DPP Rejects "One China, Two Systems"; KMT Vice-Chairman Visits Fujian China - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

Talk about what you've seen in the news today.

Moderator: PoFo Today's News Mods

Two stories, happening at the same time today (Wednesday/Thursday August 10/11 2022):

Financial Times wrote:[...]

Andrew Hsia, a veteran diplomat who served as the country’s top China policy official in the last Kuomintang (KMT) government, justified the visit as an attempt to support Taiwanese citizens living in China.

“We have not made any plans to meet Chinese officials, although it is, of course, possible that they will reach out or we might encounter them in the context of our meetings with Taiwanese businesses,” he told the Financial Times before his departure on Wednesday morning for Xiamen in China’s south-eastern Fujian province.

Although the KMT said the visit had been planned for weeks and was unrelated to the crisis in the Taiwan Strait, it will probably prove highly contentious in Taiwan.

Taiwan’s cabinet-level China policy body said it had strongly advised against Hsia’s visit. “This move will cause domestic controversy and anxiety, high public misgivings and affect our internal unity. It will also confuse and mislead the international community’s perception of the threat Taiwan faces,” it said.

“China may ease the military movements a little now that they got the KMT to visit, but they will keep up the pressure,” said Chiu Chui-cheng, the body’s deputy chair.


Zhu Feng, an international relations professor at Nanjing University, said: “The mainland military exercise is not over yet. It is a very important gesture for the vice-chair of the Kuomintang to come to the mainland. The two sides need to strengthen communication, especially in the current situation.”

Beijing claims Taiwan as its territory and threatens to take it by force if the island resists unification indefinitely. The Chinese Communist party has tried to use the KMT to undermine the authority of Taiwan’s government. [Editorial Note: :lol: ]

https://www.ft.com/content/357828f1-10f ... 167823ffdf

Reuters wrote:TAIPEI, Aug 11 (Reuters) - Taiwan rejects the "one country, two systems" model proposed by Beijing in a white paper published this week, the self-ruled island's foreign ministry said on Thursday.

Only Taiwan's people can decide its future, ministry spokeswoman Joanne Ou told a news conference in Taipei, the capital.

China was using U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's visit to Taipei as an "excuse to create a new normality to intimidate Taiwan's people," Ou added.

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-paci ... 022-08-11/

The CPC continues to believe a peaceful reunification is possible with Taiwan, but likely only under a KMT government that can renew cross-strait relations and talks. A more likely strategy toward reunification that the CPC will pursue is supporting the KMT in electoral campaigns, as well as providing trade deals and easing cross-strait travel and business restrictions during times the KMT is in power. This was seen during the last KMT government, which ended in 2016. Millions of Taiwanese work in Mainland China or have; the DPP recently passed a series of laws prohibiting engineers and other workers in key industries from working in Mainland China in order to stem brain drain to the mainland as they cannot compete with Chinese salaries. China sees this all as positive.

The KMT currently receives around 30% support in Taiwan. It's support is generally from older individuals and decreasing. The DPP is much more popular today. This trajectory is unlikely to change in the forseeable future, barring massive economic downturn in Taiwan.

Support for outright declaration of independence in Taiwan is more popular among DPP supporters than the average Taiwanese, but still is below 12%. Most wish to maintain the status quo, likely out of fear of the Mainland's response to a declaration of independence.

Most Chinese, in polls, support reunification with Taiwan. Most Chinese, in polls, also oppose violent confrontation with Taiwan or a military attack on Taiwan at the present.
Rugoz wrote:What's newsworthy about this drivel.


The government making a statement undermining "one country two systems" at the same time that the deputy head of the largest opposition party is making a foreign visit to the PRC... just a day after some of the most contentious cross-strait relations in the past decade... isn't newsworthy to you?
The Kuomintang supports the idea of one China, in accordance with the 1992 Consensus. It just doesn't necessarily accept the idea of reunification on Beijing's terms of " One China, Two Systems. Kuomintang leader, Chang Ya-chung , has stated that he favors a rapprochement with the PRC . I feel that if such a reunion between the PRC and the ROC were to transpire it might even precipitate a reconnection between the Kuomintang and it's PRC counterpart the Revolutionary Committee of the Chinese Kuomintang. At any rate, the future of Taiwan should be determined by its people, and not be subject to pressure from foreign powers. https://sputniknews.com/20210921/pro-reunification-candidate-chang-ya-chung-edges-ahead-as-chairman-election-in-taiwans-kmt-nears-1089283979.html , https://www.airuniversity.af.edu/CASI/Display/Article/3123062/itow-the-taiwan-question-and-chinas-reunification-in-the-new-era/ , https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/19thcpcnationalcongress/2010-10/20/content_29714503.htm , https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2019/01/07/beijings-goal-is-re-unification-with-taiwan-why-cant-it-get-there/
Fasces wrote:The government making a statement undermining "one country two systems" at the same time that the deputy head of the largest opposition party is making a foreign visit to the PRC... just a day after some of the most contentious cross-strait relations in the past decade... isn't newsworthy to you?

The only one who undermined "one country, two systems" is China.

As for the KMT visit. I don't see the significance. Taiwan will have to deal with China one way or the other. A less confrontational approach might be preferable. Whatever delusions China has about using the KMT as a Trojan horse are irrelevant.
What about a compromise? Why not respect China's demand that Taiwan doesn't become a recognised sovereign independent country?

My suggestion would be that Taiwan becomes the 51st state of the United States. This could make everyone happy. Fascist China would be happy that Taiwan is not an independent internationally recognised nation. Taiwan wouldn't need to have conscription as they could be fully integrated into the United States defense system. And the US would now have Taiwan's vital advanced technological manufacturing included in its borders.
Surveys reveal that up to 12% of the country supports unification with China, including five of its citizens in a Taipei restaurant.
At a Cantonese restaurant in Taipei, Harry Chen and four old friends are shouting at each other over a Lazy Susan, stopping occasionally to toast each other with Scottish whiskey or translate their argument into English.

All are retired men in their 70s – the sons of Chinese nationalist soldiers – and were born or grew up in Taiwan during its brutal decades of martial law.

They are the demographic considered most likely to support the “unification” of Taiwan with China. And they do – mostly. But the issue is complicated: Taiwan functions domestically as an entirely independent country, with its own democratically elected government, currency, military and vibrant civil society.

However, the Chinese Communist party (CCP) believes it is a province of China that must be “reunified” with the mainland – peacefully by preference, but by force if necessary.

Despite threats and intimidation by Beijing and its military, Taiwan’s resistance to unification only grows stronger. More and more people are also identifying themselves as exclusively Taiwanese, not exclusively Chinese or both. More are showing support for independence. But this month a poll in Taiwan found almost 12% of respondents still support unification. Other surveys have shown that figure to be about 5%-10%. The number has declined over the years but a stubborn segment saying yes to “one China” suggests a sizeable group of people in Taiwan are not being pushed towards independence like so many of their compatriots. Some analysts also say this group could be enough to vote hardline pro-China candidates – some of whom also have connections to organised crime - into local government.

Given the military drills and the threats to Taiwan, and the deteriorating freedoms and rights inside China, it is a fair question to ask why anyone in Taiwan would want to go back to life under authoritarian rule, decades after they left it behind.

“People’s understanding of unification has changed quite a lot over the decades,” said Jeremy Huai-Che Chiang, a Taipei-based analyst. Nowadays, people in Taiwan tend to view the prospect of unification through the prism of Hong Kong. There is little trust for President Xi Jinping’s promises – reiterated in a recent white paper – that they would retain anything close to the freedom and autonomy they have now.

Taiwanese politics is famously combative and starkly divided, operating in an almost equally partisan local media environment. The ruling Democratic Progressive party is accused by China of being secessionist and by critics of exacerbating tensions by courting global support.

The nationalist Kuomintang (KMT), the main opposition party, has an ageing base and is struggling to regain popularity while staying true to its roots. It has not been helped by a faction that Dafydd Fell, director of the Centre of Taiwan Studies at Soas University of London, said is “taking quite a strong pro-unification line”.

They are also being outflanked by fringe pro-unification parties, including some linked to the Bamboo Union alleged crime syndicate.

These fringe groups, often seen protesting or harassing pro-Taiwan delegates and events, have “disproportionate” airtime considering their almost non-existent vote, but they know how to mobilise, and some are mysteriously well-funded, says Fell. Pro-unification people are generally thought to be concentrated among older generations, are probably KMT voters and are typically men. Chiang said there are still some young proponents, including a Chinese nationalist minority, but they are often just “defeatist” and believe Taiwan would lose a conflict and should cut its losses now.

Fell outlines other influences on unification supporters, including rising nationalism and CCP propaganda and disinformation. Some supporters are driven by cynicism about divisive Taiwanese party politics and are nostalgic for the strong leadership of the CCP or martial law.There are those who have benefited economically from closer ties with China, and who “are just trying to stay out of politics … and find that kind of PRC nationalism quite annoying”, while some have spent decades in China, the US and Taiwan, and have decided they support and trust the CCP.

Chen is at the more hardline end. He said life for everyone would be better if Taiwan just accepted it was a Chinese province and its democratic government peacefully accepted the benefits of China’s economic strength and global power. “What normal people want in life is good living, peace and happiness,” he said. “People who want independence, that’s bullshit – they’re lying to themselves.”

He spoke of a stability in Taiwan that has disappeared since the 1980s democratisation. He cited the decline of the US, the growing wealth divide and Boris Johnson generally as evidence that western democracy does not work.

Many other factors and variations are also at the Taipei restaurant table. All five men identify as Chinese and believe Taiwan is part of China, citing history, ethnicity, culture and language. Two men, including Chen, are ardent supporters of Xi and the CCP. They welcome a takeover and believe life will be better for all, so Taiwan’s government should just accept it. Another said he would support unification under the CCP but not while Xi is leader, and is very worried about a Chinese invasion. Another wants unification but not under the CCP, while the fifth doesn’t think much of any option but hates the DPP most of all.

Perhaps for this group of friends, the term “pro-unification” is not as accurate as “anti-independence”.

Xi has pledged to annex Taiwan, and the white paper said this could not be left to future generations. Taiwan’s resistance is growing, as is international support for its plight and what annexation might mean for the region. The easiest option is to maintain the status quo, but for everyone at the Taipei dinner table, the idea that Beijing could ever just decide to back off and let Taiwan be is unfathomable. “Impossible,” Chen said. “This is the mission of the Chinese. Why would they change?” https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/28/we-are-chinese-meet-the-taiwanese-who-want-to-embrace-beijing-rule
KMT does have a parallel representative party within mainland China, the CCP recognizes the nationalists as a legitimate approved minor party-many CCP founding Marxists were indeed KMT members. If Taiwanese branch can come to terms with that party and unify, then a one state two systems arrangement would be possible regarding Taiwan. The US CIA infiltrated puppet regime comprising the DPP needs to fuck off.

Russia has never been able to project colonial […]

Russia-Ukraine War 2022

What kid gloves? We've transmitted weakness for […]

So, basically what I said then. How can we asse[…]

Modern Anarchism

He used to moderate this very forum! You wouldn't […]