Trump calls it like it is; the establishment can't take it - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14578597
Donald Trump has made quite a splash! I'm so glad he's in the race. He has the potential to fuck things up for the establishment Republicans in a big way. That really puts a smile on my face.

Donald Trump doubles down on Mexico 'rapists' comments despite outrage
The businessman and would-be president, who launched his presidential campaign with an attack on Mexican immigrants as drug dealers, criminals and rapists, has claimed that there is “mind-boggling” link between rape and illegal immigration.

“If you look at the statistics of people coming, you look at the statistics on rape, on crime, on everything coming in illegally into this country it’s mind-boggling!” he said in an interview with CNN on Wednesday night.

Trump, who has already sparked a minor diplomatic incident and lost business deals with five companies over his remarks about Mexicans, claimed that statistics show that Latino immigrants are more likely to perpetrate rape than the wider population. However, the Fusion article he referred to said 80% of women crossing the Mexican border are raped along the way, often by criminal gangs, traffickers or corrupt officials.

When CNN host Don Lemon pointed out that Trump had misread the article, the former Apprentice host said: “Well, somebody’s doing the raping, Don! I mean somebody’s doing it! Who’s doing the raping? Who’s doing the raping?”

This is just great! He's just ripping the whole RNC milquetoast bullshitter cabal apart. Absolutely wonderful! What's even more interesting is all the traditional propaganda tricks aren't working. Trump misread it, so he must be dumb--the dumb self-made billionaire.They've already done the, "Hispanic leaders call for GOP to distance themselves from Trump" routine, but what it's doing is pushing Bush, Rubio, and even Mitt Romney (who for some reason feels compelled to interject) on the side of illegal immigration (nobody bought Romney's self-deportation bullshit either). Here's a brilliant example of how yesterday's propaganda tricks aren't working.

GOP is not slamming Donald Trump's views fast enough: Latino advocates
This is absolutely hilarious. Trump is saying what Americans want to hear and the media and political apparatus are apoplectic that people are responding to Trump.

The billionaire candidate sent the debate over border control into overdrive — and cost himself business deals — by saying Mexico exports “rapists” and drug dealers to the U.S.

However, the problem for the establishment is that it is true.
Accused San Francisco Pier Shooter Should Have Been Deported: Immigration Officials
Feds releasing hundreds of illegal immigrant rapists, murderers: report
121 Illegal Aliens Avoid Deportation, Now Charged With Murder
Two-time illegal immigrant charged with rape in Philly’s sanctuary city

As usual, the fullest no-spin coverage on what Trump said comes from... Rush Limbaugh? Yep. Believe it or not, Limbaugh highlights the relevant point.

Trump Stands Up to Cowardice
But the hilarious part of it is the "Businesses are cancelling their contracts with Trump" isn't stopping Trump a bit, which means he's ready to kick the political correctness cabal right in the crotch. It's absolutely epic.

Donald Trump wrote:That’s the problem with our country, everybody folds under pressure. Instead of doing the right thing, they just immediately, they have two people go outside with a sign and you see two pickets and they immediately say on gee we have to do, this is pressure, pressure. People can’t handle pressure. That’s what they did. They did a total fold but that’s okay with me, its okay with me. Let them do what they want to do.

He's absolutely right, too. That's a huge problem for the establishment. Their little tricks aren't working anymore. If anything, Trump is showing America that the establishment Republicans fold under pressure. Brilliant.
#14578607
He's absolutely right, too. That's a huge problem for the establishment. Their little tricks aren't working anymore. If anything, Trump is showing America that the establishment Republicans fold under pressure. Brilliant.


You now it is a miracle. I agree with just about everything you said. Bush folded to the "sanctuary city" movement early on.

All of these cowards trying to slam Trump for not being PC. He is a royal pain the ass for them. Just about the time the Republicans get all moist about the fact that their front-runner can speak Spanish, along comes a republican who is tough on illegal entry (we are not talking about immigrants here, these folks are just trespassing).

I love to see the party in disarray. They got on a conservative testosterone trip a few years back and are just now getting off. Will they will the presidency in 2016. Probably not. They are running a slate of clowns. Only one serious candidate among the bunch.

By the way. Scott Walker is about to pee in the pool also.

As for Trump himself? I could make him a serious candidate if he paid me enough. But just like the majority of the one-percenters he is to arrogant to listen.
#14578609
One knock of Mr. Trump that will surface sooner or later is his hair. I wish to put an end to such comments.

Mr. Trump has claimed that his hair is his own. He's absolutely right. Got that? It's his own hair.

How do I know?

I saw him buy it, that's how.
#14578619
I'm not surprised to see blackjack likes Trump now - apparently Stormfront and their ilk likes him now as well (or at least more than the other candidates). I'll give him credit for tapping into certain stream of right wing thought that the Republican party has been keen to abandon lately, and I do agree he has more backbone then your typical politician. I agree with him on border security issues, US politicians being idiots, some of his points about trade relations and a couple other issues. That coupled with his dynamic personality and celebrity status makes it easy to see how he is now gaining a fair amount of support. That doesn't really surprise, though I am somewhat surprised that it would be Trump that would tap into discontent over those issues.

That said, Trump basically represents himself and I would consider a trump presidency to be plutocracy taken to its next level, with a lot of other seedy things going on. Anybody remember Hill Valley in Back to the Future 2, the alternate timeline where Biff takes over the town? That's kind of how I picture America under Donald Trump. Interestingly rich Biff in that movie was based off of Trump from the 1980s. I think Trump will have more staying power in the primaries than some commentators are giving him credit for and I suspect him to dominate may of the also-rans - but I don't think he'll beat Jeb Bush for the nomination. In the mean time I'm sure he'll give the media plenty of material to work with though. He's basically a quote goldmine for them. I liked it when he said he thinks he'll have a "great relationship with Putin...based on a feeling." Interestingly I think he probably would get along well Putin on a personal level, because of their personalities and personal influence they command (similar to the way Putin got on with Berlusconi) - but it doesn't say much about his ability when it comes to geopolitics. I did like his comments about "finding the next Patton or MacArthur" to go after ISIS, though.

That said he's an egoist first and foremost (then again so are most politicians and a lot of people in general) and while I don't doubt he's frustrated with the current crop of American politicians and "leaders" I'm not convinced at all that he would be substantively better. Personally I like Sanders over any of the other candidates at this point, but I think I might consider Trump to be better than a continuation of the Clinton/Bush dynasties if it really came down to it - because fuck that. At least Trump is interesting.
#14578624
Bernie Sanders seems like the most SANE Republican.
Bernie Sanders is a self-proclaimed socialist (really social democrat) running in the Democratic primary...
#14578762
Torus34 wrote:A most interesting alternate take on Mr. Donald Trump making himself un-electable.

Believe me, I don't think Trump is necessarily even ready to be president. My point is that he sees at least two of the major problems hurting the country: illegal immigration, and 90M Americans out of work. This isn't 1992 with Ross Perot warning about a "giant sucking sound." That has already happened. There were a lot of economic gains for America as a nation, but there have been major economic dislocations too. In 1992, the internet was not part of the US economy, but today it is. The internet means that you can not only outsource manufacturing, you can outsource service businesses too. Having someone with a sub-continent accent asking you about your security credentials to discuss your banking details was utterly unthinkable 20 years ago. Yet, today it is commonplace. An unemployed American who used to work in customer service is also commonplace.

Populism isn't a bandwagon. 90M people out of work isn't a niche group.

Godstud wrote:Trump represents the most unlikeable portion of the 1%, and the worst whackjobs in the Republican far right.

That is why it is hysterical that he's gaining traction. Republicans cast into turmoil as Donald Trump rides the populist surge. See, as the media works with Latino groups and other billionaires, etc. to cost Trump money, he actually morphs into the most legitimate candidate other than Bernie Sanders, because he's the only other candidate with any potential who is not beholden to the establishment. In my opinion, we're are at the last stop before civil war or revolution breaks out in the United States. I think it will be a revolution, and directed at the upper class. The upper class has been successful in the past playing the middle class off against the poor, and playing the poor off against the middle class. It has not been able to fuck over both simultaneously without things like the French Revolution, where it gets bloody primarily for the upper class.

“Donald Trump is like watching a roadside accident,” Ari Fleischer, a former spokesman for George W Bush, told Politico. “Everybody pulls over to see the mess. And Trump thinks that’s entertainment. But running for president is serious. And the risk for the party is that he tarnishes everybody.”

Except that the roadside accident isn't Donald Trump. It's the establisment. What will they do in the Middle East? Silence. What will they do about ObamaCare? Silence? How do they plan to get 90M people out of work into the workforce? Silence. What will they do to secure the border and push illegal aliens out of the country? Silence. What will they do to prevent billionaires from costing the American middle and working classes even more jobs? Silence. Sliming people. Ostracizing people. Circling the wagons with the Democrats, etc. will not work when people look at their checking account balances and cash flow.

“There’s a danger that Trump will crowd out our message with his antics,” a senior Romney financial donor who is considering his 2016 options said.

Same problem. People have a message and coalesce into parties. Parties don't have a message and then go coalesce people. That doensn't work if the people disagree with you. That's why the Republicans have lost every time they've run an establishment candidate going back to Gerald Ford. George H.W. Bush ran as a conservative, but didn't govern as one. George W. Bush ran as a conservative and had a war and John Kerry as an opponent, which is the only reason he won again in 2004.

“Mexico is sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with them,” he said. “They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists.” And then he added as an afterthought: “And some, I assume, are good people.”

This is hilarious, because it is true. He's just amplified the parts he likes and discounts the parts he doesn't care about. So you can't really call him a liar or a racist and make it stick easily. However, they aren't charging him with poor taste, which is certainly their best shot. They should have sent the fashion police after him, but they sent the worst of the political correctness cabal after him. The companies who trash their Trump relationship could see economic harm from it too, but that remains to be seen.

Jeb Bush, whose wife is Mexican and who delivered his declaration speech in English and Spanish and supports creating a path for legalising the status of undocumented immigrants, said: “His remarks do not represent the values of the Republican party and they do not represent my values.”

Except that they do... They represent the values of a portion of the Republican electorate big enough to ensure that Jeb Bush does not become president by way of a majority vote of the American people.

But he defended his stance and said he had become a “whipping post” for speaking up on immigration and crime.The lone fellow candidate to speak up for Mr Trump was Ted Cruz, the Texas senator whose father is Cuban, saying he “speaks the truth”.

See? This is an interesting dynamic. Cruz can survive this and claim the Trump base if Trump self destructs. Cruz is Hispanic himself so none of the "you're a racist" from Bush will stick to Cruz. Cruz can also divide the Florida vote of Rubio missteps on Cuba and backs Obama on restoring diplomatic relations. The Republican race has finally gotten interesting.

The Trump candidacy is playing up strains between Tea Party activists and senior party figures, with Mr Fleischer adding that his comments were irresponsible and “hurtful”.

Yea, because 90M people out of work isn't hurting anybody... sticks and stones Ari?

Red_Army wrote:How does inheriting your father's real estate empire qualify as "self made"?

Trump obviously learned the ropes from his father, but gained notoriety for things like Penn Central and the old Commodore Hotel. By having an option to buy the land for the old Penn Central rail yard, he made a lot of money for himself. There's no question he probably wouldn't have gone anywhere without his father's efforts, but this is not like Jack Kennedy inheriting the presidency. Trump has been through many economic cycles, and so he has a lot more business experience than anyone else in the race for Republicans. Trump has written checks larger than any of the personal fortunes of anyone else in the race.

Varax wrote:That doesn't really surprise, though I am somewhat surprised that it would be Trump that would tap into discontent over those issues.

This is because Trump doesn't need the establishment dollars to stay in the race, whereas most of the others do. You can't import and export real estate.

Red_Army wrote:Thank god I'm non-partisan, so I'll be voting for Trump in the Republican primary and Sanders in the Democratic one!

Well, I'm from California. We did elect Arnold Schwarzenegger governor, so it's not completely out of the question. However, primary voting I'd have to take a stab at the commie too, just to make life interesting.
#14579220
Let's be serious here : There's no way that Trump will beat Jeb.

The guy will probably run independent, soaking up votes from social conservatives and working class Republicans that diverge from the views of establishment Republicans. In other words, get ready for Hillary.
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