resources yet discovered. So, who rules the Caspian sea, he rules the world in a few decades.
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they reatined the Slav language and culture.



They HAVE lost MORE than 10 000 people, but the official numbers are never correct.

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If you let Chechnya go, others might try it too.


And not just that, Putin will lose the elections coming. That will be a defeat for the Russian people and they will never allow it.
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Post Tue Feb 10, 2004 10:32 pm
I think Russia's afraid of letting Chechnia go because they allowed the Soviet Union to shatter like glass. (Which was consitutional) But now Russia is afraid that if they just sit back and let one of their 'sub' republics go, the whole country may try to break apart. Now that would be something, first the USSR and then Russia. Russia is desperately trying to hold the country together afther the collapse of the Soviet Union. Right now Russia essentially termites holding hands if it were a house or bridge.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 1:09 am
Al Khabir wrote:
What economic resource is there in Chechnya that the Russians would want? Or is it simply a matter of stopping other regions from attempted breakaways?

Chechens were given a chance to be an indepndent republic, but they failed miserably... Attacking another republic and genocide and slaughter of russians was one of the reasons for the second war. As for oil, the pipline was closed down and nowadays it goes through another republic.

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And the Chechens aren't half trained terrorists...they'r highly trained and experienced former Red Army soldiers...thats why they know how to fight so well.

Not anymore. After 10 years of fighting most of them either dead or wounded. As for why they are so succesful is that they grow up knowing nothing but the war and are from childhood taught to fight. Also they know the mounts as their five fingers.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 1:22 am
The big bad evil Chechens


You guys should keep on bombing them into submission... after all, they're Muslim, so what's the problem?


... and if anyone didn't catch the sarcasm in that, you're in serious need of some psychiatric attention.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 1:28 am
naked_turk wrote:
The big bad evil Chechens


You guys should keep on bombing them into submission... after all, they're Muslim, so what's the problem?


... and if anyone didn't catch the sarcasm in that, you're in serious need of some psychiatric attention.

Hey Im not racist Im just stating the fact that chechens did some serious russian genocide.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 1:48 am
That wasn't directed specifically at you...
"Person" should take note.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:29 am
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Hey Im not racist Im just stating the fact that chechens did some serious russian genocide.


As opposed to the Russians...
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:42 am
Tovarish Spetsnaz wrote:
Quote:
Hey Im not racist Im just stating the fact that chechens did some serious russian genocide.


As opposed to the Russians...

Russians did some genocide too. Im not justifiying anyone.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:58 am
What genocides? There ain't no genocide. That's the war between the russiand and chechens...Buiseness as usual.

Tovarish wrote:
And the Chechens aren't half trained terrorists...they'r highly trained and experienced former Red Army soldiers...thats why they know how to fight so well.
wow....Calling the red army "highly trained" is really having some low expectations from one's armed forces
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 4:39 am
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You guys should keep on bombing them into submission... after all, they're Muslim, so what's the problem?


I don't care that they are Muslim, that isn't the problem. The problem is that they are trying to steal a large area of land from Russia, and are blowing up bombs in Moscow while they're at it.

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wow....Calling the red army "highly trained" is really having some low expectations from one's armed forces


at least it gives us an excuse for all the casulties and lack of real progress.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:40 am
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I don't care that they are Muslim, that isn't the problem. The problem is that they are trying to steal a large area of land from Russia, and are blowing up bombs in Moscow while they're at it.
They're not trying to steal anything from Russia... Imperialist Russia took over that land a long time ago -- now the Chechens want it back.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 7:32 am
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They're not trying to steal anything from Russia... Imperialist Russia took over that land a long time ago -- now the Chechens want it back.


So every time someone says that their land was invaded centuries ago, they can have it back?

What about the Native Americans, shouldn't they get the entire continent back?
The Incas, Mayas, and Aztecs all were beat up by the European conquerors. Should anyone with European blood in them get out of Central/South America?
Didn't the Normans take over England in 1066? Should everyone with a trace of Norman blood be thrown out and England handed over to the about zero pure Anglo-Saxons that exist today?
and the same applies to every single piece of land on the earth - somebody invaded and took it over.

Additionally, after something's been colonized (or annexed), it isn't necessarily good for it to get freedom.
Look at the European colonies in Africa. It was probably horrible to live there while they were occupied, but I doubt that after WWI, when the colonial powers left, things got any better.


Of course, if I was president of Russia, I would do things a bit differently. People are easier to deal with when they aren't living through a decade of fighting. Therefore, the war does need to stop, but the region should not be allowed to secede. Then, I'd surround the region with troops (as a security measure against terrorism), and give them five years to govern themselves completly. Everything will fall apart, and they'll be begging to be let back.

(and if they aren't, then a full economic embargo should do the trick)
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 3:42 pm
Person wrote:
So every time someone says that their land was invaded centuries ago, they can have it back?

What about the Native Americans, shouldn't they get the entire continent back?


The Chechens living in Chechnya (not those in Sweden etc.) constitute a nation, whereas Native Americans don't constitute a nation in any area of USA. And to me it seems that the Chechens not only are a nation, but they want national self-determination, probably even indepence.
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Post Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:53 pm
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The Chechens living in Chechnya (not those in Sweden etc.) constitute a nation, whereas Native Americans don't constitute a nation in any area of USA. And to me it seems that the Chechens not only are a nation, but they want national self-determination, probably even indepence.


Sure, they don't now, but they did. Remember the Iroqois confederacy that fought the British troops? Sure, the "nation" was unlike anything European, but they were still organized, had land, and were sovereign until they were taken over. Chechnya is no different.
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