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late wrote:The political side to this is that the steady drip of damning information will continue.
late wrote:Do you get everything wrong? No president has ever been removed, all anyone was shooting for was guilty.
Project much? It was fake because McConnell said it was fake, because they didn't want witnesses, because Republicans didn't want the evidence Trump is hiding. You can't have a trial without evidence or witnesses; and with a predetermined outcome. That is a miscarriage of justice.
This is just like a Jim Crow trial. Everyone knows the guy is guilty. Everyone knows he will be acquitted. And everyone knows he will do it again.
Indy wrote:In another thread, you lambasted the USA, saying how bad and corrupt it is because we use the electoral college.
If you believe it's so bad and destined for ruin, why do you vote here?
I believe it's because you don't really believe the nonsense that you post. I think you believe it IS a great country and one you want to be proud of. You just don't like your President, so you've decided that justifies the things you say.
Tainari88 wrote:I don't care what you believe Indy. I happen to think you are a man with little self control and you are a reincarnation of the other dude. Lol. Whatever. I look at patterns. Your pattern is that you joined in late January and went crazy posting in a short period of time. The way you respond, nitpick and get upset about me not being some Yankee Doodle Patriot all indicates you are the same person. If you are not? And continue with your pattern you will wind up in the same spot as the other guy did. It has to do with your internal problems. Not us in this forum. It has nothing to do with me.
I suggest you stop thinking you can fool people here. Most people here are into reading and follow patterns in their brain. Our writings reflect our own minds. You can't really change it unless you are a very good actor or a person who is good at changing styles. SolarCross was creative enough to change styles and he was bright too. I won't say what I think about you. You might be legit. But I doubt it.
You don't seem to understand international politics. I got straight A's in college in international politics. What does that mean? That you define your loyalties via a series of principles followed by your political party or affiliations. Not by your national boundaries. I happened to be born Puerto Rican. Not Mexican. Politically they are ruled by Washington DC. So through the USA system I got to change things. I can't do it through other nations unless I become a citizen of that other nation. Some nations have rules or compacts with other nations where they share dual citizenship. Canada shares that with the USA and so does Mexico because the three nations of North America do a lot of trade and it is advantageous to do so. Mostly international capitalists do that because it has advantages to have dual citizenship to boost revenues, and labor and other agreements. Mexico and the USA allow dual citizenship. I got done with the Mexican immigration office here on Wednesday the 29th. I am approved for a temporary visa. But since I am a native Spanish speaker and born in Puerto Rico and other factors? I can get Mexican citizenship in less than 2 and a half years. Then I can vote in the next presidential election in Mexico which would be in 2025. I can also keep voting indefinitely in Mexico from abroad in USA elections.
Why? Because according to the Supreme Court of the USA? You remain a USA citizen allowed to vote if you lived and registered to vote in a USA state. I have voted in every election in my state for decades. Consistently in every level. So? There is a legal precedent for that.
In terms of renouncing USA citizenship? A Puerto Rican has to go to big legal trial that is costly that is about in the end about $100k in costs and they give you Puerto Rican citizenship only, but the USA stated that if a Puerto Rican does that? They can't leave their neighborhood in Puerto Rico and can't travel outside of Puerto Rico and it is prohibited from any nation that is independent to recognize Puerto Rico as a legitimate nation. They do that to make sure the USA gov't doesn't lose control of the Puerto Rican government. If you actually understood international law Indy I might link a website for you to realize how complicated it gets trying to get rid of a statutory USA citizenship that is imposed by congress. The USA citizenship was imposed in 1917. The majority of Puerto Ricans in 1917 never wanted to be USA citizens. Plus the USA congress created a legal code making Puerto Ricans not protected by the USA constitution.
The problem resides with the shady shit dealings of your own nation's government. Not Puerto Rico's. But? Knowing how ignorant most Americans are about international law regarding their two faced, lying piece-of-shit system it doesn't surprise me.
Lol. The Department of the Interior rules all the limbo territories Indy. Guam, Solomon Islands, US Virgin Islands, American Samoa (that has the worst damn deal of us all), unfair, nightmarish and horrific. But you dont'know about it because you believe all that crap they brainwash people with in the USA.
Spain actually had a big of a row with the USA about Puerto Ricans seeking Spanish/EU citizenship and said to the USA, no, you can't force them to abide by rules they never agreed to...more legal shit.
But? No time to educate you anymore. You go on thinking I have loyalties to a government that is full of oppressive policies. I never did. You do though. Go on believing all their lies. I never did.
That is the difference between you and I. You got stuck with being processed like bologna and I did not.
Politics_Observer wrote:Basically, Republicans gave Trump a license to abuse power by acquitting him. Given that is the case, what is there to stop Trump from encouraging more foreign interference in our elections? What if Trump comes publicly on national TV and says "Russia or Ukraine, interfere in our election and get me elected again!?" Are Republicans now saying that the only way to remedy abuse of power by a President is to wait till he can be voted out? And what if Trump refuses to step down if he is not re-elected?
Harley wrote:That just won't happen. The rule of law prohibits it.
Also, I don't think you'll find too many Republicans who would support it. Trump would have absolutely no legal ground to stand on, simply because if he loses the election he's no longer President. My guess is that he would be forcibly removed from the White House if need be.
But nothing like that is going to happen.
I just don't see a lot of logic in the idea that Trump won't step down and will become a dictator. He would need people to support him and, even more importantly, a military. I don't think there would be nearly enough people in the military who would decide that having a dictator is a good idea.
Seriously, don't worry! It won't happen!
Crantag wrote:Trump will probably claim voter fraud and refuse to accept the election result.
Harley wrote:He would have to convince the armed forces that there was voter fraud.
Do you honestly think he could do that? I like to think our military is smarter than that.
Harley wrote:He would have to convince the armed forces that there was voter fraud.
Do you honestly think he could do that? I like to think our military is smarter than that.
Politics_Observer wrote:@Harley
If he got some corrupt generals who would be blindly loyal to him as he has done with others in the past to be his military leaders then the rest of the military will have no choice but to fall in line and obey orders or risk military court martial and dishonorable discharge.
Harley wrote:A friend of mine sent me this on Facebook. Regardless of where you stand on impeachment, this is funny:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zo_oiObCf5M
Crantag wrote:You you around in 2000? It is a partial guide to what a 'disputed election' would proceed.
Politics_Observer wrote:@Harley
I have done my time in uniform as well. Mutiny is a serious punishable offense. Not only that, those service members who rebel could be sentenced to prison and potentially face the death penalty and perhaps even branded as traitors. It is possible such orders from generals could be regarded as an unlawful order but that would be up to a military court to decide and with a corrupt generals in charge, they would be sure to influence any military court decision. What YOU might think is an unlawful order doesn't mean a military court will agree with you and refusing to obey a lawful order in the eyes of a military court handed down to you by your superiors can have serious consequences under the UCMJ.
There is no guarantee a military court is going to agree with your version of what an "unlawful order" is. If I was a service member and given orders to fire on unarmed civilians for example, I would refuse such an order given that it is an unlawful order. That doesn't necessarily guarantee that I won't pay a legal price for refusing to obey what I consider to be an unlawful order. The odds would be in my favor under the Obama Administration for example that a military court would rule in my favor in that specific hypothetical scenario. But with different administrations comes different generals and different interpretations and applications to military law.
Nor does it guarantee that every service member will just rise up in a mutiny against corrupt generals that Trump has put in charge, especially given the fact they could face the consequences under military law for doing so. When you are a military man, your job is to obey your officers appointed over you and your civilian political masters and failure to do so, even if you regard it as an unlawful order could get you court martial-ed and punished accordingly. No nation that maintains military forces can afford to have it otherwise.
Power is not a game and power given to the wrong hands can have devastating consequences.
Harley wrote:You're basically saying that a few corrupt generals and the President can usurp the Constitution. I'm saying that won't happen.
For a moment, let's assume generals did agree to go along with him. Colonels will not. Gunnery Sergeants will not. Petty Officers and airmen will not. Basically, the vast majority of our people in uniform will not go along with it and will fight it.
Military members swear an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. A declaration of a dictatorship would be an attack on our Constitution. Those who are true to their word would fight it to their last breath.
Politics_Observer wrote:@Harley
Don't be so sure of your morality until it has really been put to the test. You know, in Vietnam, our soldiers who were like you but were seeing some serious combat, after losing some of their fellow soldiers to booby traps, snipers and ambushes eventually went on a killing rampage of innocent civilians. And some German soldiers during World War II refused to go along with some of the war crimes being committed like the killing of civilians were promptly put up against the wall with those civilians and shot right along with them.
You don't know what you would do in this situation until you are really facing down the serious threat of some very real consequences coming your way if you refuse to obey the orders of your superiors. General George Washington also had his own soldiers shot for mutiny during some rough times when we were fighting the British. The military will strictly enforce discipline even if it our civilian leaders become dictators. And remember, dictators don't commonly call themselves dictators either and enjoy some support from the populace, at least initially they do.
Politics_Observer wrote:@Harley
I edited my post above and it's slightly different now than when you quoted it. My fears are well founded and I am familiar with how dictators in other countries have come to power. It's something I have seen before. Now, there is no guarantee that Trump will become dictator, but he is well on his way as it currently stands. The balance of power has undeniably also been changed in our constitution with Trump's sham aquittal. We no longer have co-equal branches of government now that the republicans have acquitted him and failed to check Trump. And even if Trump doesn't become dictator, you can be sure that a Bernie Sanders Presidency or some other future President will cite Trump's acquital and will use such expanded Presidential power. And such expanded Presidential power could enable somebody else besides Trump to become dictator if Trump himself doesn't become dictator.
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