Rancid wrote:To a farmer, maybe, but not to everyone else. The idea that "all tariffs are bad" simply isn't true. There are always winners and losers when tariffs are levied (the company I work for is getting helped out by the tariffs for example). The funny thing about America is that, I remember a time in the 90s where leftists were against globalization and free trade. Now we have a president that is placing what is arguably anti-free trade policies in place, and these same people don't like it. Of course, it's because this is about politics, and not principles. This is one rare area where I side with TRumpsters.
Just re-reading the thread a bit. Indeed, one of the vocal critics against free trade with China was Nancy Pelosi. Pelosi on China: A voice in the global wilderness?
Pelosi has emerged as a leading critic of the Chinese regime and of her own president (me: Bill Clinton), who she says has a bankrupt policy toward China.
Tainari88 wrote: And the ones who are greedy and control freaks can't trust people whom they see as the 'rabble' with running their own lives and working with some control. They can't do it. Just as the ones who loved slavery kept saying that without slavery as an institution the world can't cope. Yes it did. And this is another form of ineffective way of dealing with humanity and human labor. It has to change Relampaguito. It has an expiration date.
It is changing, but probably in ways you didn't expect. For example, Boris Johnson's victory. Noemon was saying before he stood for PM that he didn't think Johnson would even campaign for PM, because it would be a political loser. Six months on now it's a very different picture. Even Tony Blair's seat went to the Tories in a strongly Labour seat. People have had it with the establishment.
Tainari88 wrote:So what is good for you and the rich is going to work for the majority? It won't.
Free trade is good for me. Immigration not so much, as it is used to depress wages. Yet, I understand exactly how the blue collar working class folks feel.
Tainari88 wrote:Again, you suffer from lack of empathy in a big way BJ.
Well, it's just that my empathy isn't distributed according to your ideals. I feel for the Pittsburgh, PA steelworker. I'm not as interested in the Mexican migrant looking to break US immigration law and take a job from an American worker.
Tainari88 wrote:If intelligence is not coupled with heart and empathetic policies that are the best road for the vast majority of humanity?
We live in a world of nation states, not in a "global village" or with a global government.
Tainari88 wrote:I don't think capitalism is worth the many millions of lives it has cost the world. Out of sheer callous exploitation, pollution of the environment, greed and not caring about others who are not from your country or from your bank account status. For me? You are asking for species extinction....begging the world to make you extinct with that mentality for sure.
This is absurd. Capitalism coupled with Christianity has effectively saved BILLIONS of lives. It is practically the reason for "overpopulation." Life expectancy before Western science-based medicine was exported (often by Christians and Christian-based ethics and Christian-based charities) was horrid. It's precisely the spread of vaccination, medication, mosquito abatements, etc. that have saved so many people.
Tainari88 wrote:No, the human survival rate explosion was due to caring medical researchers and doctors like Dr. Silk and others who never intended to make huge profits from the discovery of Penicillin or other drugs that saved life or polio vaccines.
Well, Salk was a Jew, so my Christian point doesn't work there. However, he did his work at the University of Pittsburgh. Much of the funding for that school came from the steel industry--CAPITALISM!!! (gasp) More specifically, from the Mellon family. (gulp) Rich people. A.W. Mellon was a conservative Republican too! Prior art would have prevented Salk receiving a patent anyway. Mellon and Carnegie also founded the Carnegie-Mellon University.
Tainari88 wrote:Those type of individuals are the ones who don't believe medicine should primarily be about for profit.
Where did they get the money to do the research Azuquita? The likes of Mellon, Carnegie, etc. Very, very, obscenely rich capitalists whom you assume are just filled with greed and hatred for all mankind.
Tainari88 wrote:Those type of individuals are the ones who don't believe medicine should primarily be about for profit.
It was businessmen and bankers that bankrolled this type of research.
Tainari88 wrote:I shudder to think how you would treat people who could not afford medical care if you think it is ok to be a capitalist and waste millions in the process of what? Progress.
Salk needed a roof over his head, clothes on his back, food in his belly, and plenty of support for his research. So do other scientists. Almost all of the money in the United States for that type of research comes directly or indirectly from capitalism. In Salk's case, tons of money was coming from the Mellon family to the University of Pittsburg School of Medicine. Why do you have such disdain for the wealthy that you cannot even acknowledge them bankrolling the very university where Salk was doing his research?
Tainari88 wrote:Ay BJ, you disappoint me with your lack of corazon. It is consistent.
Polio affects rich people too. Most diseases do. They do not discriminate. Look at the endowments for many universities. It's very often the very rich who donate the money for them.
jimjam wrote:I do not recall BJ#21 or any other "capitalists" giving the slightest acknowledgement to predatory capitalism.
I work in open source software. I will not use Apple products at all, because I hate their non-standard "innovations" like lightening charger cords that piggyback on USB standards, but break them so that they only work with Apple products and fuck over their customers unnecessarily. Yet, Apple customers seem to like getting fucked over--almost prefer it. I find Apple's support service, "The Genius Bar", to be an insult to their customers. They are straight up crooks. Apple has enough cash on hand--CASH ON HAND--to buy the bottom 80% of the S&P500. Do you ever hear me lionizing Apple for that type of behavior? I would prevent them from selling anything to the US government until they use standard power cords. In fact, I would probably make laptop manufacturers adopt USB power or power-over-ethernet as the way to power laptops to stop all the fucking around people do with non-standard power systems. Yet, you know who likes Apple products the most? Leftists, artists, etc.
Rancid wrote:@Potemkin, if we have a population crash, wouldn't that destroy capitalism, given that capitalism is predicated on the need for constant (and unsustainable) growth?
Capitalism doesn't need constant growth. The current banking system and welfare state does, however. Capitalism won't go away, but the welfare state will. That's also part of hysteresis and why things could get shitty for the poor very quickly.
jimjam wrote:Trump’s tariff justifications have often been self-evidently absurd — seriously, who imagines that imports of Canadian steel threaten U.S. national security? But there’s no obvious way to stop him from imposing tariffs whenever he feels like it.
Tariffs are just taxes. It's easy to stop Trump from doing this at will--take the power away. It's Congress that has the authority to lay and collect taxes. Trump is just exercising the power that Congress gave to him, because they are too fucking lazy to do their own jobs.
Tainari88 wrote:Then I am dealing with sports, (baseball and swimming), music (guitar playing), and nature walks near the Mayan ruins with discussions about history.
Rick Beato has a pretty good channel on YouTube, and he has a pretty bulky PDF book mostly for guitar.
Tainari88 wrote:I also have a special tutor Edna, who hangs out with him an hour and a half a day and after homework, she teaches him social skills like etiquette, and how to talk to older people, how to treat others with respect, table manners, etc.
Yes, the British were very big on that. I have a very mixed set of messages. My grandparents were very proper, but my mother was a feminist.
Tainari88 wrote:People neglect very important basic skills like Home Economics and Social Etiquette.
How to cook is also very important. So many poor people in the United States will do things like buy frozen pizza with food stamps. You can buy 10 pounds of potatoes for $3. Rice is cheap too. Hell, just knowing how to cook with beans and rice you should never be hungry even if you are poor, unless you simply don't know how to cook. I'm pretty well off, but I'm still torn between eating out and cooking. I used to eat out all the time, but it has gotten rather expensive. I was lazy today and bought spaghetti and meatballs for lunch for $15. For $15 I could feed 10 people spaghetti and meatballs. It's easy to make a red sauce too--evoo, salt, red chili pepper, garlic, a shallot or onion, tomato sauce and diced tomatoes, some spices like basil, oregano or Italian seasoning. Basically, about $2 worth of ingredients for the meal--of course, you'd pay more for the spices you need on hand. Buy a premade sauce and it's like $5-7. We went to a steak restaurant the other night. It was about $80 with tip, and we drank water. For $100, I can buy a whole beef tenderloin at Costco and get about 10 filet mignons out of that.
Rancid wrote:Counterpoint, Jeff Bezo is an asshole, and lots of people love and revere him.
He is indeed. He's a great innovator, but a total douchebag. People do love people with lots of money. Steve Jobs was the same thing. Total asshole, but people loved him for his innovations and the money he had.
jimjam wrote:Republican tax and social policy does nothing but help the rich and powerful get richer and more powerful.
People ARE working hard, but wages haven't grown in decades.
Wages are growing under Trump.
jimjam wrote:Relative to the 1970's when A person could work ONE lower-echelon job and still afford rent, food and health care we are poor.
We didn't have NAFTA or GATT or trade with a Chinese communist slave state in the 1970s.
jimjam wrote:Trump’s trade antics have damaged America’s reputation.On one side, our allies have learned not to trust us. We have, after all, become the kind of country that suddenly slaps tariffs on Canada — Canada! — on obviously spurious claims that we’re protecting national security.
Canada dumps lumber, precludes us from exporting dairy to them, etc. NAFTA didn't address those problems. Steel and aluminium are a national security issue, and Trump is absolutely right to be addressing them as such.
jimjam wrote:Like the North Koreans, who flattered Trump but kept on building nukes.
You're blaming Trump for this? How about Clinton and Bush? They did nothing when NK got nukes. They kept giving them money. Why give a communist dictatorship money? Ever? Why trade with communist dictatorships?
jimjam wrote:Trump’s trade war didn’t achieve any of its goals
What were it's goals in your mind? China is howling. To maintain marketshare, they've cut prices and lost profitability. Their stock market dived, while ours is at all time highs.
jimjam wrote:Furthermore, because America spends relatively little money helping the poor, even harsh cuts — like the Trump administration’s new rules on food stamps, which will hurt hundreds of thousands — will at best save only tiny amounts compared with the cost of tax cuts. What Trump has brought to his party is a new willingness to be openly vicious.
Total garbage. Food stamps are not an unlimited spending budget. Obama did things like allow people to buy Red Bull on food stamps. You don't need Red Bull. You don't even need frozen pizza. You should be able to buy cookbooks on food stamps. If you are poor and you've got enough time to cook, there is no reason to be hungry in the US. However, if the government is going to let lobbyists determine food stamp policy so that you can buy non-staple goods like Red Bull, etc., then they are making money at the expense of the poor and making a mockery out of the supposed "moral" obligation to help the poor. There is so much fraud in food stamps, it's incredible.
"We have put together the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics."
-- Joe Biden