New Covid19 Strain is more transmissible... - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15144127
Can't wait for these Tories to get the sack. Not that I would have voted for them anyway, but I will have a satisfactory smile when putting across over another parties name in four years time.

Anyway another BoJo U-Turn because a new strain of Covid19 has been discovered that is more transmissible. Not deadly, transmissible I might add. The irony of course is as evolution always finds away, the obvious reason for this new strain is because it has evolved to survive our restrictions. So the solution? More restrictions. Can't make that shit up. Have we not got a single brain cell in Downing Street? Keep society running, keep the tax receipts coming in to pay for the NHS and advice those at high risk to stay home and self isolate until they get the vaccine. There is nothing else you can do as clearly lockdowns haven't done shit. What did Einstein say again about insanity again?
Don't tell everyone to cancel Christmas when they have had plans. And don't close shops without showing the evidence. So advice people to wear masks and do ask them to consider close contact during Christmas instead.

A government has to be strong during tough times. A government that follows the herd is a government that is run by muppets. Anyway, how full are these Nightingale hospitals in London? Why did we even build them?
#15144133
ness31 wrote:My heart goes out to the good folk of the UK. It’s all bubbles and tiers over there. How fucking ironic...


Considering we are meant to be in meltdown, I haven't seen it. Nothing worse than a normal winter season as we seem to have replaced Flu beds with Covid beds. But I digest, regardless where you sit on this issue in particular, the only thing everyone agrees on is that this governments approach hasn't worked so why do they think doing the same thing over and over again is they way forward? Headless chickens without a fuckin' clue. Pick a side, pick a tactic and stick with it. Don't U-Turn back to bloody lockdowns because otherwise you are just kicking the can down the road.
#15144135
Why doesn’t someone introduce rapid testing? It’s actually criminal that in a state of emergency powers they can’t approve rapid tests. Sadly, that’s not even corruption but just plain old incompetence.
#15144138
ness31 wrote:Why doesn’t someone introduce rapid testing? It’s actually criminal that in a state of emergency powers they can’t approve rapid tests. Sadly, that’s not even corruption but just plain old incompetence.


Lack of capacity I think. They have set up rapid testing in high case rate areas. The problem is that those who should know better - ie the elderly, are the worse offenders. When restrictions are lessened to free up the economy, they behave the same as everyone else - and are the worse offenders for not wearing a mask correctly from what I am witnessing. Which means the advice should be aimed at them specifically. Asking them to stay home until they get a vaccine for three months is the least they can do considering we are meant to be saving their lives for them.
#15144147
@B0ycey, the new variant did not mutate "because of the Covid restrictions." On the contrary, it has mutated because of exponential growth, which is due to a lack of Covid restrictions. Most half-measures like the lockdown-light they tried in Germany have shown to be insufficient for bringing infections down to manageable levels. That's why we are going into a hard lockdown in most countries in Europe.

The virus can mutate a little each time it is transmitted. Therefore, the more new infections, the more mutations we are going to get.

The UK variant doesn't seem to be more deadly. There are reports that the new variant from South Africa may be more deadly, but that's not certain at this point in time.

If a virus encounters an environment in which it can spread easily, there is no evolutionary pressure for it to become less fatal. The Spanish flu mutated to become more deadly during the 2nd wave because it had encountered an ideal environment for reproduction in the trenches and troop transports of WWI.

Thus, the more it spreads due to insufficient Covid restrictions, the greater the chances it'll mutate to become more infectious, more deadly, or make the current vaccines ineffective.
#15144152
Atlantis wrote:If a virus encounters an environment in which it can spread easily, there is no evolutionary pressure for it to become less fatal. The Spanish flu mutated to become more deadly during the 2nd wave because it had encountered an ideal environment for reproduction in the trenches and troop transports of WWI.

Thus, the more it spreads due to insufficient Covid restrictions, the greater the chances it'll mutate to become more infectious, more deadly, or make the current vaccines ineffective.


Well they Spanish Flu became more deadly because of the trenches (isolation) as the more deadly form was transported to hospitals and spread that way so you're wrong here.

Also as it happens, if we had left it to spread it would have become less deadly because it isn't in the viruses best interest to kill its host. This occurs with all viruses, including the bubonic plague which still exists today and isn't the killer it once was I might add.

And again, you seem to ignore an entire 19th century book on evolution where things adapt to their surroundings, so if we create an environment where viruses need to be better at transmissing, then what will occur is a virus that is better at transmitting. I had actually written that this would happen back in April as it happened. And it seems I was right. This isn't like it's some form of revolution in my part. It is basic evolution science. The WHO can investigate as much as it likes on the new variant origin and try and twist the data to make it seems like more stringent measures were needed. But that defies simply logic and what we know of biology, so I suspect they will in time reach the same conclusion that anyone with half a brain can tell in a matter of minutes of logical thinking.
#15144155
B0ycey wrote:Someone still needs to administer the test. A nationwide approach would take resources away from the vaccination programme.


I thought individuals could just test themselves at home. That would be a game changer.
#15144156
ness31 wrote:I thought individuals could just test themselves at home. That would be a game changer.


I believe they can. Although they would have to pay for the test themselves. I am not against a nationwide testing program in any case. China did it within a city. I just doubt the logistics and capabilities given it requires a nationwide program and high public cooperation and the UK is doing it within outbreak regions currently in any case.

Also given that Covid is staying with us indefinitely, like Measles, Mumps and Rubella, we should be working on and using a sustainable program of control that doesn't close off the economy during an outbreak now such as a system that mitigates the risk and gives back people their own responsibility on their health. Not that it matters anymore. This government is incompetent in any case and can't even maintain their own stategy without diverting from it for no reason at all. And what is worse is Johnson mocked Stammer only three days ago and then follows his approach anyway because they are afraid of public opinion - which is ironic given that the U-turns is basically killing their already low approval ratings in any case.
#15144185
B0ycey wrote:Well they Spanish Flu became more deadly because of the trenches (isolation) as the more deadly form was transported to hospitals and spread that way so you're wrong here.

Also as it happens, if we had left it to spread it would have become less deadly because it isn't in the viruses best interest to kill its host. This occurs with all viruses, including the bubonic plague which still exists today and isn't the killer it once was I might add.

And again, you seem to ignore an entire 19th century book on evolution where things adapt to their surroundings, so if we create an environment where viruses need to be better at transmissing, then what will occur is a virus that is better at transmitting. I had actually written that this would happen back in April as it happened. And it seems I was right. This isn't like it's some form of revolution in my part. It is basic evolution science. The WHO can investigate as much as it likes on the new variant origin and try and twist the data to make it seems like more stringent measures were needed. But that defies simply logic and what we know of biology, so I suspect they will in time reach the same conclusion that anyone with half a brain can tell in a matter of minutes of logical thinking.


Now you are deep into conspiracy theory.
#15144209
B0ycey wrote:
Considering we are meant to be in meltdown, I haven't seen it. Nothing worse than a normal winter season as we seem to have replaced Flu beds with Covid beds. But I digest, regardless where you sit on this issue in particular, the only thing everyone agrees on is that this governments approach hasn't worked so why do they think doing the same thing over and over again is they way forward? Headless chickens without a fuckin' clue. Pick a side, pick a tactic and stick with it. Don't U-Turn back to bloody lockdowns because otherwise you are just kicking the can down the road.


I think the politicians do have a clue. They keep going with half-measures because they are trying their hardest to appease all sides within the voting population. The politicians are basically trying to optimize their chances of re-election, not health, not the economy. This is the downside of democratic systems. Lots of opposing views pull politicians in all sorts of directions. At times, this leads to the least optimal results. Politicians go with what they think will get them elected, as opposed to what is better for society at large.

What we need is a strong authoritarian with absolute control to pick health or the economy and not a half assed approach...... :eek:

That last sentence was sarcasm. I think I'd rather have the half-assed approach then an authoritarian fuck face running the show.
#15144214
Rancid wrote:I think the politicians do have a clue. They keep going with half-measures because they are trying their hardest to appease all sides within the voting population. The politicians are basically trying to optimize their chances of re-election, not health, not the economy. This is the downside of democratic systems. Lots of opposing views pull politicians in all sorts of directions. At times, this leads to the least optimal results. Politicians go with what they think will get them elected, as opposed to what is better for society at large.

What we need is a strong authoritarian with absolute control to pick health or the economy and not a half assed approach...... :eek:

That last sentence was sarcasm. I think I'd rather have the half-assed approach then an authoritarian fuck face running the show.


Well I agree with the first sentence in its entirely. The half and half approach is the attempt to please all parties. The irony is that it doesn't please anyone and only brings all sides of the covid debate to criticise the government further.

Nonetheless whether you were sarcastic or not, as it happens I would rather have an authortarian approach or a mitigation approach rather than the Western half and half custerfuck we see today. China did get Wuhan sorted within months whether you agree to their approach or not whereas we in the West keep on coming back to lockdowns as a solution thinking this time round things will be different. But they don't do much at all and only kick the can down the road to an even bigger custerfuck than before. And today we are relying on a vaccine where the data suggests three month immunity in any case. So personally I would try and work on a sustainable solution now and give the responsibility to the individual for their own health then pretend we are doing anything today other than pissing everyone off and given the impression that things will be back to normal is a years time which is the biggest hoax out there at the moment.
Last edited by B0ycey on 20 Dec 2020 19:09, edited 1 time in total.
#15144215
B0ycey wrote:
Well I agree with the first sentence in its entirely. The half and half approach is the attempt to please all parties. The irony is that it doesn't please anyone and only brings all sides of the covid debate to criticise the government further.

Nonetheless whether you were sarcastic or not, as it happens I would rather have an authortarian approach or a mitigation approach rather than the Western half and half custerfuck we see today. China did get Wuhan sorted within months whether you agree to their approach or not whereas we in the West keep on coming back to lockdowns as a solution thinking this time round things will be different. But they don't do much at all and only kick the can down the road to an even bigger custerfuck than before. And today we are relying on a vaccine where the data suggests three month immunity in any case. So personally I would try and work on a sustainable solution now and give the responsibility to the individual for their own health then pretend we are doing anything today than pissing everyone off and given the impression that things we be back to normal is a years time which is the biggest hoax out there at the moment.


Fair enough.

I say let her rip at this point.
#15144217
Rancid wrote:I say let her rip at this point.


No you don't. You are a supporter of restrictions and rightly so. Wearing a mask, social distancing and washing hands is a minor inconvenience to relieve the health service if nothing else. But people do seem to forget that in the UK at least, tax receipts pay for the health service so perhaps they should think of that when believing closing down the economy is anything other than a pyrrhic waste of time.
#15144218
Istanbuller wrote:It is interesting that nobody talk about root cause of coronaviruses. I don't see any scientific explanation where it comes from. How can you develop a vaccine when you don't know root causes?


what you talking about? The cause is the virus! That is why they could develop a vaccine. To create antibodies. :roll:
#15144226
B0ycey wrote:
No you don't. You are a supporter of restrictions and rightly so. Wearing a mask, social distancing and washing hands is a minor inconvenience to relieve the health service if nothing else. But people do seem to forget that in the UK at least, tax receipts pay for the health service so perhaps they should think of that when believing closing down the economy is anything other than a pyrrhic waste of time.


:) You got me. I'm not really for letting her rip.
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