Politics_Observer wrote:@Juin
So here is a question I have. How would you or Russia feel if it's neighbors, instead of joining NATO got their own nuclear weapons arsenal to defend themselves? NATO is no longer at their border and Russia no longer can use NATO as a boogeyman to justify invading other countries. The other countries could also launch their nuclear weapons at Russia if Russia tries to invade their countries. This would deter the Russians from invading and the Russians don't have to worry about being invaded ever because NATO is not there border. All sides have their security assured, right?
If the Russians aren't a threat to their neighbors and are just invading their neighbors because of NATO, this alternative solution would make Russia happy then and their neighbors happy because then everybody would have their security assured, right? They will just have a bunch of nuclear armed states with those weapons pointed at them to ensure they don't get invaded. Everybody's happy then.
And I have to ask, do you think those smaller countries on Russia's borders deserve to live in security and to choose their own destiny without coercion or influence from anybody like Russia for example? This alternative solution would satisfy you and if not what would be your alternative solution to satisfy all parties involved and their security needs?
Your questions are hypotheticals, and I will address them as best as I can.
Nukes, so far, are the equalizers. A weak nation, with a powerful aggressive neighbour, is well advised to if they can. That is if they can. It may not be a cost free project as the powerful neighbour may not sit aside quietly and see an neighbour arm up. If Ukraine acquires nukes Russia may not be as quick to invade. The ugly side of the coin is that any sign of any such project going on in Ukraine may prompt Russia to invade immediately.
And this is not a uniquely Russian issue. Israel doesnt want its neighbours to acquire nukes either, and has intervened to foil such projects in Iraq and Syria. The US does not want Iran to acquire nukes. China definitely does not want Taiwan to acquire nukes.
Russia as a threat to their neighbours.
I hope I never left the impression that Russia was not a threat to its neighbours. Russian defense policies- Czarist, Bolshevik or Putin- has been basically the same. The further off the enemy has to start the invasion of the Russian sphere, the better for Russia, as defense in depth appears to have been its preferred approach. This has meant Russia pushing its frontiers as far outwards as possible. Naturally that has meant dominating the smaller nations in its path.
You leave the impression if Russia objects to its neighbours joining Nato it should be ok with same neighbours acquiring nukes. I dont think that follows. Russia can both object to Ukraine joining Nato as well as Ukraine acquiring nukes. Is that fair? No, of course not, it is not fair. Life is not fair. And Russia is not unique in not playing fair. Is it fair that Israel bombs its neighbours when they try to acquire nukes?
Do the small nations in Russia's sphere deserve to live in security? A good question, but should not be limited only to Russia. Do small nations of the world deserve to live in security, free from the predatory actions of powerful Imperialists?
Bottom line is it sucks to be a small and weak nation.
Politics_Observer wrote:@Juin
If I was a general, serving a non NATO member state that shared a border with Russia, I would probably recommend to my civilian authorities to begin a secret covert nuclear program and keep it very secret with as few people knowing about it as possible given Russia's recent actions. That's what any self respecting general serving in the armed forces of a non-NATO border state to Russia would recommend to his government. They have a duty to ensure that deterrence prevails and the security of their country is assured. It's either that or taking a very big risk of being occupied, dominated and controlled by the Russians for a very long time. Some of these non-NATO states already are dominated by the Russians.
As we agreed in earlier discussions, nukes are the great equalizers. It goes without saying that a small nation acquiring them can go a long ways serving as a deterrence. Only to some extent, though. Dont forget that Israel was still attacked by its neighbours in 1967 and 1973, long after Israel already had nukes, if my memory serves me right.
But are you also taking into account that any hint of Ukraine looking for nukes may prompt an immediate attack from Russia? I really doubt that Ukraine can develop nukes in a program so secret as to avoid discovery by Russians. For crying out loud a significant portion of Ukraine's populations are ethnic Russians with loyalties towards Moscow. Kiev has a significant Russian speaking population. How is the government of Ukraine gonna go about a secret nuke project that is leak proof?
B0ycey wrote:OMG! Another [usermention=22068]
Rumour has it Navalny has days to live and unlike when he returned to Russia,
Nothing in Navalny's resume suggests it is wise to hand the reins of the Kremlin to him. That will be Gorbachev all over, and worse. Navalny in all likelihood will see the dismantling of the Russian Federation, just as Gorbachev above him was so over his head that the mighty USSR crumbled under him.
B0ycey wrote:@Politics_Observer, a couple of weeks now and Russia haven't crossed the border. Ignoring the obvious problem that Ukraine would have to develop nuclear weapons which doesn't take days I might add and more importantly would require Russia not to bomb the sites if they tried, Ukraine would have a better chance trying to get into NATO in any case given America already have more bombs then they need. That won't happen of course as it wouldn't be in America's interest especially for them to join but I would say it is Ukraines only move today except of course diplomacy if they want a resolution. And if they don't do that then the other option is not to give Russia an excuse to cross the border (the current course of action). They don't have any other options. Stop making out Ukraine can do anything except what they are doing.
It is a no brainer. There is no way Ukraine can develop nukes without Russia knowing. It can be guaranteed that any sign of any such going ons in Ukraine will trigger a devastating Russian attack.
Israel attacks folks developing nukes that may threaten her all the time, why should Russia not be expected to?