Waiting for Starmer - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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By Rich
vinnydell wrote:As for Starmer, a less suitable leader of the Labour party I haven't seen since Kinnock.

Don't get me wrong, I don't like the Tories either, but jeez. Starmer single handedly lost Labour the last election with his remoaning.

Starmer's not as stupid as a lot of people think. His failure to prosecute Jimmy Saville for example was a demonstration of the competence of his management for the establishment. Starmer's EU policy at the last election was a highly intelligent response to the needs of the two party system.

I still hear people say, that Cameron made a mistake in promising the referendum. Cameron's priority was to stop the formation of an electoral force that could compete with the Tories on the right. As I always say one of the rules of successful politics is never sacrifice the long term interests of your political party for the short term interests of your country. Has the Brexit vote created problems for the Tories. Yes of course it has but they pale into insignificance with the problems they would have had, if UKIP / Brexit / Reform had emerged as a serious competition in the two party system.

We saw with the Liberals in the early nineteenth century how quickly a party can go from a natural party of government, to an almost irrelevance. We saw the collapse of the Labour party's dominance in Scotland. We've seen this phenomena with a number of parties in Europe. Starmer's Brexit policy in 2019 was not to designed to win the election, it was designed to squeeze the Liberal Democratic vote, by competing with Liberal Democrats for the hard remainer vote. And Starmers wisdom in 2019 has paid off for the Labour Party and has paid off for him.

This is how the two party system works. As long as you protect your side of the political spectrum, then however catastrophic your defeats, its just a matter of time before government will fall into your hands again. If the Tories suffer a catastrophic defeat at the next election we will hear the same nonsense from the pundits about how the Tories number one priority is to move to the centre ground. No their number one priority is that they remain the only viable seat winning party on the right.
By Rich
vinnydell wrote:I didn't say he was stupid, I said he wasn't suitable on account of his role in losing Labour the 2019 election and costing the party 60 seats.

Fair enough

So Starmer's launched an attack add, attacking Sunak for being soft on Peodophiles. The Guardian

‘Civility in politics’? Starmer may have to stable that faithful nag after Labour’s awful ‘paedo protector’ attack ad on Rishi Sunak
By snapdragon
That was Jeremy Corbyn, not Starmer.

It isn’t possible to reverse brexit as such. It’s happened. Britain can apply to rejoin, but it’ll take years and the time for starting that is not now.
By Rich
I think it would be good if the Liberal Democrats, Greens and possibly others made a clear stand. No coalition without Proportional Representation. If the the Tories and Labour don't want PR that's fine, that is their right, but then in the case of a hung parliament, its up to the Tories and Labour to form a coalition.
By Rich
Both Starmer and Sunak campaigned as continuity candidates. Corbynism without Corbyn in the case of Starmer and Boris-Brexitism without Boris in the case of Rishi.

In the near future the local election results were pretty good for Labour and very bad for the Tories. Longer term though things are different. Cameron calling the Brexit referendum was a brilliant move politically, the Tories have almost eliminated competitors on the right of the spectrum, whereas Labour remains dangerously exposed to the Lib Dems, the Scottish Nation Party and now the Greens.

As always I push my zero tolerance policy. If you support the two party system, then there should be zero tolerance for you whining about the fruits of the two party system. Brexit and Trump are both products of the two party system and would have been most unlikely under pure proportion representation.
skinster wrote:Starmer was installed to destroy The Labour Party and it looks like he's doing a pretty good job of that. :D

You are just salty that Corbyn was a fuck up while Starmer will most likely get elected.
By skinster
Corbyn was weak but the fuck up was largely him getting attacked from all over, including from within his own party.

Still, it's funny that anyone defends Starmer, but I suppose your politics have always been shite, JR. I actually support his work in destroying the party. :excited:
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By JohnRawls
skinster wrote:Corbyn was weak but the fuck up was largely him getting attacked from all over, including from within his own party.

Still, it's funny that anyone defends Starmer, but I suppose your politics have always been shite, JR. I actually support his work in destroying the party. :excited:

But hes going to get elected probably and bring a lot of votes to the party so how is he destroying it?
By skinster
JohnRawls wrote:But hes going to get elected probably and bring a lot of votes to the party so how is he destroying it?

He's leadership role and subsequent insanity, including kicking out the old popular leader and acting confused about what a woman is lost the party 200,000 members***, after they were the largest political party in Europe, and has brought it close to bankruptcy repeatedly since, but sure, watch him "bring a lot of votes" :D

Really, where do you learn about the world? Because it seems like you are not very grounded in reality and repeatedly pull shit out of your ass and believe it to be what you think is happening. What a wild way to live. I'm kind of envious of it. :lol:

***That was the figure over a year ago but I imagine it's many more now that women into reality have left the party en masse.
By snapdragon
Corbyn wasn’t just weak; he was stubborn and stupid. Not to mention hanging out with the wrong people.
He’s an air dreamer who actually thought he could turn Britain into a socialist state. He still thinks that and is stubbornly clinging onto his stupid dream, along with his posh so called communist mates.
I’m thankful starmer hasn’t wavered in his determination to rid the Labour Party of the dangerous clique who support him.
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By ingliz

Why vote for the tribute act Blue Labour under Starmer when you could vote for the real thing, true Blue Tories?

By snapdragon
Starmer’s Labour is nothing like the tories. You’re just parroting what you’ve read in the guardian.
Starmer > Corbyn as Labour party leader. Daddy Starmer gonna woop dem Tories in the next election probably and Labour will be back in power.

The funny thing that it is pointless who gets elected. UK is screwed one way or the other. Brexit really done and fucked up Britain.
By snapdragon
I do know much he’s disliked by the momentum crowd, but that’s inevitable.

Personally, I wish they’d bugger off to the communist party, which is where they belong.

There was uproar in the guardian when Sir Keir announced he was abandoning his pledge to scrap student fees. Most of us thought that was only common sense, given the current state of the economy. He was called a traitor, a liar and all sorts.

We have ordinary working people struggling to put food on the table, pay their rent and keep their homes warm, yet a noisy minority moaning and wailing that he’s abandoned students.

I have friends that admired corbyn at the beginning, but I never have. He talks out of his arse and hangs out with champagne socialists, such as the Drummond Murray crowd. If he had the courage of his convictions , then he’d have joined the communist party like them. But he’d rather pull in a decent income from the Labour Party.

I was pretty disgusted when he gave them all jobs after he’d become leader.
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By ingliz

Why did you vote for Labour under Miliband and Corbyn?

Are you younger than your online persona makes you appear and never had the chance to vote?

If you were of voting age, Cameron and May's Compassionate Conservatism or the Orange Bookers - Clegg and Swinson's Yellow Tories - would have been a better fit.

JohnRawls wrote:and bring a lot of votes to the party

I wouldn't put money on that.

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