[late]

Why should someone be criminally punished for killing something that has no legal rights?

We ALL know such a person is not only being punished for the assault on the woman's body. If that were the case, the punishment would be a lot less.

How big of a deal is it to slip a woman a pill that causes her uterus to empty out when she's NOT pregnant?
(It's pretty much just like her monthly period but a bit more severe)

Your framing of this situation is still artificial, bizarre and moronic.

[ckaihatsu]

Another budding right-wing criminologist, along with UM.


= /

[XogGyux]

Hey, I'm just pointing out the double standards and inconsistencies.

It seems like no one cares when a man gets a 7 year prison sentence because he slipped a woman an abortion pill early into her pregnancy.

Do you think that is ridiculous too? Will there be any backlash to fight against this??

Slipping a pill to someone is bad on its own, regardless of whether it causes abortion or not. Causing an abortion is not murder or manslaughter, I already explaind this to you. Punishments can and should occur in proportion to the damages, emotional distress, etc. But considering a fetus a person with all rights from the moment of conception opens the doors to a whole bunch of nasty consequences that society cannot endure.
How many vagina examinations are you going to enforce as a "crime scene investigation" for every miscarriage... remember half of all pregnancies end up in miscarriages SPONTANEOUSLY without the help of any doctor. In fact mothers-to-be are often very distressed at this and require a lot of counseling to understand that this is normal.
Are you also going to send mothers to prison for manslaughter because they did not consume enough folic acid or because they consumed alcohol and lead to the miscarriage of a fetus?
This is stupid.

[MistyTiger]

Why should someone be criminally punished for killing something that has no legal rights?

We ALL know such a person is not only being punished for the assault on the woman's body. If that were the case, the punishment would be a lot less.

How big of a deal is it to slip a woman a pill that causes her uterus to empty out when she's NOT pregnant?
(It's pretty much just like her monthly period but a bit more severe)

What in the world or how the hell do you get these kinds of questions?

Slipping a pill to a woman OR man is illegal and immoral. It goes hand in hand with nonconsent and intention to harm without the person's knowledge. It is twisted and very wrong. How can anyone frame a question in such a cavalier and inconsiderate manner? Have you no respect for a woman's body? It does not appear so. A bit more severe? That is an understatement. Do you know that pills can have adverse effects and could lead to death if the person has underlying conditions that drugmakers have not considered or tested for? The way pills interact with the body's internal chemistry are very complex and mystifying. Scientists even do not fully understand it. It is mind boggling how complex human bodies are.

Bringing in the assault concept is a red herring in my opinion. If you want to argue, please try to stick to the topic and stop bringing in lesser concepts. You cannot compare apples to oranges. Oh good grief. Schools do not teach argumentation skills and they really should.

[Pants-of-dog]

You know it's really interesting, because every time I've tried to address or argue those points, it seems pro-choicers always try to revert the argument away to "Well, it doesn't matter because it isn't a baby".
It's impossible to ever pen them down on any one specific argument. They seem to just shift the argument away to something else when they get cornered.

It's sort of the tactic of just throwing as many different arguments as they can in one single discussion and hoping at least one of them will stick. They never seem to want to or be willing to focus on just one argument in any discussion.

Sure.

Now, when we imagine that the fetus has the same rights as born people, we see that abortion should still be allowed at any stage of pregnancy.

This is because we do not allow born people (with the full set of rights that goes with that) to use another person’s body without their consent, even for the rational and understandable motive of stating alive.

[Puffer Fish]

A miscarriage doesn't just harm the fetus. It can actually kill the woman, depending on the situation.

I believe this is a very disingenuous argument. The chances of an abortion pill causing death are very low.
Even more so when compared to the alternative of giving birth.

Usually a miscarriage can pose risk of medical problems to the woman when the fetus does not come out. An abortion pill pretty much causes the fetus to come out and that is what causes the miscarriage.

Many abortion supporting states in the U.S. have made abortion pills available without a prescription. So that seems to imply abortion supporters do not think they are too medically dangerous to the woman.

[Pants-of-dog]

@Puffer Fish

I find it interesting that you have put yourself in the position of defending men who force women to abort.

It seems like you will defend both sides of the abortion debate, as long as you refuse to give the pregnant person control of their own body.

[Puffer Fish]

Slipping a pill to someone is bad on its own, regardless of whether it causes abortion or not.

Slipping a pill to a woman OR man is illegal and immoral. It goes hand in hand with nonconsent and intention to harm without the person's knowledge. It is twisted and very wrong.

This is a totally disingenuous argument and both of you know it.
How much punishment does someone get when they slip a person an aspirin without their knowledge?

[Fasces]

Not all homicide is murder, @Puffer Fish.

You claim to be pro-life, but undoubtedly are fine with soldiers or police killing innocents or enemies?

[MistyTiger]

This is a totally disingenuous argument and both of you know it.
How much punishment does someone get when they slip a person an aspirin without their knowledge?

What? How is it an insincere or not candid argument?

It does not matter about amount of punishment given for slipping an aspirin into someone's drink or food. It is still wrong. A person could have an adverse reaction to the pill if say it gets mixed in with alcohol. It could cause internal bleeding in the stomach or intestines or worsen a person's ulcers (if they have those). There are consequences for every action. It is wrong to hurt someone. It is best to ask a person if they want an aspirin. If they do not, then do not force it on them. Do you like being forcefed?

[late]

Your framing of this situation is still artificial, bizarre and moronic.

Indeed.

[ckaihatsu]

Also, it's *cheapskate*. *Xanax*, at least.


x D