Muslim women 'sterilised' in China detention camps, say former detainees - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15026126
Palmyrene wrote:It quite literally does. You can do whatever you want as long as you deal with the consequences of your actions.


anarchism does not guarantee that someone will not exploit the new "system" to take power IMO anarchism is very fragile and if it ever came true would not last long
Last edited by Zionist Nationalist on 13 Aug 2019 16:45, edited 1 time in total.
#15026127
Ter wrote:This is absolutely scandalous and on a much grander scale than what is happening in and around Israel, the Jewish Homeland. Therefore I urge all anti-sem, sorry all anti-Zionists to concentrate their protests against China.


The commie kids and many on the prog left don't oppose imperialism, internment or apartheid in principle, they're really just anti-western civilization. These people are a bad joke that are happy to look the other way on mass atrocities if the perpetrators are nominally on the left. Whoever throws up their gang signs gets a pass.
#15026132
Zionist Nationalist wrote:anarchism does not guarantee that someone will not exploit the new "system" to take power IMO anarchism is very fragile and if it ever came true would not last long


What is there to take power of? There is no hierarchy to rise up.

Anarchism is very resilient. There's a reason why guerrilla fighters continue fighting for decades while state militaries often fall apart easily.
Last edited by Palmyrene on 13 Aug 2019 16:48, edited 1 time in total.
#15026135
Zionist Nationalist wrote:Hierarchy is natural its part of the human nature and will come back sooner or later it cannot be suppressed forever


It isn't. The concept of hierarchy within animals has been horrifically mangled by capitalists and reactionaries. Yes, there are numerous species of animals that use dominance as a social tool but it's a complex topic that's altogether very different from the kind of, "hierarchy" we see in civilized society. Even then, you should have a thorough understanding of why they exist in species rather than just saying that they're a good unto themselves, some sort of panacea.

Dominance hierarchies exist within environments with relatively little resources to go around whether that's food or mates, cooperation is still necessary, but the aforementioned species doesn't have a better means of ensuring the survival of the group. Hierarchies work but working in a natural sense means that it allows the next generation to survive without tearing each other apart. Subordinates are able to avoid needless struggle and injury to the gene pool by respecting their, "superiors."

In terms of creating a society that best suits our, "nature" we have more options than dominance hierarchies. Yes, at one point humans were hierarchical. However, a crucial part of our development, the reason humans are able to so fluently exchange information in the symbolic realm, was overcoming the system of alphas-betas. Before this, hunter-gatherer hominids divided up food obtained as the result of a hunt, for example. These primates do as almost all primates do and let the alpha of the band eat his fill first.

After the alpha ate, the beta would eat his fill, and so on, one after another until the food was gone. This is similar to how it works among many dominance-oriented animals. Nonetheless, sometimes there wasn’t enough to go around. Sometimes the position of the alpha or beta would be contested by the group. If this happened, you had a fight on your hands. That is, a bloody brawl between potentially the whole band that might leave it fatally crippled with too few to go on the hunt next time, resulting in starvation and death.

In the long run, the species could survive despite this cycle of violence, but tell that to the ones who had their skull bashed in. This was enough of a problem at one point that it led to the origin of what we would consider to be, "human." In this event, the hunters were all hungrily sizing up the corpse, all of them knowing that they wanted it and would be willing to kill to have as much as it as possible. However, one of the hunters had an epiphany. Instead of viewing the carcass as merely an object of their want, they realized it as a symbolic object of collective want.

Behold, the first and perhaps the most persisting metaphysical concept on Earth. Of course, without a means of expressing that concept, it was essentially worthless.

Luckily for humanity, the meta-conscious hunter did have a way, the abortive gesture. This gesture signaled to the other members of the hungry band not to greedily reach for the food and start a fight. Instead of maiming and screaming to see who would get to eat, the band, as a result of the abortive gesture decided to share the food equally between them. This is objectively the best outcome for all involved. Some might say the alpha is, "cheated" out of the lion's share, but uneasy whose head wears the crown. but until now it wasn't available because none of them had the prerequisites to understand/implement it.

This is essentially how complex language as we understand it emerged. Language existed before but was limited to non-symbolic expressions. This also was essentially the birth of what we'd understand as religion, hunters with epiphanies would turn into shamans who would interpret other symbols besides piles of food. Marxists would call the resulting system, "primitive communism" which isn't totally inaccurate. The birth of civilized tyranny is when the role of the shaman was usurped and instead of dividing resources fairly, they divided them to benefit the desires of a minority. From there, things progressed along the goal of maximizing their gains while more effectively subordinating the majority.
#15026136
Palmyrene wrote:What was it sarcastic towards?

Sarcasm had direction. If you're just saying a random sentence it doesn't work.


Sure it does. But, in this case, it was directed towards the usual crop of liberal illuminati who frequent PoFo blaming Trump for everything under the sun...
#15026137
BigSteve wrote:Sure it does. But, in this case, it was directed towards the usual crop of liberal illuminati who frequent PoFo blaming Trump for everything under the sun...


It's still not sarcasm because sarcasm is a response. It requires someone to say something.

Saying some random statement complaining about something no one said isn't sarcasm.
#15026141
Palmyrene wrote:It's still not sarcasm because sarcasm is a response. It requires someone to say something.

Saying some random statement complaining about something no one said isn't sarcasm.


So, are you wrong all the time, or just here on PoFo?

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sarcasm
#15026172
This is not at all surprising when you consider how much and how long the Chinese government has been targeting the Uyghurs.

And they know will get away with it because no one will hold them accountable. Neither their own people nor any of the international communities.

If anything, they will get support.
#15026174
I used to think that news related to Uyghur peoples situation are all fake news and being spread by some stupid nationalist people. Because there were many news about this.

But i realize that China really wants those people to be wiped out. I saw some serious articles published by Amerikan think-tanks. Then i understand this is real.
#15026283
Unthinking Majority wrote:Well, we have a racist totalitarian regime that's rejected communist economics and acts as a brutal ethno-state committing genocide against ethnic minorities in order to "purify" the Chinese population.


I really wouldn't interpret it that way.

To me, it's more like they want to subsume the cultural identities and desires of nationhood into a greater Chinese model.

There are many Chinese who are aware that they are partly from some ethnic minority group. I actually spoke to a few who said something like they believe that their grandfather was an X, but they are not really sure, and they did not regard it as pertinent.

To be Han Chinese in China, the overwhelming majority of people just call themselves Han Chinese. I am guessing there would be issues for the Tibetans or Uighurs who may look physically different and already have very strong practices as cultural minorities, but an ethnic Yue person who simply starts calling themselves Han and speaks like a Han Chinese would never be called out on it.

"Han" is now supposed to be more like saying "American," and "Han" as an identity is not something that is meant to be exclusive to the other identities.

I am probably not explaining that well, and this is merely how I have understood it through conversation with Chinese people who do not have any ethnic consciousness or think much at all of ethnic minorities, but have stated that they may have some descent from ethnic minorities.

If someone else could clarify this more, it would be great. But suffice it to say, I do not believe there is any line about the Han being some pure blodo stock that has to rule over others by virtue of that. There is just the desire for all of them to be subsumed by a single modern Chinese identity.

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