New Zealand opposes Anglo American anti-Chinese crusade - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Political issues in the People's Republic of China.

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#15169108
Pants-of-dog wrote:Why dod China become the big bad enemy recently?

A year ago, no one was discussing China, now we have a whole series of threads about China.

Has something happened?



Short answer: You haven't been paying attention all these years.

Longer Answer:
I would say it started kicking up during the Obama admin, but really got ramped up during Trump (obviously his racist rhetoric wasn't good, but it did kick up the issue more into the spot light). I clearly remember 15-ish years ago all sorts of experts warning about China (and calling out Huawei in particular). Especially around the tech field with all the IP theft and what not. As well as the tech getting funneled into military and government control applications. As well as the exploitation of the general openness of western research institutions. The CCP has mostly taken advantage of all of this and bided their time as well. One of the previous CCP leaders said something to the effect of "Let's get rich first, then we take over". Which was a smart move on their part. That said, more recently they have started ramping their aggression, they have stopped biding their time. I've made the argument that they have shown their cards too soon, but that's good for us. The world is seeing what they are doing, and no amount of propaganda is going to help gloss over it. This is another reason this is more prominent now. They have started making more moves now than ever before. CCP has been walking a really high tightrope. Thus far, they have done it very very well. However, eventually (hopefully) they will fall off the tight rope. They will have some hard decisions to make about their government and their role in the world. Especially if they become the new boogeyman. Their current path is unsustainable in my opinion.

This is not something recent, it's only recently hit the mainstream news and consciousness, but it was always bubbling. People understood this problem very well 20 years ago (even going back to 1989 which was a critical seismic shift where the CCP committed to its current path). I think people did a wait and see approach because the hope was that as China's economy become stronger, they would integrate more into the global capitalist system and loosen up, much like what happened to Vietnam. However, that never happened.

Capitalism, does not solve all. That is the critical fallacy the west believes. However, that's for another thread.
#15169113
@Rancid

Thanks, but that does not really answer my question. I remember in the early 90s thinking that China was setting itself up to win an economic war against the US, and I see how that this is coming a lot closer now, but that does not explain why everyone is now treating China like a big bad pariah.

Especially because China does not seem to be doing anything that western countries do not also do. Western countries also steal tech and IP, and commit human rights abuses against ethnic minorities. So, is it just because China is now a realistic contender for “most powerful country in the world”?
#15169114
Pants-of-dog wrote:@Rancid

Thanks, but that does not really answer my question.


I would like you to answer my question, thanks.

It begs the question, why have you never spoken of the plight of the Uyghurs, the sterilization of their women going on since 2015 with figures in the hundreds of thousands sterilised per year amidst a population of 12 million people.

I thought you stood for the human rights of people.
#15169217
Unthinking Majority wrote:That's not how it works. Australia isn't a colony because it is 100% legally independent of the UK. Australians don't take orders from the Queen of Austrailia, nor are they British subjects anymore legally.

China is far more imperialistic towards Hong Kong, Australia, or New Zealand that the British Crown is. I hope you enjoy your Hong Kong citizenship, you'll be slaves to the totalitarian CCP fascists soon enough. They're your new master now.


A person who owed allegiance to the Crown is a ‘subject of the Crown’ and a ‘British Subject’ throughout the Commonwealth. By this reasoning, a person, whether born in the UK or Australia, would have been a natural born subject of the Crown.
The Australian Constitution makes reference to the 'subject of the Queen'. Australia remains a dominion of the British Empire (new name Commonwealth) and the terms 'British Subjects' and 'subjects of the Queen' are essentially synonymous in Australia. In fact, Australian falsely called "citizens" are actually British Subjects or "'subject of her Majesty".
Australian Constitution, ss 34(ii), 117.

In china in accordance with Chinese constitution live CITIZENS not ROYAL SUBJECTS .

Australia has a foreign monarch as a head of state. This head of state is not democratically elected but with absolute power ("Above the law")
Australia is a monarchy, which means the British Queen is the head of state who, as undemocratic ruler (dictator), has ruled Australia for 60 years. According to the royal family's website, when the Queen visits Australia, she speaks and acts as Queen of Australia.
Queen also has constitutional power to, any time, dismiss democratically elected Australian parliament and it's prime minister which happened in 1975 when she sacked democratically elected Prime minister Gough Whitlaim.
It is impossible that the Chinese (or French etc) head of state is a British or any foreign leader.
It is inconceivable that a sovereign country has a foreign monarch as its ruler.
This can only happen if the country is either under occupation or a foreign colony.
So de jure and de facto Australia is a British colony or at best a British dominion and by no means a sovereign country.

China does not have a foreign leader and by all means is a sovereign country.
#15169226
Rancid wrote::lol:

Recall, that you are not allowed to go searching for information that hasn't been approved by your government. The rest of us have that freedom. That alone explains what is wrong with the CCP.

My advice to you is that you are better off spreading your propaganda in places like facebook, instagram, twitter, youtube. Those sites have a far larger reach than here. It would likely be more effective given that the average intelligence on those sites is lower than here. There's also a very small number of people here anyway, so it's likely a waste of CCP resources to try and manipulate this site.

Ask the people that sent you about things like Tienanmen square student protests of 1989. Suppression of freedom (which is why Hong Kong is trying to resist the CCP), aggression in the south china seas, the Uighurs of Xinjian, Debt trap diplomacy in Africa and Latin America. Manipulation and meddling of the governments of Sirlanka and the Maldives. Ethono-racist-nationalism in general. The 9-dash line. Continued aggression of Taiwan and others around Southeast Asia, One party state authoritarianism. The list goes on. Just a start. By the way, Taiwan is an independent nation contrary to what you have been told. IT doesn't matter if you draw Taiwan as the same color as China on a map/globe.

Ultimately, the actions of the CCP/Government cannot be glossed over with those propaganda speeches your leaders give to the world talking about uniting the world in a new direction or whatever. The CCPs actions clearly state their goal is to make the world safe for authoritarian strongmen and autocrats. This is not something the rest of the world wants. Look at who CCP friends are. North Korea, Russia, Iran... all gutter governments.

Just look at the nonsense you are posting in this thread. I think it's hilarious that you claiming the Maori are Chinese because of some genetic history or some shit. The CCP is always trying to lay claim to fucking everything. Perhaps it's time for Africa to lay claim to China as the human race traces itself to Africa first and foremost. ;)

This kind of bullshit only works within the borders of China. It's not going to work across the rest of the world where there is more freedom. The CCP simply will not be able to control information outside of its orders like it does within its borders.

The whole thing is a paradox for the CCP. They want to lead the world under their vision and stewwardship, but the world will not follow them unless they uphold basic principles of human rights. Like freedom of expression, freedom of access to information, etc. etc. Yet, their methods are to do the exact opposite; that is, control and manipulate. If they are not willing to change from such coercive strategies, then they will never be able to actually lead. Instead, they will simply dominate. Which would be detrimental to people's freedoms across the planet. Once the economic gravy train slows for China, they will have problems if they continue down this path. Especially domestically.


Typical of a person with a Disneyland culture who has been brainwashed by a false democracy in a two-party cartel system.
I think it would be better to stick to sugary coke, Big Mac and Hollywood crap than to try to give hypocritical lectures to others.


The Anglo American Alliance has difficulty applying to China their favorite method of divide and conquer as for example they did in former Yugoslavia, Libya, Ukraine and so on.
After all we can say that all these attempts did not go according to their plan so far in case of China.
The fact is that Han ethnicity makes up over 92% of the Chinese population in mainland China and 97% in Taiwan.
Also both the Muslim (Uyghur) and Tibet’s population makes up to 1%.
Many still remember the 1989 Tiananmen Square protest where the CIA unsuccessfully tried to provoke a split in China on the ideological basis in the name of "democracy and freedom".
Using Tibet and Uyghur Muslim population to destabilize China on religious and ethnic grounds also has not brought the satisfactory results.
However the last attempt to organize long lasting protests in Hong Kong was the most ambitious and comprehensive.
The idea was first to divide Chinese society on an ideological basis, using familiar rhetoric about freedom and democracy and then to apply the Balkan’s model taking into account the special status of Hong Kong as well as to include other Cantonese-speaking regions.
However, this plan also failed miserably because it has not met with a positive response in Macau, Guangzhou or Shenzhen.
It seems that the Anglo-American coalition must apply some more creative methods, perhaps something like a new modified opium war, in order to destabilize China.
Last edited by Russianbear on 26 Apr 2021 05:55, edited 1 time in total.

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