[wat0n]

In every asymmetric war civilians will be used as human shields. The question is how the attacker deals with it.

Russia could gas an entire city and ingliz would blame Ukraine because it put soldiers in that city. Fuck that retarded weasel.

This thread is about Russian soldiers raping and torturing.

And when NATO or Israel do much less, people like @ingliz or organizations like Amnesty show up and pretend to be human rights defenders - ignoring the asymmetric nature of the war.

[ingliz]

The question is how the attacker deals with it.

In Iraq, America dealt with it by killing anything that moved. 87% of the total casualties, civilians; more children than soldiers dead.

[late]

Still nonsense.

Arab Israelis

Israel permanently rejected the idea of making all Arabs citizens. It's a religious state, and that is basically a guarantee there will be sectarian conflict. Watch what they do, not what they say.

They also have a problem with racism, non-Arab Israelis have it tough, despite being Jews, they are the 'wrong' color...

[wat0n]

Israel permanently rejected the idea of making all Arabs citizens. It's a religious state, and that is basically a guarantee there will be sectarian conflict. Watch what they do, not what they say.

They also have a problem with racism, non-Arab Israelis have it tough, despite being Jews, they are the 'wrong' color...

What the Israelis do, is to give their citizens full civil rights regardless of their ethnicity or race. And a fifth of the country's population are Israeli Arab citizens.

I also don't care about lessons about racism from a racist like yourself. It is you who wants to do away with equal protection under the law in the US, like the other racist CRT supporters and the KKK. It is you, not me, who supports official discrimination based on race as advocated by CRT scholars.

[late]

What the Israelis do, is to give their citizens full civil rights regardless of their ethnicity or race.

You are carefully dodging the obvious, that millions are not citizens, and are essentially prisoners in the apartheid, and subject to all manner of discrimination and attack.

As I pointed out, Israel has permanently rejected making them citizens. There are other options, such as a protectorate, but that would restrict Israel from doing what it does constantly.

But that, as you know, is not enough, they continue to take land.

[Skynet]

In Iraq, America dealt with it by killing anything that moved. 87% of the total casualties, civilians; more children than soldiers dead.

Since WW2 die about 90% civilians, this is the nature of moderne warfare.

[wat0n]

You are carefully dodging the obvious, that millions are not citizens, and are essentially prisoners in the apartheid, and subject to all manner of discrimination and attack.

As I pointed out, Israel has permanently rejected making them citizens. There are other options, such as a protectorate, but that would restrict Israel from doing what it does constantly.

But that, as you know, is not enough, they continue to take land.

They don't want to be Israeli citizens either. I thought you supported Palestinian self-determination.

[late]

They don't want to be Israeli citizens either. I thought you supported Palestinian self-determination.

They've never had the option.

They never will.

Frankly, they would take any deal that gets the hobnail boot off their neck. But they will never get any of the middle ground options as a choice, either.

Only way this ends is ugly.

[wat0n]

They've never had the option.

They never will.

Frankly, they would take any deal that gets the hobnail boot off their neck. But they will never get any of the middle ground options as a choice, either.

Only way this ends is ugly.

No, the Palestinians would not take "any deals". We know that because the moderates have rejected final status deals, and the hardliners don't even negotiate.

I thought you cared about facts.

[late]

No, the Palestinians would not take "any deals". We know that because the moderates have rejected final status deals, and the hardliners don't even negotiate.

I thought you cared about facts.

That was a long time ago. Since then Israel has gotten a lot better at screwing over Palestinians...

If you cared about the facts, you wouldn't spend your time dodging them..

[wat0n]

That was a long time ago. Since then Israel has gotten a lot better at screwing over Palestinians...

If you cared about the facts, you wouldn't spend your time dodging them..

So where's the Palestinian offer? If they'd take anything, then they can make an offer... Right?

The Israeli PM reiterated his willingness to reach an agreement this past week, so the Palestinians can perfectly take the initiative.

[late]

The Israeli PM reiterated his willingness to reach an agreement this past week, so the Palestinians can perfectly take the initiative.

So now we've gotten tired of dodging the obvious and are plunging into hallucination?

Israel holds all the cards, they could have settled this a long time ago. But any time a PM gets serious, he gets taken off the table, dead or in a coma...

[Skynet]

The Israeli PM reiterated his willingness to reach an agreement this past week, so the Palestinians can perfectly take the initiative.

This is true therefore I wrote a E-mail to the Hamas

https://hamas.ps/en

[wat0n]

So now we've gotten tired of dodging the obvious and are plunging into hallucination?

Israel holds all the cards, they could have settled this a long time ago. But any time a PM gets serious, he gets taken off the table, dead or in a coma...

Clearly, the Israelis don't hold all the cards given the Palestinians have rejected offers in the past.

I don't see how can the PA deal with Hamas and other similar groups. And Hamas doesn't want to discuss any final status issues, at all, in fact it doesn't even want to discuss a joint position with the PA to deal with Israel as an unified force.

At least with regards to Russia and Ukraine, we know it's a matter of getting both governments to talk, once it's clear no further major gains can be achieved by either side. A realization that both governments may take several years to arrive to.

[late]

Clearly, the Israelis don't hold all the cards

the Palestinians have rejected offers in the past.



At least with regards to Russia and Ukraine, we know it's a matter of getting both governments to talk, once it's clear no further major gains can be achieved by either side. A realization that both governments may take several years to arrive to.

They hold all the cards worth a damn.

If Israel wanted a deal, they could get one. They don't want one, and they are willing to kill anyone that tries to make one.

The war in Ukraine ends when one of the governments collapses. Neither side could keep this up for several years. On paper Russia has more resources to draw on, but winter is going to be ugly, I hope we've started sending them winter clothing. Ukraine will have to press it's advantage while it still has one.

[Skynet]

You can smoke the PA they have no support in the population. Hamas is the government of Gaza.

Islamic Jihad will be an obstacle to peace.

[wat0n]

They hold all the cards worth a damn.

No, they don't. Israel doesn't control Hamas and, of it attempted to invade Gaza to destroy the organization, you'd be among the first ones to whine about it once the civilian casualties begin.

If Israel wanted a deal, they could get one. They don't want one, and they are willing to kill anyone that tries to make one.

Israeli offers disprove this. Hamas doesn't even negotiate, and the PA can't really deliver.

The war in Ukraine ends when one of the governments collapses. Neither side could keep this up for several years. On paper Russia has more resources to draw on, but winter is going to be ugly, I hope we've started sending them winter clothing. Ukraine will have to press it's advantage while it still has one.

The war can perfectly end, without any final status deal, when both governments decide no further gains can be made. It's basically what happened after Russia invaded Crimea and the Donbass in 2014.

We'll know the war might be reaching that point if offensives and counteroffensives fail to make any significant progress after several months and their "achievement" is to just leave ground meat, despite the mass mobilizations. We're not there yet, and probably won't be for a while, and once we are then we'll have to wait to see how long will each of them take to realize they won't be making any further gains (a process that can take years).

In the meantime, yes, both economies will suffer yet this has never been a major reason to stop a major war on its own.

[Rugoz]

In Iraq, America dealt with it by killing anything that moved.

Whataboutism and bullshit on top. Fuck off to Moscow.

[ingliz]

bullshit

If the Americans were targetting the military and not bombing indiscriminately, how come 87% of casualties were civilians?

[Rancid]

And when NATO or Israel do much less, people like @ingliz or organizations like Amnesty show up and pretend to be human rights defenders - ignoring the asymmetric nature of the war.

This is standard practice for weasels on pofo.