[Ter]

Look at how Arab world's first ever democratically elected government Muslim Brotherhood was replaced by İsrael- Western backed dictator.

Yes, that is how Islamists gain power, by having the one and only fair election. Once they gain power, democratic elections are history. The same thing happened in Algeria. Luckily, both in Algeria and Egypt, rational minds prevailed.

[Zagadka]

Come for the murdered journalists, stay for the massive civilian deaths.

[Potemkin]

Yes, that is how Islamists gain power, by having the one and only fair election. Once they gain power, democratic elections are history. The same thing happened in Algeria. Luckily, both in Algeria and Egypt, rational minds prevailed.

This is why any attempt to impose "freedom" and "democracy" on the Middle East by force of arms is either idiotic or dishonest, and is doomed to failure in either case. There's no guarantee the people are going to vote the way you want them to vote. And clearly, if the people don't vote the way we want them to, then the elections are 'invalid' and we must restore 'order' by invading them. Lol.

It reminds me of Brecht's cynical quip after a workers' uprising was violently suppressed in East Germany in 1956: "The government has lost confidence in the people, and must therefore elect a new one!"

[One Degree]

Also, while @One Degree considers trade with Saudi Arabia important, he wouldn't mind cutting trade with Europe or abolishing global trade as a whole.

Actually, I don’t care about trade with Saudi Arabia. This does not mean it is not a pragmatic position for Trump. It is also pragmatic not to trade with those who require ‘commonality of beliefs’ as a requirement. This takes away free choice from your own people.
I have never said global trade should be abolished, just limited to what we can’t do for ourselves.

[Beren]

I have never said global trade should be abolished, just limited to what we can’t do for ourselves.

And what can't you do for yourselves?

You advocate autarky basically, while arguing that Trump's just pragmatic with the Saudis.

[One Degree]

And what can't you do for yourselves?

I can’t create rare minerals where they don’t exist. I can’t create arts of other cultures.

[Beren]

Some good pro-Saudi slogan should be created, like Israel's the only democracy in the Middle East. I wonder whether what that could be, Evangelicals should come up with something perhaps.

[One Degree]

Some good pro-Saudi slogan should be created, like Israel's the only democracy in the Middle East. I wonder whether what that could be, Evangelicals should come up with something perhaps.

It is a belief in our own superiority that makes us think other cultures must justify themselves to us.

[Beren]

The Saudis don't really justify anything. They deny everything first, then admit what they have to later, just like the POTUS does. They could be Americans in that regard and it proves there must be something common in your cultures to have good relations with each other.

[One Degree]

The Saudis don't really justify anything. They deny everything first, then admit what they have to later, just like the POTUS does. They could be Americans in that regard and it proves there must be something common in your cultures to have good relations with each other.

They are just making concessions to the ‘idiocy of liberal superiority’ that currently controls the world. The Saudis and Trump would love to tell others to kiss their ass, but they see no need to suffer the economic repercussions dictated by the current emotionalism in government.

[Beren]

They are just making concessions to the ‘idiocy of liberal superiority’ that currently controls the world. The Saudis and Trump would love to tell others to kiss their ass, but they see no need to suffer the economic repercussions dictated by the current emotionalism in government.

They're making concessions when it becomes undeniable that they lied and their position is untenable, I wonder if that has anything to do with the ‘idiocy of liberal superiority’ that currently controls the world. Is it a liberal value perhaps that lying is bad while Conservatives only consider it emotionalism?

[One Degree]

They're making concessions when it becomes undeniable that they lied and their position is untenable, I wonder if that has anything to do with the ‘idiocy of liberal superiority’ that currently controls the world. Is it a liberal value perhaps that lying is bad while Conservatives only consider it emotionalism?

The only reason to lie is because the truth is unacceptable to ‘liberal superiority’. There is no reason why it should be other than their own superiority. What would the reaction be if the Saudis just said, “yeah, we killed him, so what?”?

[Beren]

The only reason to lie is because the truth is unacceptable to ‘liberal superiority’. There is no reason why it should be other than their own superiority. What would the reaction be if the Saudis just said, “yeah, we killed him, so what?”?

What would be your reaction?

Would it be 'I'm not a Liberal, so I don't feel superior to anyone, which means I don't care'?

[One Degree]

What would be your reaction?

Would it be 'I'm not a Liberal, so I don't feel superior to anyone, which means I don't care'?

Yes. If you admit you are not their superior, then you have no reason to judge them. It is up to those actually living there to make those judgements. You either believe in autonomy or you don’t. Autonomy by my rules is not autonomy.

Edit: @Beren
We currently have an example of our hypocrisy on this. We want the Saudis punished for killing a man, but not the Sentilinese. Why is that? Why do we think one culture should be autonomous and not another?

[Beren]

Yes. If you admit you are not their superior, then you have no reason to judge them. It is up to those actually living there to make those judgements. You either believe in autonomy or you don’t. Autonomy by my rules is not autonomy.

So you just don't have a reason to judge them for committing homicide because you're not superior to them or you're not their superior? Also, the guy was killed just because he dared to criticise the Saudi regime, I guess this is just okay as well if you're not a Liberal.

[One Degree]

So you just don't have a reason to judge them for committing homicide because you're not superior to them or you're not their superior? Also, the guy was killed just because he dared to criticise the Saudi regime, I guess this is just okay as well if you're not a Liberal.

My edit I added above...
We currently have an example of our hypocrisy on this. We want the Saudis punished for killing a man, but not the Sentilinese. Why is that? Why do we think one culture should be autonomous and not another?

[Beren]

My edit I added above...
We currently have an example of our hypocrisy on this. We want the Saudis punished for killing a man, but not the Sentilinese. Why is that? Why do we think one culture should be autonomous and not another?

Sure, there's hypocrisy. However, trapping and murdering someone just because he criticised you is just a matter of cultural autonomy for you that everybody should respect and only Liberal idiots don't?

[One Degree]

Sure, there's hypocrisy. However, trapping and murdering someone just because he criticised you is just a matter of cultural autonomy for you that everybody should respect and only Liberal idiots don't?

Give me a reason to judge them other than a belief in my own superiority?

[Beren]

Give me a reason to judge them other than a belief in my own superiority?

A moral compass perhaps? Which you obviously believe to be a false Liberal concept based on a false concept of superiority.

[One Degree]

A moral compass perhaps? Which you obviously believe to be a false Liberal concept based on a false concept of superiority.

Exactly and your ‘knife’ shows you want to enforce your superiority even though you recognize it for what it is.