There's a couple of members of the forum who are still very exercised by what happened to the Native Americans in North America. Although I must note they couldn't seem to care less what happened to the Native Americans in South America, Central America or the Caribbean. But I do agree with them, that if Americans really regretted genociding the Native Americas, if they really wanted to make amends for the crimes of their ancestors, they would give the whole of North America back to the Indians.
No Rich, I for sure, do not distinguish between the North American genociding and the eradication of the Indians in Central America, South America and the Caribbean. I studied that for a long time and still do.
Spain, England, France and Portugal and the Netherlands all went on a feeding frenzy looking for that original route to India and Asia, hoping to make money and get out of debts and appease the elites in their respective Empires and Monarchies. Elitism is always on the hunt for treasures.
They were predatory. So were the Empires from the Americas. Like the Aztec.
If you study Empires in all groups they have similar goals and mentalities. Regardless of which culture they come from.
It does not cleanse the 'sin' of the Europeans at all who came up with the excuses of Christianizing the savages. When they just wanted to use and abuse them. A very imperial thing to do.
The Nazis were predatory with the Jewish populations and scapegoated them. No doubt about it.
The Spanish used the encomienda system. Condemned by Bartolome de las Casas and others.
No, all of the European leadership at the time of 1492-1899 and beyond, have to take responsibility for raping the new lands and subjecting the people on those lands to exploitation based on greed that was acute on the part of the European nobility and emerging capitalist class. No excuses. Suck it up. Take the responsibility.
Same with the The Third Reich.
You have technology, and you impose and kill and threaten to kill in order to control. No matter what race you are, language you speak or culture you spout to represent. The behavior of predation is there. Take responsibility. That is what anyone who studies those atrocities must insist upon. Otherwise the Barbaric Nobles who are Noble will never change their tunes.
Why do you insist on trying to say that there is some great noble mission for the Europeans? They were greed-filled and low-life pieces of talking power-hungry violent scum in my opinion. They never gave two shits about their own lower classes and much less about enslaving some unknown people on land they hoped to possess in order to gain control of it and make money hand over fist. Greed, and gain. Power and Greed. The goal.
Potemkin has tried to make me understand the Anglo way of greed and power. What he said to me was appalling in his conversations. I never lived in the UK, so do I know what that culture is about? Not really. For me Anglo shit is a mystery to a certain extent. It always will be unless you are born and raised among that group and follow the norms of that society. I never did. I find the way the Anglos cope with slavery and or lower classes from the Buckingham Palace crowd very foreign. For us a lack of demonstrating emotion is the opposite of trustworthy behavior. Coldness and being too calm and too detached is the epitome of evil and lack of trustworthiness. Potemkin tells me it is normal behavior.
Each culture has its parameters. For me the Anglo stuff is a bit of a mystery still. You can only glean so much from books and second hand accounts. The best thing is to go and live in that society for years as an outsider. But I am old. And have had enough adventures eh? No time to study your Anglo stuff. Lol.
That is the point Rich. The human factor is that the Empire builders all have similar behavior patterns that are all fueled by GREED. Power hungry crap mostly.