South Africa launches case at UN court accusing Israel of genocide - Page 46 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

Talk about what you've seen in the news today.

Moderator: PoFo Today's News Mods

#15310399
From my primary news sources , here are some recent accounts of the IDF murdering civilians , including , but not limited to the World Central Kitchen workers .

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said Israel’s military was responsible for what he called a “tragic” and “unintentional” strike that killed seven workers affiliated with the international aid nonprofit World Central Kitchen who were delivering food in Gaza.

The organization, led by Chef Jose Andres and famous for feeding needy people in crisis situations around the world, said the workers had been killed by an Israeli strike despite having coordinated their operations with the army.

“This is not only an attack against WCK, this is an attack on humanitarian organizations showing up in the most dire of situations where food is being used as a weapon of war,” World Central Kitchen CEO Erin Gore said in a statement. “This is unforgivable.”

Netanyahu, in a brief video in Hebrew posted after his release from the hospital for a successful hernia operation, acknowledged Israel’s responsibility and pledged a probe into the incident.

“To our sorrow, in the last day, there was a tragic incident of an unintentional strike by our forces on innocents in the Gaza Strip,” he said. “It happens in war, we will investigate this thoroughly, we are in contact with the governments, and we will do everything so that this does not happen again.”

The incident has prompted World Central Kitchen to suspend its operations at a time when food is scarce across Gaza and international aid groups have warned of impending famine. It appears assured of becoming a new flashpoint in the six-month-old war, in which Israel’s conduct in Gaza is facing sharp criticism even from its allies.

The Biden administration has yet to comment on the incident, but other allies of Israel criticized it immediately. “This is beyond any reasonable circumstances that someone going about providing aid and humanitarian assistance should lose their life,” Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese said in a press conference.

One of the aid workers killed was Australian. The others were Polish, British, a dual U.S.-Canadian citizen and Palestinian. Graphic video of their bodies, with their international passports visible, circulated on social media in the hours after the killings, which took place in two separate strikes on a convoy outside a warehouse in Deir al-Balah. Footage from the scene showed that the workers were traveling in white vans with “World Central Kitchen” stenciled on their roofs; one had a gaping hole in its roof after the strike.

According to a report in Haaretz citing Israeli defense officials, Israeli forces struck the convoy three times in an attempt to target a terrorist that they wrongly believed had tried to travel in it.

Israel has faced steep criticism over its facilitation of aid into Gaza, as well as over military tactics that President Joe Biden and other close allies of Israel have said are exacting too high a cost in civilian lives.

The risk to civilians has been at the crux of U.S. opposition to Israel’s plans to invade Rafah, the city on Gaza’s border with Egypt that Israel says is the final major redoubt of Hamas forces. More than a million Palestinians are sheltering in Rafah, often at Israel’s behest, and Biden officials have said they have yet to see a viable plan to protect or evacuate them during an Israeli assault.

In an English-language video statement released Tuesday, Daniel Hagari, an Israeli military spokesman, said he had spoken to Andres and “expressed the deepest condolences of Israel Defense Forces to the families and the entire World Central Kitchen family.” Hagari also said an investigation would “examine the serious incident further” and “help us reduce the risk of such an event from occurring again.”

Hagari also praised World Central Kitchen, which Andres deployed in Israeli after the Oct. 7 massacres by Hamas terrorists that launched the war.

“They were one of the first NGOs here,” Hagari said. “The work of WCK is critical. They are the frontlines of humanity. We will get to the bottom of this, and we will share our findings transparently.”

Andres, posting on X, was grief-stricken.

“These are people…angels…I served alongside in Ukraine, Gaza, Turkey, Morocco, Bahamas, Indonesia,” he said about the workers who were killed. “They are not faceless…they are not nameless. The Israeli government needs to stop this indiscriminate killing. It needs to stop restricting humanitarian aid, stop killing civilians and aid workers, and stop using food as a weapon.”

Andres’ direct accusations against Israel stood out. Early in the war, Andres, a citizen of Spain, lambasted his government for its criticism of Israel.

“You as Minister have to first recognize that the Hamas attack against civilians is a terrorist act,” he chided a government minister who accused Israel of war crimes and genocide on Oct. 16, before the Israeli army launched its ground invasion into Gaza. “And that Israel is defending its citizens…then you can ask for restraint and respect for the lives of civilians in Gaza.”
The Jewish Telegraphic Agency



Dr Fozia Alvi was making her rounds of the intensive care unit on her final day at the battered European public hospital in southern Gaza when she stopped next to two young arrivals with facial injuries and breathing tubes in their windpipes. “I asked the nurse, what’s the history? She said that they were brought in a couple of hours ago. They had sniper shots to the brain. They were seven or eight years old,” she said.

The Canadian doctor’s heart sank. These were not the first children treated by Alvi who she was told were targeted by Israeli soldiers, and she knew the damage a single high-caliber bullet could do to a fragile young body.

“They were not able to talk, paraplegic. They were literally lying down as vegetables on those beds. They were not the only ones. I saw even small children with direct sniper shot wounds to the head as well as in the chest. They were not combatants, they were small children,” said Alvi.

Children account for more than one in three of the more than 32,000 people killed in Israel’s months-long assault on Gaza, according to the Palestinian health ministry. Tens of thousands more young people have suffered severe injuries, including amputations. Nine doctors gave the Guardian accounts of working in Gaza hospitals this year, all but one of them foreign volunteers. Their common assessment was that most of the dead and wounded children they treated were hit by shrapnel or burned during Israel’s extensive bombardment of residential neighborhoods, in some cases wiping out entire families. Others were killed or injured by collapsing buildings with still more missing under the rubble. But doctors also reported treating a steady stream of children, elderly people and others who were clearly not combatants with single bullet wounds to the head or chest.

Some of the physicians said that the types and locations of the wounds, and accounts of Palestinians who brought children to the hospital, led them to believe the victims were directly targeted by Israeli troops.

Other doctors said they did not know the circumstances of the shootings but that they were deeply troubled by the number of children who were severely wounded or killed by single gunshots, sometimes by high-calibre bullets causing extensive damage to young bodies.

In mid-February, a group of UN experts accused the Israeli military of targeting Palestinian civilians who are evidently not combatants, including children, as they sought shelter.

“We are shocked by reports of the deliberate targeting and extrajudicial killing of Palestinian women and children in places where they sought refuge, or while fleeing. Some of them were reportedly holding white pieces of cloth when they were killed by the Israeli army or affiliated forces,” the group said.

The Guardian shared descriptions and images of gunshot wounds suffered by eight children with military experts and forensic pathologists. They said it was difficult to conclusively determine the circumstances of the shootings based on the descriptions and photos alone, although in some of the cases they were able to identify ammunition used by the Israeli military.

Eyewitness accounts and video recordings appear to back up claims that Israeli soldiers have fired on civilians, including children, outside of combat with Hamas or other armed groups. In some cases, witnesses describe coming under fire while waving white flags. Haaretz reported on Saturday that Israel routinely fires on civilians in areas its military has declared a “combat zone”.

The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) deploy snipers – or sharpshooters, as the military calls them – during combat operations, often as part of elite units. They are trained to “target and eliminate particularly difficult terrorist threats”, according to the military’s own definition.

Israeli and foreign human rights groups have documented a long history of snipers firing on unarmed Palestinians, including children, in Gaza and the West Bank.

Palestinians in Gaza also report a terrifying new development in the latest Gaza war – armed drones able to hover over streets and pick off individuals. Called quadcopters, some of these drones are used as remote-control snipers that Palestinians say have been used to shoot civilians. The IDF said it “completely rejects” allegations that its snipers deliberately fire on civilians. It said it cannot address individual shootings “without coordinates of the incidents”. “The IDF only targets terrorists and military targets. In stark contrast to Hamas’s deliberate attacks on Israeli civilians, including men, women and children, the IDF follows international law and takes feasible precautions to mitigate civilian harm,” it said.

Doctors say otherwise.

Dr Vanita Gupta, an intensive care doctor at a New York City hospital, volunteered at Gaza’s European hospital in January. One morning, three badly wounded children arrived in quick succession. Their families told Gupta that the children had been together in the street when they came under fire and that there had been no other shooting in the area. She said no wounded adults were brought in to the hospital at the same time and from the same place.

“One child, I could see there was a shot to the head. They were doing CPR on this five- or six-year-old girl who obviously died,” said Gupta. “There was another little girl about the same age. I saw a bullet entry wound on her head. Her father was there, crying and asking me, ‘Can you save her? She’s my only child.’”

Gupta said that a third young child also had a shot to the head and was sent for a CT scan.

“The neurosurgeon looked and said, ‘There’s no hope.’ You could see the bullet had gone through the head. I don’t know how old he was, but young,” she said.

Family members told Gupta that the Israeli army had withdrawn from the area about four kilometres from the hospital.

“They said people started returning to their homes because the army was gone. But the snipers stayed on. The families said they opened fire at the children,” she said.

Doctors who worked at the Nasser hospital in southern Gaza said what appeared to be targeted Israeli fire killed more than two dozen people, including children, as they entered or left the hospital in the first weeks of this year.

Among the casualties was 14-year-old Ruwa Qdeih. Doctors say she was shot dead outside the hospital in Khan Younis as she went to collect water. They said there was no fighting in the area at the time and that she was killed by a single shot and then men who went to recover her body were also shot at.

In Gaza City, three-year-old Emad Abu al-Qura was shot outside his home as he went to buy fruit with his cousin, Hadeel, a 20-year-old medical student, who was also killed. The family said they were targeted by an Israeli sniper.

A video of the pair lying together in the street shows Emad still alive after he is first hit and trying to lift his head. More shots hit the ground close by including one that strikes a plank next to Emad. The boy’s mother said he was then hit again and this time killed.

Hadeel’s father, Haroon, saw the shooting.

“The targeting of civilians is very clear. It is a deliberate direct targeting aimed at killing civilians without reason, without there being any events, without there being any resistance. They deliberately killed Hadeel and Emad,” he told Al Jazeera.

Other young victims include 14-year-old Nahedh Barbakh, who was hit by sniper fire alongside his 20-year-old brother, Ramez, as they followed Israeli military orders to evacuate an area west of Khan Younis in late January, according to the Geneva-based Euro-Med Human Rights Monitor. According to a witness interviewed by Euro-Med Monitor, Nahedh was carrying a white flag to lead the way for his family, but after walking just a few steps from the house he was hit in the leg by a bullet. As the teenager attempted to turn back home he was shot in the back and head, the witness said.

Ramez was shot through the heart when he tried to rescue his brother.

The family decided it was too dangerous to recover the bodies and eventually fled the area, leaving the brothers still lying in the street. A last photograph shows Ramez stretched across Nahedh’s body with the white flag tangled between them.

Witnesses said the shots came from the rooftop of a nearby building taken over by Israeli soldiers.

A new threat
In December, the Palestine Red Crescent Society said that 13-year-old Amir Odeh was killed by an Israeli drone at its headquarters in the Al-Amal hospital in Khan Younis. The family told Euro-Med Monitor he was shot through a window as he played with his cousins on the eighth floor of building where they had sought shelter from the fighting. The killing was especially notable because the single shot to the chest came from a type of drone not seen in combat in Gaza before – a quadcopter, fitted with a gun, camera and speaker. Unlike some other drones, quadcopters are able to hover over their targets.

Dr Thaer Ahmad, a Chicago doctor who volunteered in Nasser hospital’s emergency room, said quadcopters sometimes appeared in swarms, giving orders to Palestinians to clear an area.

“We heard an incredible amount of stories from people recovering from injuries from these quadcopters firing bullets from the sky,” he said.

Ahmad said that on one occasion a drone shot one of the hospital’s doctors in the head, although he survived.

Dr Ahmed Moghrabi described on Instagram “hundreds” of quadcopters descending on the Nasser hospital in the third week of February and ordering people to evacuate the compound before killing a number of them. On another occasion, he filmed quadcopters giving instructions to Palestinians to leave the area.

Although the Israeli military has previously deployed quadcopters for intelligence gathering, this appears to be the first time that versions of the drone able to fire guns have been used against the Palestinians.

Prof Ghassan Abu-Sittah, a British-Palestinian surgeon and who was recently elected rector of the University of Glasgow, told Mondoweiss, a leftwing Israel-Palestine news site, that working at the Al-Ahli hospital in Gaza City “we were getting a lot of people shot by these quadcopters, these drones that have sniper guns attached to them”.

Abu-Sittah, who has operated on Palestinians wounded by Israeli sharpshooters during visits to Gaza in earlier years, described the quadcopters as firing “single high-velocity” shots.

“We have received over 20 chest and neck gunshot wounds fired from Israeli Quadcopter drones. This is a low flying sniper drone,” he wrote on X. Quadcopter killings documented by Euro-Med Monitor include two children shot dead on 21 January when drones opened fire at al-Aqsa University near Khan Younis, where thousands of displaced Palestinians were sheltering. The following month, a drone shot dead Elyas Abu Jama, a 17-year-old whose family said had mental and physical disabilities, outside his tent in a Rafah displaced persons camp. Euro-Med Monitor said that on the same day, a quadcopter killed 16-year-old Mahmoud al-Assar and his 21-year-old sister, Asmaa.

Thaer Ahmad spent three weeks at the Nasser hospital in January as a volunteer with the medical charity MedGlobal. Normally he works at a trauma centre on Chicago’s south side, where he regularly deals with gunshot wounds.

“I did more trauma procedures on paediatric patients in the three weeks that I was at Nasser than I did in the 10 years that I’ve been practising in the US,” he said.

The doctor said he treated five children he believes were shot by snipers because the placing of the bullets suggested they were not hit randomly but targeted.

“They were mostly shot in the thorax, the chest area, some in the abdomen. There was one boy shot in the face. As a result he had a shattered jaw. There were two children who had been shot in the chest, young, under the age of 10, who did not survive. Two others, one shot in the abdomen, did survive. They were still recovering in the hospital when I left,” he said.

Ahmad noted the children were often shot by “one large-calibre bullet” which could produce devastating wounds. Dr Irfan Galaria, a surgeon based in Virginia, slept on the operating room floor of the European hospital between shifts as a volunteer in January. He too saw children badly wounded by high-calibre bullets.

Galaria said that a 14-year-old boy arrived at the hospital who had been shot once through the back. When surgeons operated they found a bullet in the boy’s stomach.

“He was very lucky because it missed a lot of the vital organs but it was just sitting in his abdomen,” he said.

The surgeon took a photo of the bullet, which former IDF soldiers who spoke with the Guardian identified as a powerful .50 calibre round typically fired from a machine gun mounted on an armoured vehicle, although it has also been used in sniper rifles. They said that vehicle-mounted guns often have advanced sighting systems that allow them to target shots but that large numbers of .50 rounds could be fired without precision targeting, making it difficult to establish whether the child was targeted.

Other bullets recovered from young Palestinians include 5.56mm rounds that are standard issue for all IDF infantry rifles but also used by marksmen attached to all infantry units.

Gupta provided the Guardian with CT scans of children with head wounds. These included one of an eight-year-old girl that a pathologist described as showing a “gunshot wound to the head entering right side with bullet in brain (medial right temporal lobe)”. Although doctors were shocked at the number of child victims, they said they believed the shootings were part of a broader pattern of targeting Palestinian civilians, including elderly people.

“The vast majority of people we saw were not combatants,” said Ahmad. “There was an elderly woman who was on the back of a donkey cart when she was shot. The bullet lodged in her spine and she was paralysed from the waist down and also her lung collapsed. She was somewhere between 60 and 70 years old.”

‘Sniper wounds were common’
Dr Osaid Alser helped organise a group of doctors outside Gaza to give long-distance guidance to the only Palestinian general surgeon remaining at Nasser hospital, who only had limited experience.

“Sniper wounds were common, and quadcopter gunshots as well,” said Alser, who grew up in Gaza City and now lives in Texas.

Doctors said that apparent sniper shots also account for numerous amputations and long-term disabilities, made all the worse in children because a bullet often causes more damage to small bodies.

Alser argued that it was often possible to distinguish sniper shots.

“When it’s a sniper, usually it’s a bigger bullet, which causes significantly more damage and has more shock-wave energy as compared to a smaller rifle or a pistol. If it’s a sniper, it may cause amputation of the limb because it will cause damage to the vascular structure – nerves, bone, soft tissue, everything,” he said.

“Another pattern is injury to the spinal cord when people are shot in the middle of the abdomen or in the middle of the back. Spinal cord injury is not necessarily fatal, unless it’s the neck, but it can be disabling.” Alser said that one of his elderly relatives, a pioneer of dentistry in Gaza, was among the apparent victims of a sniper.

Dr Mohammed Al Madhoun went missing after seeking medical treatment for a chronic condition at a charity hospital west of Gaza City in December. The 73-year-old’s body was found near the hospital a week later alongside that of his great-nephew. They had both been shot.

“The pattern of injury, and the amount of damage from the bullet, was significant, and that’s mainly caused by a sniper,” said Alser, who reviewed CT scans of the injury. “He was obviously old. You wouldn’t expect a 73-year-old to be a target, right?”

The doctor said the cases he reviewed remotely included other elderly people, among them a woman in her 70s.

“She was shot by a sniper and she had a massive head bleed. That is non-survivable. She died a day or two after,” he said.

In October, Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, described the IDF as “the most moral army in the world”. The Israeli military claims to be guided by a “purity of arms” doctrine that precludes soldiers from harming “uninvolved civilians”.

But Israeli and international human rights groups have long said that the military’s failure to enforce its own standards – and its willingness to cover up breaches – has contributed to a climate of impunity for soldiers who target civilians.

The groups say it is extremely difficult at this stage to quantify the scale of such shootings in Gaza, not least because their own staff are often displaced and under attack. But Miranda Cleland of Defense for Children International Palestine said that over the years there had been a “clear pattern of Israeli forces targeting Palestinian children with deadly force in situations where the children posed no threat to soldiers”.

“In the occupied West Bank, Israeli soldiers routinely shoot children in the head, chest or abdomen, all areas from which a child will quickly bleed out if they aren’t killed instantly. Many of these children are shot by Israeli forces from great distances, sometimes upwards of 500ft, which is something only a trained military sniper would be capable of,” she said.

An Israeli group, Breaking the Silence, collected testimonies from IDF soldiers in earlier conflicts who said they shot Palestinian civilians merely because they were where they were not supposed to be even though it was evident they were not combatants.

IDF snipers boasted about shooting unarmed Palestinian protesters, including young people, in the knees during nearly two years of demonstrations at the Gaza border fence from the spring of 2018. One former Israeli army sniper, who did not want to be named, told the Guardian that the IDF’s open-fire regulations were so broad that a soldier has extensive leeway to shoot at anyone once an area is declared a combat zone.

“The problem is the regulations that enable soldiers who just want to shoot Palestinians. In my experience, most soldiers who pull a trigger only want to kill those who should be killed but there are those who regard all the Arabs as the enemy and find any reason to shoot or no reason at all,” he said, adding that a system of impunity protects such soldiers.

“Even if they are outside the regulations, the system will protect them. The army will cover up. The other soldiers in the unit will not object or they will celebrate another dead Arab. There’s no accountability so even the loosest regulations have no real meaning.”

The Israeli human rights group B’Tselem has described the IDF’s open-fire regulations as “no more than a semblance of legality” in part because they are “repeatedly violated”.

“Other than a handful of cases, usually involving low-ranking soldiers, no one has been put on trial for harming Palestinians,” the group said.

In one of the most notorious cases of soldiers shooting young children in the occupied territories, an army captain fired the entire magazine of his automatic rifle into a 13-year-old Palestinian girl, Iman al-Hams, in 2004 after she crossed into a security zone even though she posed no immediate threat and his own soldiers told him she was “a little girl” who was “scared to death”. The captain was cleared of wrongdoing by a military court. The Israeli military also has a long history of covering up the killing of children.

After 11-year-old Khalil al-Mughrabi was shot dead as he played football in Rafah in 2001, the Israeli human rights organisation B’Tselem wrote to the IDF demanding an inquiry. Months later, the judge advocate general’s office told B’Tselem that Khalil was shot by soldiers who acted with “restraint and control” to disperse a riot in the area. However, the IDF made the mistake of attaching a copy of its secret internal investigation, which said the riot had been much earlier in the day and that soldiers who opened fire on the child were guilty of a “serious deviation from obligatory norms of behaviour”.

The chief military prosecutor, Col Einat Ron, then spelled out alternative false scenarios that should be offered to B’Tselem to cover up the crime.

More recently, the IDF was accused of lying to cover up the shooting of the Palestinian American journalist Shireen Abu Akleh, almost certainly by an Israeli sniper. The military at first blamed the Palestinians and then falsely claimed that Abu Akleh was caught in crossfire during a gun battle. Her employer, Al Jazeera, presented video evidence that there was no firefight and that at least one Israeli soldier was targeting the journalist. Alvi, the Canadian physician, left Gaza in the third week of February as Israeli forces were threatening a ground assault against Rafah. Alvi founded the US-based charity Humanity Auxilium, which has worked with Rohingya refugees in Bangladesh, displaced Syrians and earthquake survivors in Turkey.

“This is not a normal war. The war in Ukraine has killed 500 kids in two years and the war in Gaza has killed over 10,000 in less than five months. We have seen wars before but this is something that is a dark stain on our shared humanity.” The Guardian


Rami Halhouli had just lit a firework in East Jerusalem to celebrate the end of another day of Ramadan when his life was cut short.

As the 12-year-old hoisted the firework in the air, he was shot in the chest by Israeli police standing on a watchtower overlooking Shuafat refugee camp. Rami fell to the ground as the firework exploded and painted the night sky with a flash of red stars.

Israeli police said the firework was directed toward its forces and endangered them.

“He was just a little boy,” Rami’s father, Ali Halhouli, 61, said in an interview. “The watchtower was only 50 metres away. What harm could a firework possibly do? Why did they need to shoot him, aiming at his chest?”

In the aftermath of Rami’s death on 12 March a video of his last moments went viral.

Human rights activists have said the death shines a light on the sharp rise in the number of unjust killings of Palestinian children by Israeli forces since the Hamas attacks of 7 October.

Rami’s family think invoking the Gaza war is a distraction.

“My son would have been killed even if there was no war going on,” Halhouli said. “Because that’s how the Israeli military and police operate. It’s certainly not the first time this has happened.”

The video clip, filmed on a mobile phone by one of Rami’s friends, shows Rami, his brother, and four friends lighting fireworks. The boys are joking and laughing.

“I could hear them outside playing as they used to do every day,” Halhouli said. “Then I heard the sound of a bullet exploding. It wasn’t the noise of fireworks. Immediately I heard the screams of the boys. I rushed outside to see what had happened. I found my son Rami on the ground, his body lifeless. I thought he had been hit with a plastic bullet, because there was no blood. When I lifted his shirt, I saw he had a hole in his chest.” Halhouli said he rushed his son to a medical facility in Shuafat and then arranged for an ambulance to take him to Hadassah hospital, where doctors determined that a bullet had stopped his heart.

“A doctor told me that the bullet that killed my son was not just any bullet, but one of those that explode after penetrating the victim’s body,” he said. “They told me I had some time to be with him before the police took his body away. I covered him with a blanket and lay down next to him, my head close to his.”

But two hours later, a police officer ordered Halhouli to move away from the body and leave the hospital. Halhouli said he tried to demand an explanation for the order but was pushed against a wall and forced to leave the building. Rami’s body was transferred to an Israeli forensic institute for an autopsy and returned to the family a week later. Israeli authorities ordered that the funeral be held with no more than 40 people in attendance.

Israeli police have acknowledged that they shot Rami, saying their forces returned fire after fireworks were launched at the watchtower. Police also said there had been reports of Palestinian protesters from the camp throwing molotov cocktails through the night on 11 and 12 March.

Video of the incident shows Rami pointing the firework in the rough direction of the watchtower, but not directly at it.

Makhash, the Israeli justice ministry unit responsible for investigating police actions, told the Associated Press that an investigation into the shooting was taking place. In a Telegram post shortly after the shooting, Itamar Ben-Gvir, the ultra-nationalist minister for national security, hailed the officer who fired at Rami. “I salute the soldier who killed the terrorist who tried to shoot fireworks at him and the troops – this is exactly how you should act against terrorists – with determination and precision,” Ben-Gvir said.

“My son a terrorist? He was just a little child,” Rami’s mother, Rawiya, said this week as she embraced a photo of her son.

“He was a happy child. I still can’t believe he’s gone. I can’t believe he’s dead. Sometimes I turn around in the room, and I feel like he should appear. I haven’t got used to the idea that he’s not here any more. I want to meet this soldier and ask him: Why did you do it? Why did you shoot?”

According to the Palestinian health ministry, about 444 Palestinians from East Jerusalem and the West Bank have been killed by Israeli fire since 7 October. At least 112 were children.

Although police officers and soldiers on active duty seldom face prosecution for the deaths of Palestinians, Rami’s parents said they were prepared to report the shooting to the authorities and take the Israeli police to court.

“We will not give up,” Halhouli said. “I owe it to my son. I will not have peace for the rest of my life until justice be done.” The Guardian
#15310404
late wrote:Israel has pretended to be something it clearly is not.


I think Israel has pretended to be something it's not for a Western liberal audience, with the aid of the mainstream media and politicians here and much propaganda. But the early Zionists were very clear about their intentions to colonize and displace and all the racism they had towards the natives, etc. Just read them in their own words, Golda Meir, Hertzl etc., they were fascistic as hell..

The difference today is that people are increasingly waking up to it, people who a year ago believed the bullshit about Israel being the "only democracy blah blah" because ethnosupremacist apartheid states are very democratic, yes. :|

wat0n wrote:The only reason there's no way to blame Hamas is that Netanyahu himself admitted the IDF did it.


It's always the Israelis, they are the ones that attack and kill aid workers, hospital staff, journalists, and children, every day, right in front of our eyes.

I think the fact that at least three of these aid workers were working for Brit intel might have contributed to the Israeli apology for this targeted murder. I think the Brits and Poles, at least, have recalled their ambassadors. I guess a genocide of over 30,000 is fine...until "our guys in the field" are hurt. :|
#15310410
Well, at least no one but Israel is on the ground to get the hostages back or over their citizens who were killed by Hamas.

ingliz wrote:No.

Every weapon leaves a signature.

When asked by the BBC Chris Cobb-Smith, a former British Army officer and ex-UN weapons inspector, said the attack was probably carried out using drone-launched *Israeli* Spike missiles.


:)


If it was that easy, there would have been no reassessments regarding the Al-Ashli blast.
#15310426
wat0n wrote:Well, at least no one but Israel is on the ground to get the hostages back or over their citizens who were killed by Hamas.


Israel doesn't care about the hostages. They know that - some of the freed hostages have said as much - and their families know that and anyone paying attention can see that. Israel would prefer them dead, no doubt..because they don't like being forced a bargaining chip, which by the way they're refusing the bargain with, but that's by the by.

If it was that easy, there would have been no reassessments regarding the Al-Ashli blast.


If you mean the Baptist hospital blast that killed hundreds, that was clearly the Israelis because:

1. Palestinian resistance don't have weapons that can kill hundreds. They don't even have weapons that can kill 10 people.
2. Israelis warned the hospital to evacuate repeatedly and even bombed it a few days before this major massacre.
3. We can see with our own eyes WHICH SIDE attacks hospitals, aid workers, journalists, medics, children etc.
4. Stop acting like Goebbels.
5. Etc.
#15310430
skinster wrote:Israel doesn't care about the hostages. They know that - some of the freed hostages have said as much - and their families know that and anyone paying attention can see that. Israel would prefer them dead, no doubt..because they don't like being forced a bargaining chip, which by the way they're refusing the bargain with, but that's by the by.


Israel has already traded prisoners for bodies in the past. And it seems it cares more about those British and American hostages than their own countries.

skinster wrote:If you mean the Baptist hospital blast that killed hundreds, that was clearly the Israelis because:

1. Palestinian resistance don't have weapons that can kill hundreds. They don't even have weapons that can kill 10 people.


Nonsense. One of those rockets, if it falls where many people are at, can kill them. Also, it is also not true 471 were killed.

This is also the assessment by independent agencies.

skinster wrote:2. Israelis warned the hospital to evacuate repeatedly and even bombed it a few days before this major massacre.


Yet it did not bomb it that day.

skinster wrote:3. We can see with our own eyes WHICH SIDE attacks hospitals, aid workers, journalists, medics, children etc.


Hamas has done all that from October 7 onwards. The Barzilai hospital in Ashkelon has been hit by rockets several times now.

skinster wrote:4. Stop acting like Goebbels.
5. Etc.


Nice projection you got there.
#15310446
wat0n wrote:Israel has already traded prisoners for bodies in the past. And it seems it cares more about those British and American hostages than their own countries.


Most of the remaining hostages, if not all, are from the army. The Israeli govt doesn't care for them. :lol:

Nonsense. One of those rockets, if it falls where many people are at, can kill them. Also, it is also not true 471 were killed.


Show me when a single Palestinian rocket killed more than 10 people.

This is also the assessment by independent agencies.


No, that's you just saying it is.

Yet it did not bomb it that day.


Yes it did, killing hundreds.

Hamas has done all that from October 7 onwards. The Barzilai hospital in Ashkelon has been hit by rockets several times now.


Hit with three rockets according to this report and nobody was killed, even though the director in the report was apparently there. I don't think this is reinforcing any of your points of view here. :lol:

Nice projection you got there.


You are PoFo's Resident Goebbels; lying constantly and repeating your lies in an attempt to make them true, in defence of genocide..
#15310456
skinster wrote:Most of the remaining hostages, if not all, are from the army. The Israeli govt doesn't care for them. :lol:


There are still civilians who have yet to return. Indeed, those would be released first if there's a ceasefire agreement.

skinster wrote:Show me when a single Palestinian rocket killed more than 10 people.


Al Ahli.

skinster wrote:No, that's you just saying it is.


skinster wrote:Yes it did, killing hundreds.


Hmmm? Even the Associated Press, along with several governments, believe Al Ahli was hit by one of the many rockets that misfire.

skinster wrote:Hit with three rockets according to this report and nobody was killed, even though the director in the report was apparently there. I don't think this is reinforcing any of your points of view here. :lol:


The hospital was hit 3 times.

Patients were moved to the bunkers as the sirens sounded or evacuated further north.

skinster wrote:You are PoFo's Resident Goebbels; lying constantly and repeating your lies in an attempt to make them true, in defence of genocide..


I would say you have been constantly lying and changing the goalposts here. I don't forget that you went from demanding a rape victim to show up denouncing her rape to demanding rape footage once a former hostage showed up denouncing she was raped.

It means you were lying about your supposed "standard" earlier.
#15310485
Pants-of-dog wrote:Like I said, a religious belief that is held as true without evidence.


This may have been the case many generations ago. But now, the children of rich-cults are simply regurgitating group lies for money and for Omerta.

Zombie jews acting out second-hand chauvinism that was handed down and made a mandatory condition of receiving your trust fund...

The religious aspect was replaced by "loyalty to free cash."
#15310501


wat0n wrote:There are still civilians who have yet to return. Indeed, those would be released first if there's a ceasefire agreement.


No, they are all soldiers remaining. All the civilians were freed in November.

Al Ahli.


No, show me a single time a Palestinian rocket killed more than 10 people. Not when Israeli weapons targeted the Baptist hospital and killed hundreds. The point of me asking you this is to show that Palestinian rockets are actually not very effective and have never killed more than a handful of people at one time. In fact, I don't even know when a Palestinian rocket killed more than two people at one time. Maybe I'll make this easier for you by asking a time when Palestinian rockets killed more than two Israelis?

The hospital was hit 3 times.

Patients were moved to the bunkers as the sirens sounded or evacuated further north.


I read the report. My point was that Palestinian rockets are not very effective beyond usually some physical damage to buildings and terrorising Israelis. They rarely kill and they've absolutely never would kill hundreds like what we saw at the Christian hospital where Israelis threatened and bombed days before and then bombed again, killing hundreds.

It's pretty sick that you push this really blatant lie but at least it is a good display of the sickness that is the Zionist mind.

As we have seen repeatedly in this genocide and previous wars on Gaza, only one side attacks hospitals.

I would say you have been constantly lying and changing the goalposts here. I don't forget that you went from demanding a rape victim to show up denouncing her rape to demanding rape footage once a former hostage showed up denouncing she was raped.


Anyone who knows me and my posting history/politics knows I'd never defend rape or "demand" to "see footage", shit you pulled out of your ass and when I asked you to quote me on that you didn't because you made it all up.

At most I've shared news debunking the claims of "mass" or "systemic rape on Oct 7" because as we have seen, it has been bullshit. The only claim of rape coming from a hostage who, after speaking a few times to the public and not mentioning it following when she was freed, reported she had been raped right after the story of IDF terrorists gang-raping a Palestinian woman in front of her husband and kids - who they threatened to kill if they didn't watch their wife/mother being raped - in Al-Shifa hospital. You can see given all the Zionists Crying Rape stories that have got debunked, we might be a bit skeptical about this new one from a hostage who said nothing about rape when she was first freed, even though she said a lot of other stuff...

Besides, her story, if true - and I do doubt it is given the above - doesn't prove there was "systemic" or "mass rape" on Oct 7 because 1) it didn't happen on Oct 7 and 2) her account claims the rapist of the story deviated from typical protocol by raping her and 3) this is quite clearly a bullshit story and Zionists do not get the benefit of the doubt as they cry crocodile tears of made-up rape while cheerleading for genocide. Capish?
#15310506
skinster wrote:No, they are all soldiers remaining. All the civilians were freed in November.


So for instance Kfir Bibas is a soldier now?

:roll:

skinster wrote:No, show me a single time a Palestinian rocket killed more than 10 people. Not when Israeli weapons targeted the Baptist hospital and killed hundreds. The point of me asking you this is to show that Palestinian rockets are actually not very effective and have never killed more than a handful of people at one time. In fact, I don't even know when a Palestinian rocket killed more than two people at one time. Maybe I'll make this easier for you by asking a time when Palestinian rockets killed more than two Israelis?


Have you ever considered that Hamas evidently does not report the people killed by its own rockets within Gaza and that Israel's low death toll is due to the measures they take to protect their population?

skinster wrote:I read the report. My point was that Palestinian rockets are not very effective beyond usually some physical damage to buildings and terrorising Israelis. They rarely kill and they've absolutely never would kill hundreds like what we saw at the Christian hospital where Israelis threatened and bombed days before and then bombed again, killing hundreds.

It's pretty sick that you push this really blatant lie but at least it is a good display of the sickness that is the Zionist mind.

As we have seen repeatedly in this genocide and previous wars on Gaza, only one side attacks hospitals.


...Unless, of course, the rockets directly hit people camping in the parking lot that was hit by the rocket at hand. Again, most military assessments are that Al Ahli was hit by a rocket.

skinster wrote:Anyone who knows me and my posting history/politics knows I'd never defend rape or "demand" to "see footage", shit you pulled out of your ass and when I asked you to quote me on that you didn't because you made it all up.

At most I've shared news debunking the claims of "mass" or "systemic rape on Oct 7" because as we have seen, it has been bullshit. The only claim of rape coming from a hostage who, after speaking a few times to the public and not mentioning it following when she was freed, reported she had been raped right after the story of IDF terrorists gang-raping a Palestinian woman in front of her husband and kids - who they threatened to kill if they didn't watch their wife/mother being raped - in Al-Shifa hospital. You can see given all the Zionists Crying Rape stories that have got debunked, we might be a bit skeptical about this new one from a hostage who said nothing about rape when she was first freed, even though she said a lot of other stuff...

Besides, her story, if true - and I do doubt it is given the above - doesn't prove there was "systemic" or "mass rape" on Oct 7 because 1) it didn't happen on Oct 7 and 2) her account claims the rapist of the story deviated from typical protocol by raping her and 3) this is quite clearly a bullshit story and Zionists do not get the benefit of the doubt as they cry crocodile tears of made-up rape while cheerleading for genocide. Capish?


And more lies now, yes, you did want to see rape footage as a precondition to believe Amit Soussana.

That the usual feminist tropes don't count when the victim is an Israeli is quite evident.
#15310519
wat0n wrote:So for instance Kfir Bibas is a soldier now?


Kfir Bibas was released.

Have you ever considered that Hamas evidently does not report the people killed by its own rockets within Gaza and that Israel's low death toll is due to the measures they take to protect their population?


I wasn't asking for Palestinian sources, I was asking you to show a single time a Palestinian rocket has killed more than two people. I mean, even more than one person at this stage would be good.

I guess you can't show that.

And you want us to believe that it was a Palestinian rocket that killed hundreds of Palestinians in the Christian hospital in Gaza in one shot? The same hospital IDF terrorists threatened to bomb and did bomb just three days before this massacre that killed hundreds?

Even though Palestinian resistance factions don't have a history of bombing hospitals nor does it make sense that the first time they had the capability to kill hundreds, they decided to turn it on themselves?

:lol:

Jesus, are you embarrassing.

...Unless, of course, the rockets directly hit people camping in the parking lot that was hit by the rocket at hand. Again, most military assessments are that Al Ahli was hit by a rocket.


By Israelis. This attempt to blame Palestinians even though the Israelis admitted it was them immediately after, until they realised it killed hundreds and then denied and tried to shift blame.

Why must you lie and lie and lie?

And more lies now, yes, you did want to see rape footage as a precondition to believe Amit Soussana.


If true, you could quote me where I said anything about seeing any footage. But you still can't, because you're a compulsive liar.

That the usual feminist tropes don't count when the victim is an Israeli is quite evident.


:violin:
#15310523
skinster wrote:Kfir Bibas was released.


He wasn't.

skinster wrote:I wasn't asking for Palestinian sources, I was asking you to show a single time a Palestinian rocket has killed more than two people. I mean, even more than one person at this stage would be good.

I guess you can't show that.

And you want us to believe that it was a Palestinian rocket that killed hundreds of Palestinians in the Christian hospital in Gaza in one shot? The same hospital IDF terrorists threatened to bomb and did bomb just three days before this massacre that killed hundreds?

Even though Palestinian resistance factions don't have a history of bombing hospitals nor does it make sense that the first time they had the capability to kill hundreds, they decided to turn it on themselves?

:lol:

Jesus, are you embarrassing.


You are just repeating yourself now. And also contradicting yourself, since now you say the Palestinian factions don't have a history of bombing hospitals to then say that when they do nobody dies.

:roll:

skinster wrote:By Israelis. This attempt to blame Palestinians even though the Israelis admitted it was them immediately after, until they realised it killed hundreds and then denied and tried to shift blame.

Why must you lie and lie and lie?


Or maybe, just maybe, the impact is not consistent with an artillery shell or missile.

skinster wrote:If true, you could quote me where I said anything about seeing any footage. But you still can't, because you're a compulsive liar.


skinster wrote:https://twitter.com/AliAbunimah/status/1772726638540620286

There is no footage of it. Every rape accusation by the Israelis has been debunked. And this new one from today will be too, because I suspect if it were true, we would've heard about it.

The reason why I'm quick to dismiss these claims is because 1) Zionists lie as they breathe 2) we've seen reports of Israeli propagandists instructing people like you to keep going on about rape in an attempt to distract from the genocide 3) the New York Times reports have all been debunked including by family of one of these "rape" victims.

I know this is the only issue you have going for yourself to distract from genocide and while some may fall for it, I know what people like you are like and it won't work. And increasingly, the average person is seeing what liars you are. I hope they pay you well for your attempts to distract from a genocide that everyone with eyes can see.


Not that the footage would have helped, there is footage of Hamas and/or the other factions shooting at civilians trying to pick up aid in Rafah (no Israeli presence there) and you still don't believe that. Same for the other footage showing executions of Israeli civilians by the aforementioned factions on October 7th.

skinster wrote: :violin:


You are just reaffirming my point.
#15310581
wat0n wrote:He wasn't.


Ah, he's the kid the IDF killed in airstrikes, my bad. His father in a video that was released by the resistance confirmed that. So you're still incorrect about the remaining hostages. They're all military or government, the remaining hostages.

You are just repeating yourself now. And also contradicting yourself, since now you say the Palestinian factions don't have a history of bombing hospitals to then say that when they do nobody dies.


This is your poor attempt to show that Palestinian rockets cannot kill hundreds of people in one shot, like what happened to the Baptist hospital. You can't even find a time Palestinian rockets hit two people. So maybe stop lying about that. Besides, the world can see who repeatedly targets hospitals, places them under siege, kills medics, etc.etc.etc.

They lie and they lie and they lie and they lie

Not that the footage would have helped, there is footage of Hamas and/or the other factions shooting at civilians trying to pick up aid in Rafah (no Israeli presence there) and you still don't believe that.


What you shared was footage of just shooting taking place, but no idea who was doing the shooting. Blaming the resistance is dumb because the resistance are putting their lives on the line for their people, they don't kill their own like the Israelis...they don't have policies like the Hannibal Directive like what the Israelis do...this is just projection on your part as is often the case.

Still, we found out by Al Jazeera's publishing of this today, who was shooting (and killing) starving Palestinians who were attempting to collect aid.


Every accusation is a confession

Same for the other footage showing executions of Israeli civilians by the aforementioned factions on October 7th.


That did happen to IDF terrorists, yes. But for the most part, the resistance was ordered to collect hostages like how the Yemenis collect ships.....and then we found out the IDF killed a bunch of their own on Oct 7th, that they were shelling from tanks and bombing from helicopters into the kibbutz, as well as shooting indiscriminately at people at the Nova festival. All the latter has been confirmed by Israelis who were at both of these places. I have shared reports on these already but if you would like me to do so again, just ask.

You are just reaffirming my point.


The violin playing is for your phony victimhood about rape where there wasn't any.

This from Norman Finkelstein today:

Norman Finkelstein wrote:The paradox is the Pramilla Patten report ended up being the most compelling evidence that there wasn’t widespread rape and sexual violence on Oct 7.

Now you might be wondering how could that be? All the media were saying, here is the proof. We have the proof. We have the smoking gun, the Pramilla Patten report. But what did the Pramilla Patten report show?

Number one, they were suppled overwhelmingly with their evidence from the Israeli government. So you conclude, not just infer, you conclude Israel made its best case to them. Correct? What was Israel’s best case? They looked at not less than 5000 photographs, and they looked at 50 full hours of digital footage.

They told us, or Patten told us: the footage came from web cams, dash cams, CCTV, traffic monitors, which is to say, they looked at footage taken from every conceivable angle by every conceivable technological device, and you have to remember, that area was abutting Gaza, which means it must have been among the most heavily surveilled areas in all of Israel. And here’s the upshot, the kicker, they said in the report: they couldn’t find one single image or frame of sexual violence. Not one! And this was Israel’s best case!




So that violin is apt.

You can't polish a turd(Israel), wat0n. Why do you waste your time and energy doing so when you're not even a real Zionist, since you're sitting somewhere in Latin America, rather than Israel. I guess it's clear to you too that Israel's shelf life is near..
#15310589
skinster wrote:Ah, he's the kid the IDF killed in airstrikes, my bad. His father in a video that was released by the resistance confirmed that. So you're still incorrect about the remaining hostages. They're all military or government, the remaining hostages.


Even more bullshitting. Hamas has not confirmed if they are dead or alive, or anything of the sort :roll:

skinster wrote:This is your poor attempt to show that Palestinian rockets cannot kill hundreds of people in one shot, like what happened to the Baptist hospital. You can't even find a time Palestinian rockets hit two people. So maybe stop lying about that. Besides, the world can see who repeatedly targets hospitals, places them under siege, kills medics, etc.etc.etc.

They lie and they lie and they lie and they lie


And more lies on your end, pretending that the Barzilai hospital was not attacked with rockets.

skinster wrote:What you shared was footage of just shooting taking place, but no idea who was doing the shooting. Blaming the resistance is dumb because the resistance are putting their lives on the line for their people, they don't kill their own like the Israelis...they don't have policies like the Hannibal Directive like what the Israelis do...this is just projection on your part as is often the case.

Still, we found out by Al Jazeera's publishing of this today, who was shooting (and killing) starving Palestinians who were attempting to collect aid.


Every accusation is a confession


"We don't know who was doing the shooting"? We do know it was not the IDF, simply because the IDF does not have a ground presence in Rafah.

Again, even footage won't convince you :roll:

skinster wrote:That did happen to IDF terrorists, yes. But for the most part, the resistance was ordered to collect hostages like how the Yemenis collect ships.....and then we found out the IDF killed a bunch of their own on Oct 7th, that they were shelling from tanks and bombing from helicopters into the kibbutz, as well as shooting indiscriminately at people at the Nova festival. All the latter has been confirmed by Israelis who were at both of these places. I have shared reports on these already but if you would like me to do so again, just ask.


I said civilians, not just IDF soldiers. You know, something like:



skinster wrote:The violin playing is for your phony victimhood about rape where there wasn't any.

This from Norman Finkelstein today:





So that violin is apt.


Do you really think a fraud like Finkelstein will get you anywhere?

skinster wrote:You can't polish a turd(Israel), wat0n. Why do you waste your time and energy doing so when you're not even a real Zionist, since you're sitting somewhere in Latin America, rather than Israel. I guess it's clear to you too that Israel's shelf life is near..


I don't take advice from degenerates who want rape videos to masturbate. And I don't live in Latin America anymore by the way.
#15311713
wat0n wrote:...I don't take advice from degenerates who want rape videos to masturbate. ...

If your school guidance counselor watches rape videos to masturbate, how would you ever know this?
(I assume you're in Middle School)

In other words, you have no idea what the people you "take advice from" do every day.

And this is why you are defending the genocide of a people that has existed in Palestine for millennia. You don't know where this advice (hasbara) is really coming from.

You just want your paycheque and so you don't ask any uncomfortable questions.
#15311715
QatzelOk wrote:If your school guidance counselor watches rape videos to masturbate, how would you ever know this?
(I assume you're in Middle School)


Maybe I would become suspicious of a person demanding to watch that type of footage. Duh.

QatzelOk wrote:In other words, you have no idea what the people you "take advice from" do every day.


QatzelOk wrote:You just want your paycheque and so you don't ask any uncomfortable questions.


You could actually take your own advice here for once.

QatzelOk wrote:And this is why you are defending the genocide of a people that has existed in Palestine for millennia. You don't know where this advice (hasbara) is really coming from.


I also don't take ethical advice from people who defend scalping children and factual advice from Holocaust deniers.
  • 1
  • 42
  • 43
  • 44
  • 45
  • 46

Well whatever dude. Clearly you are determined to[…]

The op is literally just an attempt to explain lo[…]

How Transphobic Are You?

This is because studies, like all knowledge of the[…]

Russia-Ukraine War 2022

Europe re-militarizes is the only one way to go, […]