Elizabeth Warren might destroy Trump. - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Polls on politics, news, current affairs and history.

Will Warren win the democratic nomination and the beat Trump?

She will not get the nomination
10
36%
She will get the nomination and loose to Trump in the presidential race
8
29%
She will get the nomination and win against Trump in the presidential race
9
32%
Other(please specify)
1
4%
#15045968
Finfinder wrote:....and you were just biching calling out posters for not answering the question.


This looks like a non-sequitur to me. What are you getting at?
#15045986
Finfinder wrote:That is a falsehood she can not account for the spending she proposes. The math doesn't work and she refuses to explain it.


We will see. Europe somehow manages. I wouldn't mistrust Warren on the execution part though. I always thought that she had no chance in the first place to win the nomination.

As for the plan itself, it is what the people want as I said. Anything that will help the middle class will be a deal maker for the presidential election or at least what the middle class percieves to be in their best interest. Right now middle class is a bit radicalised because of what was going on since the 90s. Also she made moves to woe Bernie Sanders crowd which actually worked. I guess her hope is that she and Biden will be the last ones standing with her being able to go over the top of Biden by just simply getting more Sanders people.
#15045989
Finfinder wrote:
That is a falsehood she can not account for the spending she proposes. The math doesn't work and she refuses to explain it.



"Add all this up and Warren’s team projects national health expenditures of $52 trillion over 10 years — exactly what’s projected in the absence of single-payer. Therefore, Berwick and Johnson conclude, Warren’s proposal would “cover every single resident of the U.S. with much more generous coverage and virtually no cost-sharing at a total cost just under the amount the U.S. is currently set to spend on health care under our existing system.”



https://www.vox.com/2019/11/1/20942587/ ... -explained
#15045995
I don't think she'lly get the nomination. I'd like her to, or mayor Pete, but if Biden points out that no one has any international know-how he'll win.
#15046000
Finfinder wrote:There is no complaint in my post. Is your complaint I just don't take the Democrats word for it. I am simply asking for the math, it should be so easy to offer. Then again I have no idea how you can make the statement above the people did not want Obamacre the few that did screamed the loudest.


I actually did some reading on her plan which she released. The numbers seems to add up. Basically if you will continue with your current system then it will cost 52 trillion for 10 years anyways while her plan is 59 trillion in actuality. She plans to do changes to the system to drop down the cost of it to 52 trillion for 10 years. Some of the measures are understandable but some is kinda hard to understand. For example some changes to affordable care act payment structures which i have no clue about.

On the other hand she also proposes the following in the form of taxes:

- Warren proposes a financial transactions tax of 0.1 percent of the value of every stock, bond, or derivatives transaction. That raises $800 billion. Then she adds a “systemic risk fee” on financial institutions with more than $50 billion in assets. That’s another $100 billion. ( Redistribution from capital to workers basically.)

- Warren adds another $2.9 trillion in corporate taxes by ending accelerated cost recovery and imposing a 35 percent minimum tax on foreign earnings.
(This is essentially Banons plan to prevent outsourcing but masquarading as a measure to fund healthcare. This proposal is actually a VERY big deal. Basically will discourage outsourcing of American jobs overseas by American companies. Its not perfect but consider Banons and the like ideas or variations were killed on the spot by big business this might be one of the ways to pass it.)

- Prior to this plan, Warren’s wealth tax was 2 percent on assets over $50 million and 3 percent on assets over $1 billion. Sorry billionaires — now it’s 6 percent, which raises another $1 trillion. Warren also proposes taxing capital gains for the top 1 percent at the same rate as normal income, and doing so on an annual basis, rather than just when the sale is made. That raises $2 trillion. (Tax hike for the top 1%. Again redistribution from Capital to labour)

- Warren proposes a massive increase in IRS enforcement aimed at reducing the tax avoidance rate from 15 percent to 10 percent. If successful, this could raise $2.3 trillion. (JR note here, this is probably unrealistic because it requires additional legislature besides healthcare changes. Most of the "Tax avoidance" is tax optimisation which is legal. Its shady but legal. Theoretically doable but practically i am sceptical. As I said 1000 times before, this is a must measure but how successful it will be is hard to tell. I do not know if 2.3Trillion is cautious estimate or wishful thinking.)

- In literally two sentences, Warren proposes passing comprehensive immigration reform, which would lead to $400 billion in new taxable income over 10 years. I guess, technically, this would be a middle-class tax increase but not in the way anyone means. (Not sure what this is about. Making all current illegals legal i suppose? Not a good idea unless this also involves increasing border security in more forms. Basically this needs to be elaborated to be understood )

- She also gets rid of the Overseas Contingency Operations Fund, which is basically a temporary increase in defense spending that’s become permanent. You can read more about OCO funds here, but the bottom line is it saves $800 billion. ( Less military spending which will go for healthcare )

- Americans currently spend $3.7 trillion paying their share of employer-provided health insurance premiums. That money, left in their wallets, becomes taxable, adding $1.4 trillion. ( Basically some calculations for the middle class. 2.3 Trillion in middle class pocket while 1.4 will eventually land as taxes anyways. So besides healthcare, the American middle class and lower will get 2.3T/300kk = 7.6k additional dollars after all taxes. )
#15046016
Zionist Nationalist wrote:She is going against the top 1%,Powerful corporations,Military lobby
Good luck with that :lol:
My guess is that Democrats will bite their lips and will nominate senile Joe
this will decrease their chances of winning but money speaks louder
Image


Can somebody urgently contact the Warren campaign authorities and tell them to correct their financing proposal?
One trillion is thousand billion, not ten billion.
https://www.thoughtco.com/millions-bill ... ns-3126163
#15046020
Ter wrote:Can somebody urgently contact the Warren campaign authorities and tell them to correct their financing proposal?
One trillion is thousand billion, not ten billion.
https://www.thoughtco.com/millions-bill ... ns-3126163

That's a cnbc slide, warrens data has correct numbers.
#15046025
JohnRawls wrote:That's a cnbc slide, warrens data has correct numbers.


Thank you.
Americans tend to be very ignorant of sciences and geography.
You on the other hand are OK except you forgot a possessive apostrophe and an uppercase. :D
#15046102
Ter wrote:Thank you.
Americans tend to be very ignorant of sciences and geography.
You on the other hand are OK except you forgot a possessive apostrophe and an uppercase. :D


Yeah, yeah. So what do you think about Warren proposals on taxes and other changes. They are pretty much along your liking if we exclude the immigration reform of some sort which is unclear. I mean if she drops that then I can even see Banon supporting her plan.
#15046219
JohnRawls wrote:So what do you think about Warren proposals on taxes and other changes. They are pretty much along your liking if we exclude the immigration reform of some sort which is unclear.

I think all citizens should have medical insurance, compulsory.
Taxing the rich and especially the super rich is an excellent idea.
But I am weary of leftist democrats getting into power because of their stance on immigration.
And in the case of Warren, her stance on Israel is unacceptable.
#15046222
Ter wrote:I think all citizens should have medical insurance, compulsory.
Taxing the rich and especially the super rich is an excellent idea.
But I am weary of leftist democrats getting into power because of their stance on immigration.
And in the case of Warren, her stance on Israel is unacceptable.


Not sure about her position on Israel but usually such things don't matter. On average (85 to 90%) US citizens do not care about anything that happens outside of the US foreign relations wise. There is no correlation between foreign or trade policy and voting preference unless it has a direct effect on the inner issues in the US.

Is Warren even considered a leftist? I have no clue what to classify her though. I think that she is more of a centrist that has been battered by the great recession. Warren was one of the main architects behind post recession regulations on the big instituations. Big business/Big finance/Big banks managed to kill most legislature in that regard but not hers.
#15046285
She will get the nomination and loose to Trump in the presidential race

She will be nominated by the Democrats but she will lose because although the Democratic Party are moving more towards social democracy and social liberalism the American tendency is still too conservative. Most of her policies are still too radical for Americans and economic conditions have not deteriorated enough in the USA to allow for people to re-consider their positions. Trump will win the elections.
#15046381
Yeah Warren may be intelligent but she does not come across as political campaign street smart. I do not think she will win the nomination, and if she did I don't think she would win, against Trump. But we're a long way out. Though I agree with the general thrust of her policies and might like her to Win.
#15046383
JohnRawls wrote:With the current unexpected developments in the US, the chances are likely that Warren might be the democratic candidate. For all the information that i have heard about her (Non-news), she is considered one of the most smartest people in DC if not the smartest. She also revealed her medicare plan for all aka the biggest monetary redistribution program for the middle class from the corporations/top 0.1%. Average joes will love this (putting the propaganda aside). So do you think that she will get the candidacy and that she will beat Trump?

I don't think so.
#15046464
Don't forget, she also claimed to be native American, and even native Americans shunned that idea.

I can't wait for Trump to take on "Pochohantas" at the debates...

LOL!
#15046492
Finfinder wrote:She will get the nomination and loose to Trump in the presidential race


You never explained your comment above.

I'll put it here for your convenience

Finfinder wrote:....and you were just biching calling out posters for not answering the question.


What does people like you never actually answering a question have to do with me saying that all politicians need to be under a microscope?

The problem isn't that you don't answer questions. You could choose to simply note answer a question. However, the problem is that you quote the question like you are going to answer it, but then say some totally different stawman type of thing. I think yo do this, because you don't want to look like you are avoiding answer a question, but the reality is, you are.

Now, it's no surprise you appeared to be annoyed by this. Normally when you show someone the mirror and they don't like what they see, they get upset.
#15046494
Rancid wrote:You never explained your comment above.


What's to explain?

He thinks Warren will get the Democratic nomination will then lose the election.

What sort of explanation could you need?

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