DT: "Brexit revolt against establishment has only just begun" - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

Talk about what you've seen in the news today.

Moderator: PoFo Today's News Mods

#15269183
3 deals later & these Tory muppets are still fighting the Brexit wars. After all what else can they do? They have destroyed the country so they will either blame refugees, the UN, the EU, the ECHR or the "establishment". They have no other proposition to offer for the worst-performing country in the G7. Inflation spiked again when everywhere else is going down, in the UK it is increasing further.

Right, so after the 3rd revision of the Brexit deal, this last iteration is still not good enough apparently, despite the fact that the US is passing a bill through the Senate that makes an FTA contingent to keeping the GFA and consequently the Brexit deal intact. The ECHR is also baked into it because the EU has openly said that leaving the ECHR is a deal-breaker. Tory right-whingers want to leave the ECHR so they can proceed with the Rwanda plan to permanently remove all refugees from British soil. All 70k of them that arrived in the past 5 years. Because that is precisely what will solve British problems combined with hard-core anti-Europeanism.

Telegraph wrote:For one fleeting moment, the old Boris was back, even though it didn’t last long. By voting against Rishi Sunak’s Windsor Framework, Johnson’s message was clear: the Tories can never again be the party of the technocrats, the bureaucrats and the Eurocrats.

The historic democratic realignment he fronted in 2016 and 2019 may be in abeyance, battered and bludgeoned by partygate, generalised incompetence and the return of failed establishment Toryism, but it hasn’t disappeared. Below the surface, the vital forces Johnson tapped into are bubbling as strongly as ever, desperate for a new hero to empower the disgruntled majority.

The divide in British politics – and in the rest of the developed world – has, if anything, widened. The first camp believes in the top-down rule of experts, social engineers, lawyers, economists and philosopher-kings, empowered to construct, enforce and impose a “better”, more “rational” world; the second camp believes that power flows upwards, that we should listen to and respect the values, voices and opinions of ordinary people of all ethnicities and creeds who play by the rules, work hard, love their country and seek to improve their families’ lives.

The Tories must once again be the voice of this second group, or they are finished. They must be not just Eurosceptic, but also sceptical of net zero (and supportive of technological solutions to environmental problems), anti-European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR), anti-woke, pro-economic growth for all, and pro the creation of independent yeoman-citizens who stand on their own two feet, own their own homes and are able to accumulate financial wealth.

Johnson’s fatal error – the real, substantive case against him – was that he was the first Tory leader since Lady Thatcher to stand against declinism and domestic and international technocracy and yet ended up being defeated by all three. He increased tax and spending, didn’t deregulate, couldn’t tackle the housing crisis, tolerated woke extremism and failed to smash the obsolete Northcote-Trevelyan Civil Service when he had the opportunity after his election victory and then again after the state imploded during Covid.

He signed up to green supranationalism, international corporate tax harmonisation and a war on the suburban, consumerist lifestyle. He went against his Swedish instincts on Covid for too long. He performed a miracle to leave the EU in the legal sense but then botched it, delivering an underwhelming, business-as-usual Brexit. His base was bitterly disappointed at the lack of visible change; combined with partygate and the Tories’ poor performance in other areas, it is no wonder polls show slumping support for leaving the EU.

Intelligent, principled Eurosceptics can honestly differ on whether Sunak’s Windsor Framework is a net good or bad, especially given the present state of public opinion. The original Northern Ireland Protocol was a classic “unequal treaty” but also a necessary evil, in the sense that Theresa May’s calamitous surrender to the EU, and Brussels’s self-destructive negotiating inertia, meant that by the time he finally seized power it was too late for Johnson’s government to turn the negotiating clock back to the morning of June 24 2016. The cost of no deal was too great. It was necessary to back Johnson’s agreement to ensure the cleanest possible Brexit while preparing to rapidly restart renegotiations.

Sunak’s deal improves matters in several areas. There will be reduced checks for certain goods sent from Great Britain across the Irish Sea and destined solely for Northern Ireland; there will be significant ameliorations to the VAT and excise duty regime and on allowing UK-authorised medicines into Northern Ireland. It demonstrates that much of the nonsense spouted by the British Remainer elite was absurd, untrue and insulting.

The EU will accept “green lanes’’ and the (obvious) principle that the single market isn’t automatically “placed at risk” in the absence of extreme border checks or bans on medicines. It was despicable that they didn’t agree to this from the start, and all the “experts” who rationalised the EU’s immoral behaviour should hang their heads in shame.

Yet Sunak also massively oversold his agreement. The document in which he gives his version of what has been achieved is almost unrecognisable to the EU’s own explanation. His claim that 1,700 pages of EU law are “disapplied” is false. The Windsor Framework’s changes to the Protocol are cosmetic: the EU has made a series of practical concessions to alleviate certain, narrowly defined problems, but these can be withdrawn at any time.

The incentives remain – or, paradoxically, might even have been increased – for the UK as a whole not to diverge from EU rules. As Martin Howe KC and Barnabas Reynolds point out in their “star chamber” report for the ERG, any UK deregulation might lead to the immediate imposition of fresh checks, necessitating a new negotiation. They also argue convincingly that the Stormont brake, meant to empower the Northern Ireland assembly, is “practically useless”. Perhaps the biggest problem is the way this deal is being presented by establishment Tories as the final thing, a means to put Brexit behind us and to start tying closer links with Brussels.

On balance, therefore, the 22 Tory heroes were right to vote against this deal, as was the DUP. It was vital to put down a marker. Sunak’s Commons majority is a mere tactical win that won’t actually help his longer-term strategy or allow power-sharing to return to Northern Ireland. He hoped the Windsor Framework, by smoothing relations with the EU, would help his plan to tackle small boat crossings, a far more important priority to him than finalising Brexit. But it is hard to see how this works without the UK pulling out of the ECHR, triggering an all-out bust-up with the EU, cancelling Windsor and forcing another, nastier renegotiation of our relationship with Brussels.

The future of the Tory party is on the radical centre-Right. To win next year, Sunak must fix immigration (and much else besides); if he fails, the next Tory leader will be chosen by the party membership and will be a Brexiteer, anti-ECHR and anti-woke. Partygate’s ludicrous shenanigans may or may not finish off Johnson’s political career, but it won’t destroy his entire legacy. The next Tory PM will have to be more of a Johnsonite than Boris ever was.


Comments before they get deleted as usual:


Nick Matheson
1 HR AGO
Message Actions
The Tories believe that only narcissist and entitled little English brats deserve a voice.
Even they have been lost by throwing the living standards of this country to the dogs for pure posturing , bluster and divisive politics.
It's no longer cheap to be a Euro-hating have-my-cake-and-eat-it-too, it costs real money, in real pockets.
The more people realise that this is no longer a world-beating top economy but a failed state in managed decline the more they will calculate the obvious.
No industry, no manufacturing, and even British specialties like trade and banking have fallen behind and now lag European centres like Holland and France.
Productivity and the roads are worse than eastern Europe and the life-science sector is picking up its bags and leaving for Ireland with Astrazeneca building its manufacturing super plant in Ireland instead.
Ireland has 3 times the GDP per capita of Britain.
There is absolutely nothing that Britain excels at anymore, it's not even making world-beating films or music anymore despite the substantial linguistic advantage.
Beating a dead horse, will not get anyone elected this time but you are clearly ready to support this effort Allister, after all do you really have anything better to do?

Minestrone Baxter
1 HR AGO
Reply to Nick Matheson
Sick Nick loves a loser.

Don Murray
1 HR AGO
Reply to Nick Matheson - view message
Cheer up Nick. You seem to have the world beating talking your country down based on little more than having a paddy about Brexit and the Tories thing mastered! Every cloud….




Roger Thrush
17 MIN AGO
The Tories are already finished, they have proved to the electorate that they can’t be trusted. They have torn our trust into little shreds and incinerated them.
They will not garner enough support now or in 2024.
The rest of the article is correct. Right-minded people (double meaning) are seething and are desperate for politicians to hear them, listen and act accordingly. It hasn’t happened yet, we still await Brexit, we await reforms, we await border control and expulsions by the tens of thousands, we await small, low tax government, we await the purge on nonsensical wokeness, the Blob, universities and British Broadcasting Corporation bias, postal voting, failure of every regulator, and on and on.
There is a vacuum to be filled by a titan new party of the right - voters cling to the hope that such will emerge, it’s currently not to be seen, but whatever else happens that can no longer be the Conservative Party, it is not trusted enough now and is unlikely to ever be again.
Richie’s gaslighting efforts on NI prove the electorate is right to withhold trust, just another in a long list of failures that were so avoidable with guts.


Nick Matheson
12 MIN AGO
Reply to Roger Thrush - view message

Right-whinging people cheered Farage's single market Sweden option but hated May's deal that was the same, then cheered BoJo's deal, then they hated BoJo's deal and cheered new imaginary deal by BoJo, then they cheered Sunak's Windsor deal, now they hate Sunak's deal.
When these right-whinging people find another pastime other than whining for the pathetic little princesses they are, maybe the rest of the country might start taking them seriously again.
For now, zero credibility.
Just give these muppets, no deal, turn this country into pariah and let us all drown.
We will have a revolution and things will be done.
#15269189
noemon wrote:3 deals later & these Tory muppets are still fighting the Brexit wars. After all what else can they do? They have destroyed the country so they will either blame refugees, the UN, the EU, the ECHR or the "establishment". They have no other proposition to offer for the worst-performing country in the G7. Inflation spiked again when everywhere else is going down, in the UK it is increasing further.

Right, so after the 3rd revision of the Brexit deal, this last iteration is still not good enough apparently, despite the fact that the US is passing a bill through the Senate that makes an FTA contingent to keeping the GFA and consequently the Brexit deal intact. The ECHR is also baked into it because the EU has openly said that leaving the ECHR is a deal-breaker. Tory right-whingers want to leave the ECHR so they can proceed with the Rwanda plan to permanently remove all refugees from British soil. All 70k of them that arrived in the past 5 years. Because that is precisely what will solve British problems combined with hard-core anti-Europeanism.

Comments before they get deleted as usual:


How is removing 70k Rwandans from England going to help the UK economically Noemon?

What is the average birth rate for English families by the way?

Don't you need more workers working in order to pay taxes to the UK?
#15269214
Tainari88 wrote:How is removing 70k Rwandans from England going to help the UK economically Noemon?

What is the average birth rate for English families by the way?

Don't you need more workers working in order to pay taxes to the UK?


¯|_(ツ)_/¯
#15269249
Tainari88 wrote:How is removing 70k Rwandans from England going to help the UK economically Noemon?

What is the average birth rate for English families by the way?

Don't you need more workers working in order to pay taxes to the UK?


This is a good question, as 70k is only a drop in the bucket population-wise.

Another more relevant question would be "Is the UK over-populated?"

Like, could it feed its current population if trade collapses?

I think the answer is *definitely not*, and this was never a problem with it controlled half the world through usury and militarism.
#15269290
noemon wrote:3 deals later & these Tory muppets are still fighting the Brexit wars. After all what else can they do? They have destroyed the country so they will either blame refugees, the UN, the EU, the ECHR or the "establishment". They have no other proposition to offer for the worst-performing country in the G7. Inflation spiked again when everywhere else is going down, in the UK it is increasing further.

Right, so after the 3rd revision of the Brexit deal, this last iteration is still not good enough apparently, despite the fact that the US is passing a bill through the Senate that makes an FTA contingent to keeping the GFA and consequently the Brexit deal intact. The ECHR is also baked into it because the EU has openly said that leaving the ECHR is a deal-breaker. Tory right-whingers want to leave the ECHR so they can proceed with the Rwanda plan to permanently remove all refugees from British soil. All 70k of them that arrived in the past 5 years. Because that is precisely what will solve British problems combined with hard-core anti-Europeanism.



Comments before they get deleted as usual:


There is no way to make a Brexit deal that would be better than membership. So all the remakes of the deal are pointless at its core.

Confessions extracted under torture...seems legit.[…]

^ Wouldn't happen though, since the Israelis are n[…]

I was actually unaware :lol: Before he was […]

Israel-Palestinian War 2023

Every accusation is a confession Why sexual v[…]