Columbia faculty members walk out after pro-Palestinian protesters arrested - Page 5 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15313352
Unthinking Majority wrote:I'm going to pitch a tent on your lawn and harass you verbally and physically based on your ethnicity and sometimes physically block you and your family from entering your house. I expect you won't call the police. Then I'll call myself a victim if you do.


Since you are a white person in Canada, you are already essentially doing just that on Indigenous land.

Much like Israeli settlements on Palestinian land.

And yet this is ignored while tents are A Big Deal.
#15313388
Pants-of-dog wrote:Since you are a white person in Canada, you are already essentially doing just that on Indigenous land.

Much like Israeli settlements on Palestinian land.

And yet this is ignored while tents are A Big Deal.

This is whattaboutism so we can throw away this argument.

What does my race have to do with anything? LOL. You live in Canada too, so whatever you accuse me of you're equally guilty of, with the addition of you being a hypocrite about it all, and also a blatant racist for trying to blame me for some "racial group crime" because of my skin colour. :roll:

I 100% disagree with the Israeli settlements in the West Bank since they are clearly against international law. The Canadian and US governments also disagree with them and don't legally recognize post-1967 borders. But this illegal action doesn't mean jihadists are justified in targeting civilians to murder on Oct 7 (if they had attacked military targets then that would be justified), or that protestors are able to break a whole bunch of laws on US campuses, like ethnic harassment/intimidation, physically blocking access to people based on ethnicity, and other crimes. But you seem only interested about the tents while ignoring all the other racially based crimes.

If Israeli students were doing that to Arab/Muslim students you'd be the first to complain, so again you're a hypocrite. Unlike you I don't support illegal activity just because I agree with the politics of those committing the crimes. For instance, even though I agreed with the spirit of the anti-mandate protests by the Ottawa trucker convoy, I very much disagreed with the protestors illegally parking and occupying parts of the Ottawa downtown core and harassing locals with their horns etc and thought they should have been arrested, removed, and fined. Because when protestors break laws and won't stop and won't leave, they need to be arrested and removed. It's very simple.
#15313391
Unthinking Majority wrote:This is whattaboutism so we can throw away this argument.


It is not an argument.

You suggested that I was somehow hypocritical because I would not personally condemn trespassing and harassment.

I then pointed out that anyone supporting settler colonialism (including anyone who supports Canada or Israel in their current incarnations) would also be somehow hypocritical because they would not personally condemn the trespassing and harassment their societies carry out.

What does my race have to do with anything? LOL. You live in Canada too, so whatever you accuse me of you're equally guilty of, with the addition of you being a hypocrite about it all, and also a blatant racist for trying to blame me for some "racial group crime" because of my skin colour. :roll:


Your race is just as important as my personal views on trespassing and harassment, which you brought up.

I 100% disagree with the Israeli settlements in the West Bank since they are clearly against international law. The Canadian and US governments also disagree with them and don't legally recognize post-1967 borders.


No.

The US and Canada say they oppose them, then provide the IDF with the support they need to defend those settlements. Politicians do not always speak the truth. Actions speak louder than words.

But this illegal action doesn't mean jihadists are justified in targeting civilians to murder on Oct 7 (if they had attacked military targets then that would be justified), or that protestors are able to break a whole bunch of laws on US campuses, like ethnic harassment/intimidation, physically blocking access to people based on ethnicity, and other crimes. But you seem only interested about the tents while ignoring all the other racially based crimes.


Who cares what I think is important?

This is like some weird sort of therapy when you spend all your time talking about what you think my feelings are.

What gives universities the right to invest in regimes that conduct human rights abuses? What justifies that?

If Israeli students were doing that to Arab/Muslim students you'd be the first to complain, so again you're a hypocrite. Unlike you I don't support illegal activity just because I agree with the politics of those committing the crimes. For instance, even though I agreed with the spirit of the anti-mandate protests by the Ottawa trucker convoy, I very much disagreed with the protestors illegally parking and occupying parts of the Ottawa downtown core and harassing locals with their horns etc and thought they should have been arrested, removed, and fined. Because when protestors break laws and won't stop and won't leave, they need to be arrested and removed. It's very simple.


This seems like a contrast between your feelings and what you imagine my feelings are.
#15313401
Pants-of-dog wrote:In Canada, Indigenous people have been harassed right off their land.

This, like in Israel, is the basis for all land claims by the state.

It is literally impossible to have land ownership in these countries without such harassment.

It seems you very much don't like ethnic harassment and intimidation, which is good, and we can agree on that. However, you keep only talking about pro-Palestinian protestors putting up tents, and have thus far completely ignored the harassment and intimidation of Jewish students. You either care about racist harassment or you don't. Picking and choosing which racist harassment to support based on the ethnicity of the victim is racist.
#15313424
Unthinking Majority wrote:It seems you very much don't like ethnic harassment and intimidation, which is good, and we can agree on that. However, you keep only talking about pro-Palestinian protestors putting up tents, and have thus far completely ignored the harassment and intimidation of Jewish students. You either care about racist harassment or you don't. Picking and choosing which racist harassment to support based on the ethnicity of the victim is racist.


Again, this is not some sort of weird therapy where you talk about what you imagine my feelings are.

Rather than focusing on your ideas about my (irrelevant) opinions, we can look at some factual differences between those opposed to the war and those defending the current conflict.

The ones protesting the war are being arrested. The ones defending it are not.
The ones protesting the war do not have financial influence over PSE institutions. The ones defending it do have this influence.
The ones protesting the war are challenging the existing system where universities financially benefit from investing in abusive regimes. The ones defending the war want everything to stay the same.

These all seem to indicate that the ones defending the war have most of the power and wealth in this debate.

Which is why they get to frame the debate about “tents” instead of their investment in regimes that commit human rights abuses.
#15313427
The ones protesting the war are disrupting regular university operations and harassing other students, in some cases based on their perceived Jewishness, and that alone justifies clearing the whole protest.

It seems this does not matter, there's a pecking order on harassment since for people like @Pants-of-dog it's about "who" and not "what". Even when it comes to financial regimes, students do not demand schools to refuse taking funding from countries with poor human rights records like Qatar or Saudi Arabia (not that they have any right to decide on this).
#15313428
Pants-of-dog wrote:
Again, this is not some sort of weird therapy where you talk about what you imagine my feelings are.

Rather than focusing on your ideas about my (irrelevant) opinions, we can look at some factual differences between those opposed to the war and those defending the current conflict.

The ones protesting the war are being arrested. The ones defending it are not.
The ones protesting the war do not have financial influence over PSE institutions. The ones defending it do have this influence.
The ones protesting the war are challenging the existing system where universities financially benefit from investing in abusive regimes. The ones defending the war want everything to stay the same.

These all seem to indicate that the ones defending the war have most of the power and wealth in this debate.

Which is why they get to frame the debate about “tents” instead of their investment in regimes that commit human rights abuses.



"Nothing changes, until it does."
#15313448
Here are some of the the latest reports of students and other protesters being arrested and maligned . And I still see that the same old canard of anti-Semitism is being levied . Only I feel that now increasingly the public is seeing through it . We all realize that it's a rhetorical trick that the Zionist regime uses to both load the language and constrict freedom of speech , and of thought . Now if anything , I anticipate that people will if anything be ever more inclined to say that if this is what it is to be a Jew , and it isn't , then the Jews are now getting their comeuppance . And if this be anti-Semitism , which it isn't , then to be anti-Jew is to be pro-human . So this tactic by the ADL , AIPAC , and all of their political cronies , shall backfire big time . For even when actual anti-Semitism is committed in the future , it will not be taken quite so seriously , given how many times self anointed spokespeople for the Jewish community have cried wolf up till now . And furthermore , to quote Tariq Ali , those dissident demonstrators whom are getting tarred as being anti-Semites will then be wont to say "Okay , if this is what it means to be an anti-Semite , then I shall be one ". And then there actually will be an increase in people aligning themselves with neo-Nazi organizations , at least as part of some sort of "Querfront" common cause coalition.











#15313484
These protests are beautiful. And again..the kids are alright.

Pants-of-dog wrote:The interesting thing about the police repression is that the arrests are spawning new protests in other cities.


Not just Yankee cities, but also France and Australia. :excited:

Saeko wrote:She's back. :D



This story cracked me up. :lol:





Deutschmania wrote:So , in spite of what @wat0n might have us believe , not all Jews are backing Israel , and some have even faced violence while standing in opposition , within Israel itself .


I would wager many more Jews in the US oppose Israel than support it. It was evident to me when protesting with Jewish orgs against AIPAC in D.C. over a decade ago, and since, so many more antizionist Jewish groups have cropped up.

Also, wat0n attempting to sell the idea that all Jews are genocidal Zionists is antisemitic itself, but he always gets a free pass for that, as if Jews themselves can't be antisemitic when wat0n very obviously is, and that includes his antisemitism towards Palestinians who are a semitic people.

Deutschmania wrote:And I still see that the same old canard of anti-Semitism is being levied . Only I feel that now increasingly the public is seeing through it .


It's all Zionists have to distract from stuff like these protests, the 200+ day escalation of the Palestinian genocide or, basically, any criticism of Israel. wat0n thinks if he says "antisemitism!" over and over again it'll get people to shut up about the crimes of the genocidal state he is here trying to defend, poorly, I might add. Too bad the live-streamed murder of thousands of children in six months is a little more effective on what people think and say, over accusations of racism by those who defend an ethnosupremacist, apartheid state.

You've got to give it to wat0n though, for still trying. :D
#15313506
The more time passes, the more instances of harassment of other students and sometimes the press that appear.

Case in point, nativist nonsense against Jewish students at Columbia:



And as it stands now, 43% of Americans support/strongly support and 35% oppose/strongly oppose denying refugee status to Gazans and deporting international students participating in the protest.
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