Farage's anti-Biden Telegraph article deconstructed - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15137252
The Telegraph wrote:In 2016, just after Donald Trump won the US presidential election, I was fortunate to spend some time with him in Trump Tower in New York. During this meeting, the depth of his affection for the United Kingdom was obvious. His team told me that a trade deal with Britain was a priority in order to show that he was not an isolationist but wanted sensible arrangements unlike, say, the North American Free Trade Agreement between America, Canada and Mexico.

Four years have been squandered since then, during which the British Government has dithered and a full Brexit has not been delivered. Now, the chance of a trade agreement with America has almost certainly evaporated if, as seems likely, Joe Biden is confirmed as the new president.

Who can forget in April 2016, just before the EU referendum, Barack Obama telling the British people that if we dared to vote for Brexit our country would be at “the back of the queue” in terms of a trade deal because America’s focus would be on negotiating with the EU? Well, Obama’s vice president at the time was Biden, and his personal dislike of Brexit has not changed since then.

Indeed, Biden is an avid supporter of the EU and his priority will be to improve relations between his country and the bloc. Obama used to fly to mainland Europe first rather than the United Kingdom. Biden will do the same.

To complicate things further, Biden is a supporter of Irish nationalism and in the 1990s he lobbied hard for the then-Sinn Fein leader Gerry Adams to visit the USA. As recently as 2017, he met Adams to discuss a united Ireland. More astonishing still, at that meeting he was also photographed with one Rita O’Hare, an IRA fugitive who attempted to kill a British Army officer in the 1970s.

And, for good measure, Biden and Nancy Pelosi, the Speaker of the House of Representatives, has already swallowed the Dublin and Brussels line that a Brexit deal must not threaten the 1998 Belfast Agreement, even though that agreement doesn’t even mention trade.

If you are still in any doubt about Biden’s antipathy towards the UK, just look at his response to the BBC journalist Nick Bryant who asked him on Saturday if he had anything to say to the British state broadcaster. “The BBC? I’m Irish,” he replied as he walked off. He might just as well have stuck two fingers up:

Some Conservative commentators in recent days have said that Boris Johnson will get on well with Biden and will be less embarrassed dealing with him than he was under the presidency of Donald Trump. It is true that when it comes to climate change and taking a softer line against China, Johnson and Biden will be more aligned. But the same cannot be said of the issue that took Johnson to power and which will define his legacy, Brexit.

The omens are not good. Anthony Gardner, the former US Ambassador to the European Union and a close confidant of Biden’s, has already said that future relations between the UK and America will depend on our final deal with the EU.

After years of failure, Britain is now caught in a trap between Brussels and Washington. Stranded in the mid-Atlantic, we have played ourselves into a form of checkmate. Brexit talks have stalled and this time the clock is genuinely running down. Johnson now faces a simple choice. He can either strike a deal with which both Washington and Brussels are happy, or he can go it alone and be criticised for looking friendless in the world.

So, the Northern Irish protocol, a fisheries deal that suits the EU, and some form of regulatory alignment will be put to the British government in the next few days on a take-it-or-leave-it basis. I am sorry to say that Johnson, who already looks beleaguered and who is struggling with unity in his party and plummeting popularity levels, is now far more likely to do the deal that Brussels wants.

In this, he will be cheered on by the global corporations and by most of our mainstream media. We will be told that a sensible compromise has been reached and that Boris has acted like a statesman, but of course Britain will come off second best.

In the next few months, I predict there will be a reappraisal of Donald Trump’s presidency. While his New York outspokenness never went down well with the British electorate, these negative views may well have to be revised. In Trump, Britain has lost a true ally and friend. Furthermore, a final Brexit deal that holds our nation back, that doesn’t genuinely make us free, and that doesn’t deliver on the promises made both in 2016 and the general election in 2019 is now looking like a certainty.

If all of this comes to pass, to say that it would be a disappointment would be the biggest understatement of my career.


Funny question Mr Farage, if a succesful Brexit hinges on Trump or the lack of Obama and Biden then why did you push for Brexit during the Obama administration? :eh:

Farage is clearly stupid enough to be unable to see the irony in all this and that his article is his personal confession that Brexit would only be ok if all the stars were in perfect alignment and under no other scenario.
#15137256
noemon wrote:Farage is clearly stupid enough to be unable to see the irony in all this

I don't think he's stupid; he's cynically making excuses. Given his whole political career is based on dishonesty and spite, this shouldn't be too surprising.

noemon wrote:his article is his personal confession that Brexit would only be ok if all the stars were in perfect alignment and under no other scenario.

This is exactly it. His absurd promises of "sunlit uplands" were obviously never going to hold up - particularly after Covid-19 - but Trump losing gives him a perfect scapegoat.

Farage's argument is basically this: the problem isn't that there is no such thing as the "special relationship" and the USA, on principle, doesn't give a flying fuck about Britain; it's that America has been hijacked by a radical cadre of Gramscian communists exemplified by... Joe Biden. :lol:

This is why, as much s the guy is a total bell end, Peter Hitchens is basically the only conservative worth listening to on Anglo-American relations.
#15137285
What a surprise indeed that post-Brexit Britain finds itself caught between a rock and a hard place finally, which is not a fault of Brexiteers and the morons that voted for their agenda, of course. It's the fault of their American friends and Trump, whose blitz on the US republic failed to succeed somehow. :lol:
#15137296
Rancid wrote:Ok, but to hinge the success of the whole thing on trade with a single partner? Sounds like the dumbest risk to take. Were voters informed of this risk before voting?


I wouldn't say that they were that dumb, I think they thought they could sign several bilateral agreements to make up for the lessened access to EU markets. But yeah, I find it hard to see the purpose too.
#15137301
Rancid wrote:Help me understand here. What does the US have to do with British Brexit plans? Why hinge Brexit on what happens in other countries?


It’s an excuse. What he is saying is if we don't get a deal from America it was down to wasting time getting Brexit done whilst Trump was in power. But Trump wasn't totally dumb. He wasn't going to hand over the milk without the UK pulling down their pants down first. The mere fact we have no deal from America but we do with Japan is because things are not as easy as Farage lead everyone to believe because nothing stopped talks regardless of the Westminster tennis and yet nothing was achieved in this time.
#15137308
Rancid wrote:Ok, but to hinge the success of the whole thing on trade with a single partner? Sounds like the dumbest risk to take. Were voters informed of this risk before voting?

I wonder if they even cared about the risks when they decided to leave the EU. It wasn't about trade in the first place, it was rather about identity as usual. However, I guess the idea was that Trump gets reelected and they make a "beautiful" trade agreement with him, although the Americans informed them that even the NHS was supposed to be on the table. With Trump's fall the whole thing seems to have crumbled, for which Mr. Farage refuses to take responsibility, of course. :lol:
#15137339
Rancid wrote:Ok, but to hinge the success of the whole thing on trade with a single partner? Sounds like the dumbest risk to take. Were voters informed of this risk before voting?


Brexitters are immune to reason and argument just like Trumptards. They believed in fake news just like Trumptards. Rightwing populism won in the UK just as it won in the US; however, while the US has turned a corner with Biden, the UK has 4 more years to go with Bojo and Brexit won't be undone in a generation.
#15137369
Britain's position perfectly makes sense. They moved out before things get more messy in Brussels.

Merkel and Erdoğan will negotiate the refugee deal's new terms. Turkey reduced number of arrivals by %70. Visa free travel to Europe for 87 million Turkish people is on the table. Cyprus issue is on the table. Eastern mediternian issue is on the table.

It is very likely that Germany will abandon Greece's demands completely. It is also likely that I will be able to travel all across Europe without any visa. 87 million Muslims will be freely travel to Europe. That is a news. Britain doesn't want to be in this.
#15137512
Istanbuller wrote:Britain's position perfectly makes sense. They moved out before things get more messy in Brussels.

Merkel and Erdoğan will negotiate the refugee deal's new terms. Turkey reduced number of arrivals by %70. Visa free travel to Europe for 87 million Turkish people is on the table. Cyprus issue is on the table. Eastern mediternian issue is on the table.

It is very likely that Germany will abandon Greece's demands completely. It is also likely that I will be able to travel all across Europe without any visa. 87 million Muslims will be freely travel to Europe. That is a news. Britain doesn't want to be in this.


That is some powerful dope you are smoking there.

Let me guess, it's the drug of national self-delusion, right?
#15137519
Istanbuller wrote:Britain's position perfectly makes sense. They moved out before things get more messy in Brussels.

Merkel and Erdoğan will negotiate the refugee deal's new terms. Turkey reduced number of arrivals by %70. Visa free travel to Europe for 87 million Turkish people is on the table. Cyprus issue is on the table. Eastern mediternian issue is on the table.

It is very likely that Germany will abandon Greece's demands completely. It is also likely that I will be able to travel all across Europe without any visa. 87 million Muslims will be freely travel to Europe. That is a news. Britain doesn't want to be in this.


You sure talk a lot of smack for a country that has had no growth in the last 7 years and lost around 20% of its total GDP by 2019. And that was before the coronavirus even hit your country. Gdp per capita losses were around 33% before the coronavirus hit since 2013. :knife:
#15138884
Atlantis wrote:That is some powerful dope you are smoking there.

Let me guess, it's the drug of national self-delusion, right?


You have parroted Istanbuller.

The fact is Germany has blocked sanctions against Turkey on at least 6 EU summits. On September's summit(after a summer of real war in the Aegean) it was eventually agreed that EU sanctions will be activated on the October Summit if Erdogan does not remove the warships and the Oruc Reis from EU waters, he removed them 1 day before the Summit, during the October's Summit the Germans again argued for Turkey: "Look they moved ze ships away, so no need for sanctions now" and agreed to impose sanctions if Turkey re-escalates before the December Summit. Turkey put the warships and the Oruc Reis back into EU waters just days after the October Summit ended and have kept them there as we speak, now in the December summit Erdogan will do the same again, he will remove the ships 1 or 2 days before the summit, the Germans will argue their pro-Turkish arguments again and we will be going around in circles with Turkey attacking and Germany holding the EU back, ad infinitum. Nice one.

When Greeks point this Germany hypocrisy out, then Germans will just call them "spoilt brats" like she did during the crisis when she closed Greek banks, because as we all know German PR is far more important than EU sovereignty and even more important than Greek, French and Austrian security for that matter.

Remember, in the summer of 2015, 3 days after Merkel ordered the closure of Greek banks she opened the migrant doors of Europe to change the conversation and become “Mutti Merkel”. She invited millions & millions of people to cross borders to reach to Germany, she created those vast images of caravans of people traversing Europe to reach the promised land that directly led to Brexit and the rise of Trump so that she can at the same time strangulate Greece into submission and the world to be fine with it because "look immigrants". For many Greek analysts Germany was aware of Turkish plans against Greece and her treatment during the crisis would achieve either 1 of 2 things: 1) Greece would leave the EU and thus absolve the EU of any responsibility if Turkey were to attack or 2) even if Greece remained she would still be severely weakened to deal with the Turkish threat. Win win for the German-Russian-Turkish axis. Also, remember that was also the same time the Greek Orthodox Patriarch granted independence to the Ukrainian Church angering Russia and leading to the severance of relations between our 2 churches. Also remember that when Obama tried to intervene in the European debt crisis, Merkel started crying in the room with Obama never to bother again. Today, Germany said to Macron that "Europe cannot do without the US".
#15147052
Rancid wrote:
Help me understand here. What does the US have to do with British Brexit plans? Why hinge Brexit on what happens in other countries?



My read on Nigel is that he is one of Putin's puppets.

Part of the Brexit strategy involved closer ties with the USA, and that seems less likely to him now. I don't agree with that assessment, but whatever.

He's just trying to put the blame elsewhere, I doubt the Brits will buy that for a second.
#15147059
noemon wrote:Funny question Mr Farage, if a succesful Brexit hinges on Trump or the lack of Obama and Biden then why did you push for Brexit during the Obama administration? :eh:

Farage is clearly stupid enough to be unable to see the irony in all this and that his article is his personal confession that Brexit would only be ok if all the stars were in perfect alignment and under no other scenario.


Trump being a true friend.

Nice one one centurion.

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