American voters, you have been given fair warning, either you're MAGA or you're for democracy. - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Political issues and parties in the USA and Canada.

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#15196201
IMHO, Trump has made a fatal error. I was afraid that he would be smart enough to do a stealth campaign to stage his coups part 2 in 2024. Luckily for all true Americans he wasn't that smart.

What do I mean? I mean that the GOP has moved too soon to tell all of us what their plan is. They intend to steal the next election by having the state legislatures vote to send Electors to the Electoral College to vote for Trump. They intend to have election officials in place after the 2022 election to be inplace in 2024 to put their thumb on the scale of "fairness" to make sure only Repubs. win elections in their states.

However, we are seeing numerous reports about what the Repubs are doing. They didn't keep it a secret. They are doing it in plain sight. All you have to do is look and believe.

I expect all Dems to vote Progressive in the Primary and then vote Dem no matter who in the 2022 General election and also in all races at the state and local levels.
I expect all MAGA people to vote for Trump and every Repud they can vote for.

This means that the outcome of the 2022 elections and then the 2024 elections, depends totally on how the Independents, Unaffiliated, and Greens vote. Please people, just do the research for yourself and then do the right thing to save democracy in America and vote only for Dems in these critical elections. The fate of America and the world will be decided in these 2 elections.

All other considerations will have no bearing if the Repubs end democracy in the US.
All other policy disagreements have no meaning if the Repubs take over, as they clearly are planning to do.

This impacts the world because the US has the best military and many H-bombs. It effectics the world because the US still leads the world, and ACC is a crisis.

American voters, you have been given fair warning, either you're MAGA or you're for democracy. There is no middle ground.!




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#15197994
An extremely hard to sit through 11 min. video, because Thom lays out what is at stake in the 2022 and 2024 elections in stark gruesome detail.

I'm not kidding, here. We must elect a ton of Dems to state legislatures in 2022 to change the laws to not allow elections to be stolen.

We must not elect a Repud as Pres. in 2024, either.

We should elect a ton of Dems to Congress [House & Senate] in 2022 to change the laws to not allow elections to be stolen.

If you don't act on this warning, then don't blame me as you watch the Repuds and Trump wipeout democracy in the US and give police state powers to the minions of the oligarchs.



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#15199260
My suggestion of how to respond the the Rittenhouse verdict is to vote for Progressives in all Primaries and vote for Dems ( no matter who) in all General elections.
This is all elections; national, state, and local, even school boards.
This is every election from now until the Repud Party ceases to put up candidates.
The Repud Party seems like a terrorist organization. Some of its leaders are calling for the 'execution' of leftists, and almost no Repud is denouncing them for doing that..
#15199641
Preaching to the choir here, but the importance of getting Democratic voters to the polls cannot be overstated. Not enough Democratic turnout in VA showed what will happen. Don't let that happen in your state, vote for all your local races all the way up. The MAGA are working at the hyper-local in the states, that's how they're gonna win if we don't stop them. School boards to state reps to governors to congressional reps and senators. And don't forget judges. Vote your heart in the primary, vote Democratic in the general. Get people to the polls, or get them to mail in their ballots. Vote like your life depends on it, because it does.
#15199644
anna wrote:Preaching to the choir here, but the importance of getting Democratic voters to the polls cannot be overstated. Not enough Democratic turnout in VA showed what will happen. Don't let that happen in your state, vote for all your local races all the way up. The MAGA are working at the hyper-local in the states, that's how they're gonna win if we don't stop them. School boards to state reps to governors to congressional reps and senators. And don't forget judges. Vote your heart in the primary, vote Democratic in the general. Get people to the polls, or get them to mail in their ballots. Vote like your life depends on it, because it does.

I was thinking how some leftists would emphasize their cynicism and antipathy towards representatives but miss the practical implication that sometimes to vote for the lesser evil in support of real world implications is to actually support people instead of bring impotent. It’d be useless to whinge one side is just as bad as another if there is a practical and significant effect on peoples lives to voting one over the other.
It would be callous to be indifferent to someone who is campaigning to restrict rights or fuck over some people. We don’t have to like who we vote for but indifference certainly is useless. Better to swallow ones pride and get something done than fixate on being right about how rotten politics is.
#15201117
I'm generally for democracy, but lockdown and vaccines overrides my commitment to democracy. If were an American, never mind whether there was election fraud or not, I would support the overthrow of the reported 2020 election result. Opposition to lockdowns and vaccine mandates is my now my number one issue. I know a lot of people who couldn't remotely be described as conservatives, many of whom have chosen to live and work abroad for periods who feel similarly.
#15201401
I guess OP missed Marc Elias (through Perkins Coie) and his team of lawyers going state by state to change election laws against the Constitution.

AFAIK, election laws are supposed to be governed by the State Legislatures, not judges or Secretaries of State.

"Section 4: Elections

The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators."

- - - - -

BTW, I do not see democracy as burning and looting our cities for 150 days last summer, tipping over statues, assaulting police and blinding them with lasers (or throwing bottles filled with frozen urine at them), attempting to burn down the Mark Hatfield Federal building and rioting in city after city, burning businesses down and causing billions in damage to public and private property, the whole CHAZ debacle in Portland where two people were murdered and on and on and on. It's very interesting how five weeks before the November election, things suddenly calmed down nationwide.

You have a convenient view of history, but honestly, democrats have no self-awareness on many of the things they do to gain and maintain power. Please don't lecture us on "democracy".
#15201604
Rich wrote:I'm generally for democracy, but lockdown and vaccines overrides my commitment to democracy. If were an American, never mind whether there was election fraud or not, I would support the overthrow of the reported 2020 election result. Opposition to lockdowns and vaccine mandates is my now my number one issue. I know a lot of people who couldn't remotely be described as conservatives, many of whom have chosen to live and work abroad for periods who feel similarly.

So, Rich, does overthrow mean using violence to decide elections. If so then you are not a loyal American.

As soon as the rule of law no longer decides elections, you are living in chaos or a dictatorship.

Part of the problem for the US in the next few years is that the laws are being used to subvert the will of the people and replace it with rule by the current legislatures, who will see to it that they are not replaced by any opposing elements in the nation or state in the Union. This isn't even violence, but it is just as bad. Although, violence or the threat of violence can be part of the way that the legislatures keep power. That is, they allow vigilantes to patrol in front of polling places in neighborhoods controlled by their opposition, and they don't let anyone vote.
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#15201711
BlutoSays wrote:
I guess OP missed Marc Elias (through Perkins Coie) and his team of lawyers going state by state to change election laws against the Constitution.

AFAIK, election laws are supposed to be governed by the State Legislatures, not judges or Secretaries of State.

"Section 4: Elections

The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators."

- - - - -

BTW, I do not see democracy as burning and looting our cities for 150 days last summer, tipping over statues, assaulting police and blinding them with lasers (or throwing bottles filled with frozen urine at them), attempting to burn down the Mark Hatfield Federal building and rioting in city after city, burning businesses down and causing billions in damage to public and private property, the whole CHAZ debacle in Portland where two people were murdered and on and on and on. It's very interesting how five weeks before the November election, things suddenly calmed down nationwide.

You have a convenient view of history, but honestly, democrats have no self-awareness on many of the things they do to gain and maintain power. Please don't lecture us on "democracy".


BlutoSays wrote:
BTW, I do not see democracy as burning and looting our cities for 150 days last summer,



Do you see democracy as slavery, plutocracy, police killings, and right-wing / fascist presidential coups -- ? Also immigration, abortion, and racism.
#15201735
Rich wrote:
I'm generally for democracy, but lockdown and vaccines overrides my commitment to democracy. If were an American, never mind whether there was election fraud or not, I would support the overthrow of the reported 2020 election result. Opposition to lockdowns and vaccine mandates is my now my number one issue. I know a lot of people who couldn't remotely be described as conservatives,


Rich wrote:
many of whom have chosen to live and work abroad for periods who feel similarly.




Planning to flee Donald Trump's America? It might not be that easy

Many US citizens have threatened to leave the country pending the results of the presidential election – but be careful what you wish for

Suzanne McGee
Thu 12 May 2016 06.00 EDT



https://www.theguardian.com/money/us-mo ... -to-canada
#15203700

After the 2020 United States presidential election in which Joe Biden prevailed,[5] then-incumbent Donald Trump,[6] as well as his campaign, his proxies, and many of his supporters, pursued an aggressive and unprecedented[7] effort to deny and overturn the election.[8][9][10] These efforts culminated in the 2021 United States Capitol attack, which was widely described as an attempted coup d'état.[11][12]

As part of their efforts, Trump and his allies promoted a "big lie" of numerous false claims and conspiracy theories claiming that the election was stolen by means of rigged voting machines, electoral fraud and an international communist conspiracy.[13][14][20] These allegations were dismissed as completely baseless by numerous state and federal judges, election officials, governors, and government agencies.[21][22][23] United States Attorney General William Barr said on December 1 that U.S. attorneys and FBI agents had investigated complaints and allegations of fraud, and found no evidence of fraud at a large enough scale to influence the outcome of the election.[22][24][25][26] Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe said no evidence had been found of foreign interference with voting tallies.[27] Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) Director Chris Krebs said there was no evidence that election systems had been compromised, refuted baseless claims that some vote-counting had taken place outside the United States, and called the election "the most secure in American history", leading Trump to fire him[28] and Trump attorney Joseph diGenova to call for his execution.[29][30][31]

Hundreds of elected Republicans, including members of Congress and governors, refused to acknowledge Biden's victory,[32] though some did so after the certification of the Electoral College vote.[33][34] Emily Murphy, the administrator of the General Services Administration, delayed the start of the presidential transition before allowing it to proceed on November 23, 20 days after the election and 16 days after most media outlets had projected Biden to be the winner.[35][36]



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attempts_ ... l_election
#15203702
BlutoSays wrote:
Cliff Notes: If you aren't in full agreement with the Democrat National Committee, BLM and the mod squad, you are against democracy.



Pay attention to Liz Cheney, she's an extremely conservative Republican, but she also respects democracy.

But thanks for letting us know you're batsh*t crazy.
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